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Swarovski ELSV 12x50??? (1 Viewer)

Conndomat

Conndomat

United States of Europe
Europe
Hello colleagues,

There are many reports about the Swarovski ELSV 8x32 and 8.5 x42, about the highly praised 10x50 one can still find some, at 10x32 it is already scarce and about the 12x50 I find very little info!

So you ask in the round, who has looked at you or even owns it?
As it looks visually against the 10x50 (I know you can not compare 1:1) watching with and without glasses would also be interested in keeping everything that comes to you positive and negative about the 12x50...

I thank you ever,
Andreas
 
I have a new pair of the 12x50 Field Pros. They are very good, but without a tripod you will get tired fast. I usually use them for long range observing. I just had them in Wyoming on the Chief Joseph Highway and used them from the scenic overlooks. They have great eye relief and a great eye box making them very easy to use without eye strain.
 
Thank you...

Do you have comparisons to other El's and how high would you assess the center and edge sharpness?

Andreas
 
Conndomat said:
So you ask in the round, who has looked at you or even owns it?
As it looks visually against the 10x50 (I know you can not compare 1:1) watching with and without glasses would also be interested in keeping everything that comes to you positive and negative about the 12x50...
Click to expand...

Hello Andreas,
I've owned both the SV12X50 and 10X50, though I no longer have them, so this report will be from memory. The SV12X is an outstandingly good bino, in my opinion. Wide field, sharp to the edge, bright, flat field, very little distortion, minimal rolling ball effect. Very good eye relief for a 12X, very good ergonomics. Weight is about 1 Kg, and if you grip it with one hand near the oculars and the other hand on the diagonally opposite objective, I find you can hold it quite steady.
The 10X is equally good, just easier to hold.
I hope this helps.
John
 
Hi Andreas,

I actually have both the SV 10X50 and 12X50. I use the 12X50 WAY more. IMO there is not enough of a difference between the 10X42 SV and 10X50 SV out in the field to warrant the extra size and weight. Now consider the 10X50 and 12X50 are the same size and about the same weight AND the 12X50 has a more noticeable and appreciable difference in magnification so I use the 12X50 more. I frequently carry a lightweight 7X/8x and the 12X50 together. The 12X50 is also a great binocular to have with you in the car and a little extra magnification is needed to reach out at a distance in a field, tree, power line, etc.

A far a keeping it steady...I can still do a pretty good job hand held for a short time...usually plenty long enough to ID a bird. Frequently I lean against a tree, use a fencepost, or even sit down and brace on my knees.

I use mine both without and mostly WITH eyeglasses. I've had zero issues using it both ways. The focus adjustment is Swarovski's best which is very good. ER for me with glasses is certainly adequate, but nothing more. I know of no 12X50 that can better is in this area or I'd have it.

The SC 12X50 is about the same size as a Zeiss SF 8X42 AND weighs little more than many 8X42s. Ergonomics, about perfect.

What can I say, highest recommendation!
 

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Thank you John and Chuck, it was a great help for me!

I think it's a great glass, probably as good as the other El's.
I have the Swarovski 8,5x42 and here it would probably be more targeted to go at 12x, which is 10x from the magnification still very close.
Important for me also the information that it works well with glasses, so far I had at 12x binoculars because always have some problems.

Thanks,
Andreas
 
If you are wanting more mag for a cheaper price you could go for the SLC 15X56 if you have the 8.5X42.

Andy W.
 
Hi Andreas,

Like John and Chuck I also own both the SV 10x50 and 12x50. Both are outstanding binos, but if I had to choose one then it would be the 12x50. The 12x feels very well balanced in the hand and I can hold it quite steady. In normal use I cannot see RB in either but if I look for it then the 10x shows a bit of it whereas the view thru the 12x shows no RB at all. While the FOV of the 10x is larger (from memory 6.6* vs 5.7*), the AFOV of the 12x is in fact larger than that of the 10x. Usually I prefer the 10 power over 8x, and for me the pair (10x50, 12x50) is similar in many respects to having a pair (8x42, 10x42), which is why I bought both SVs 50mm.

Peter
 
Thanks Andy and Peter ...
The 15x56 would be a bit too big for me, especially since you can not get along without a tripod and still have an astro-glass in this area.

Yes, the 12x is certainly excellent, unfortunately not cheap, a lot of money for a poor man, maybe I should first sell one of my Ferrari's ...:smoke:

Andreas
 
Andreas,

I don't pretend I have the right solution for you, but if I were you I would consider selling your 8.5x (instead of your Ferrari...) and replacing it with the SV 10x50. The 10x is not much bigger and heavier than the 8.5x, and in fact it feels better in the hands: the 8.5 feels somehow more front heavy and also has less space between the barrels for your fingers. Also, the 42mm SVs have the most visible RB effect of all the SVs. In sum, if you can afford two SVs, keep the 8.5x and buy a 12x; but if you can afford only one then maybe the 10x50 would be the best compromise.

