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Vega Gull (1 Viewer)

Alan Manson

KwaZulu-Natal birder
Opus Editor
Discussion thread for Vega Gull. If you would like to add a comment, click the Post Reply button.

Larus vegae (East Siberian or Vega Gull) is recognised as a separate species by Clements 2007, but not by Dickinson 2003 (H&M) and Sibley & Monroe 1996.

Merge with European Herring Gull Larus argentatus?
 
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I think the BOU missive includes Vega Gull with American Herring Gull, Larus smithsonianus, so is this not a better option?

Steve
 
I think the BOU missive includes Vega Gull with American Herring Gull, Larus smithsonianus, so is this not a better option?

Steve

There is also an insufficient number of major checklists which have recognized Am Herring Gull for Opus to do so. This is not only a question of backlog: AOU recently voted against splitting this from the European one.

Niels
 
Thanks guys, it looks like we can safely retreat to the position of Sibley & Monroe 96 and Dickinson (H&M) 2003, and lump both smithsonius and vegae with argentatus using the common name Herring Gull.
 
Yes with one caveat: if there is enough information in each of them, then it can be possible to make sections for each of the forms, where each section is then named for the (sub) species. I think I remember Rasmus doing something like that, but don't remember for which species; something not quite so drastic was done in this entry http://www.birdforum.net/opus/Brant.

Niels
 
There is also an insufficient number of major checklists which have recognized Am Herring Gull for Opus to do so. This is not only a question of backlog: AOU recently voted against splitting this from the European one.

Niels

The major checklists were all published before American Herring Gull was split by the BOU (based of course on a thorough study of all the evidence) so that in itself is not a reason to ignore the 'species'

Niels - can you point me at a reference for the AOU voting not to split AHG? I would be interested to see how their interpretation differs from the BOU's.

Steve
 
The major checklists were all published before American Herring Gull was split by the BOU (based of course on a thorough study of all the evidence) so that in itself is not a reason to ignore the 'species'

Niels - can you point me at a reference for the AOU voting not to split AHG? I would be interested to see how their interpretation differs from the BOU's.

Steve

Here you are, Steve:

http://aou.org/committees/nacc/proposals/2007-B.pdf
http://aou.org/committees/nacc/proposals/2007_B_votes_web.php3
 
Here's an interesting quote from the Cornell Clements page:
...for species of North America, Middle America, and the Caribbean, our standard procedure will be to follow the AOU nomenclature to the letter.

Even this rule, however, has its exceptions. Clements differs from current AOU treatment in a few cases involving species or species complexes with natural ranges largely or entirely outside the AOU area. For example, European authorities assign different names for European Herring Gull, Vega Gull, and American Herring Gull (see Crochet et. al. 2002 and Liebers et. al 2004). Although such changes are not yet adopted by the AOU, we expect them to be shortly, and in these rare instances the Clements list occasionally will be ahead of the AOU.

The AOU's refuting of these proposals last year may cause Clements's treatment to be reevaluated in the upcoming "October update."
 
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