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Tundra or Taiga Bean Goose Netherlands

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Old Tuesday 23rd January 2007, 07:14   #1
janha
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Tundra or Taiga Bean Goose Netherlands

Just across the border with Germany I took these photos of Bean Geese.
Are these Tundra or Taiga?
Please can you help me with the ID and explain how you came to your conclusion.

Thanks Jan

For more photos:

http://www.xs4all.nl/~hartogje/count...dra_taiga.html
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Old Tuesday 23rd January 2007, 09:15   #2
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Hi Jan,

I would be fairly confident in calling these Tundra Bean. They appear to be quite dumpy looking without the long necks and long bodies shown by Taiga. Taiga Bean have more 'behind the legs' and this gives them a distinctive 'John Wayne' swagger when they walk. Personally I think that Tundra Bean are darker looking, especially the head and neck.

Most Tundra Bean have less orange in the bill compared to Taiga but this is variable and cannot be relied upon for identification. Shot 6672/2 in the link above is perhaps the best shot for identifying these birds.

Are there any other geese with them?

Cheers,

Andy.
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Old Tuesday 23rd January 2007, 09:39   #3
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I was going to say that they looked like Taiga Beans to me - due mainly to the amount of orange on the bills of some individuals, the relatively pale heads and necks, and large appearance (they don't appear to look like Pink-feet in structure for instance). However, my experience of Taiga is limited, so I will await other peoples opinions.
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Old Tuesday 23rd January 2007, 09:52   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andrew lawson
Are there any other geese with them?

Andy.
This morning with Canadas-, Barnacles-, White fronts- and Egyptians( ) and Bewicks's Swans.
As far as I know of.
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Old Tuesday 23rd January 2007, 11:39   #5
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Hi,

Couple of links that may help. Note the size of Taiga compared to Greylag.

http://www.kentos.org.uk/Photographs/04TaigaBeanTL.htm

http://www.kentos.org.uk/Photographs/04TundraBean.htm

http://www.kentos.org.uk/Photographs...GooseDunge.htm

http://www.kentos.org.uk/Photographs...eBrookland.htm

Cheers,

Andy.
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Old Tuesday 23rd January 2007, 14:01   #6
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I think they are Tundra. Found a Taiga at Marshside last year, its long neck and wedge shaped head and bill was very striking when compared to the surrounding pink feet.
I wonder how common intergrades are?

Last edited by Steven Astley : Tuesday 23rd January 2007 at 14:04.
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Old Tuesday 23rd January 2007, 14:48   #7
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I would also call these at Tundra Bean Geese, due to head/bill structure (particularly the swollen base to the lower mandible). Also they do not seem particularly long-legged. Taiga on average are longer-legged birds.
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Old Tuesday 23rd January 2007, 15:22   #8
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Is it me or do Taiga's broadly remind others of Whoopers in structure?
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Old Tuesday 23rd January 2007, 16:03   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Smallwood
Is it me or do Taiga's broadly remind others of Whoopers in structure?
They are smaller and darker Rob

Seriously though, I guess the 'wedge of cheese' shaped head is reminiscent of Whooper Swan head structure!
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Old Wednesday 24th January 2007, 08:14   #10
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They are smaller and darker Rob
Doh - that's where I've been going wrong!
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Old Wednesday 24th January 2007, 09:45   #11
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If you needed an advert for BirdForum this thread is it, someone from Finland referring people from the UK & the Netherlands to guidance in Ireland!
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Old Wednesday 24th January 2007, 10:14   #12
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I live near the border with Germany and my local patch is a wetland, owing its status to BeanGeese and Cranes.
Yesterday morning my roostcount came to a total of 5620 Bean Geese; The bulk of them involved A. s.rossicus. This morning the whole lot flew at once and the only count I could get, came to 6700 birds.
Taiga Bean Geese A.f.fabalis visited the area in the past with maxima of 1500 birds. The last ten years they were replaced with A.s.rossicus.

Among these thousands we get some tens of fabalis still, the odd johanseni(rare) and middendorfi (very rare). A. serrirostris serrirostris is recorded in a few faliliegroups.

Though I do roost counts, my focus is not on these. I am a biker and birds are hard to approach when foraging. They dont smile at my beauty.

These Bean Geese are rossicus Tundra's. The orange bill still leaves my mind a bit perplex and pass it on.
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