Peter
 
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Peter,

no, I like the 8, 5x42 very, Exchange is not an option!
When I sell the yellow and the black Ferrari, I buy the 12x, the red Ferrari still remains,:t: maybe I get the 10x50 still necessary.

RB effect is not an issue for me, I don't take it, I even have to focus on it to be able to see it at all.

Andreas
 
RB effect is not an issue for me, I don't take it, I even have to focus on it to be able to see it at all.

Andreas
Click to expand...

I could tell you how to see it, but I won't: once you see it you cannot unsee it!
 
Andreas, sell those two, red is the proper color for the make. (Actually, I gape at photos of some binocular collections in the same way as at those of Ferrari collections, with equal lack of affordability, desire and comprehension!)

Peter, some (many?) can unsee RB. It has happened to me. Actually, in the model I am thinking of I never or barely saw it, then suddenly it became an issue for me, without making any deliberate attempt to look for it, then I did not see it, without making any effort not to see it.
 
adhoc said:
Peter, some (many?) can unsee RB. It has happened to me. Actually, in the model I am thinking of I never or barely saw it, then suddenly it became an issue for me, without making any deliberate attempt to look for it, then I did not see it, without making any effort not to see it.
Click to expand...

Adhoc:

I think it depends quite a bit on the landscape. For instance if you pan with an SV 8.5x42 over the trunks of the trees in a grove, with out-of-focus undergrowth between you and the grove, you are almost guaranteed to see some RB effect. However if you scan a landscape with few vertical features, such as a field, then I don't think you'll see any serious RB.

Peter
 
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PeterPS said:
I could tell you how to see it, but I won't: once you see it you cannot unsee it!
Click to expand...
PeterPS said:
I think it depends quite a bit on the landscape. For instance if you pan with an SV 8.5x42 over the trunks of the trees in a grove, with unfocused undergrowth between you and the grove, you are almost guaranteed to see some RB effect. However if you scan a landscape with few vertical features, such as a field, then I don't think you'll see any serious RB.
Click to expand...

bad boy...;)

I can see the RB, but it is so insignificant to me that it is not important to me!
The Victory SF 8x42 has, by the way, more RB.
According to Gerold Dobler (Zeiss) about ten percent of users perceive a clear RB, so that it is sometimes very annoying for these people to perceive about 40 percent, but can live well with it, the remaining 50 percent do not take it at all or only to a very small extent true , I suppose I belong to this group of people.

Andreas
 
Andreas,

Most of what you say is correct. In particular only about 5-10% of all people are affected by RB (rolling ball), I believe people who suffer from motion sickness are in this category. Most of the other people (myself included) can see the RB but are not sensitive to it. You seem to suggest that there also people who don't see it at all, maybe that's true but I doubt it.

The "opposite" effect is rolling bowl (RBo), which is caused by too much pincushion. I have seen it in the FL 7x42 and also in some SLC binos. It does not seem to affect people as much as RB, but it also makes panning a bit unpleasant as trees, buildings etc band inwards.

Regarding the SF, I have the SF 10x42 and it does not have any RB problem whatsoever.

Peter
 
PeterPS said:
Andreas,

The "opposite" effect is rolling bowl (RBo), which is caused by too much pincushion. I have seen it in the FL 7x42 and also in some SLC binos. It does not seem to affect people as much as RB, but it also makes panning a bit unpleasant as trees, buildings etc band inwards.

Peter
Click to expand...

Hey Peter, that's great, that's exactly why I sold the Zeiss Victory 7x42, the pincushion has bothered me so much that the look was useless to me.

Andreas
 
PeterPS said:
Adhoc:

I think it depends quite a bit on the landscape. For instance if you pan with an SV 8.5x42 over the trunks of the trees in a grove, with out-of-focus undergrowth between you and the grove, you are almost guaranteed to see some RB effect. However if you scan a landscape with few vertical features, such as a field, then I don't think you'll see any serious RB.

Peter
Click to expand...

Peter, certainly you are right that of these two different kinds of view the one more strongly evokes RB and the other less or not at all. However here is my experience. Let us call these kinds of view A and B respectively. With A I tried to evoke RB but it was barely or not noticeable. With B it was initially not. (This is about one binocular.) Then one day I experienced it in B to a disturbing degree without seeking it at all. This continued for a day or two more. But after some weeks during which I was not regularly glassing in B I then no longer found it in B. (As I remember I was now too nervous to look for it with extreme testing!) I do not remember what happened in A across these stages (viewing through this binocular). Also I have read on this forum that some individuals who experience RB do not do so after whatever period of time (through the same binocular). With regard to your post #17 I do not suffer from motion sickness fortunately.
 
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Also I have read on this forum that some individuals who experience RB do not do so after whatever period of time (through the same binocular).
Click to expand...


Adhoc,

It's brain adaption: I know several users of Swaros who first were affected by RB but after a while (usually a few days) have become completely insensitive to it. But it can also go the other way: some people don't see it in the beginning but after a while they become very sensitive to RB. I believe our own SteveC has experienced that, and he has given up on Swaro for that reason.

Peter
 
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