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Aperture priority (1 Viewer)

mmdnje

Jose
Quick question for the forum: How important is aperture priority mode for digiscoping. Does it really matter when we always tray to shoot at the lowest number? The reason I'm asking is because when using my Fuji S5100 handheld in A mode i can only shoot three pics in burst mode but when in Automatic I can shoot until the card is full al long as I keep the shutter button pressed. Thanks in advence. Jose.
 
I only ever use Aperture priority in digiscoping.

I usually start off with the lens wide open and then progressivly reduce aperture. With stationary birds in calm conditions I'll go down to 1/15th sec shutter speed in order to get f8 or smaller. I find I get far better results with smaller apertures even if shutter speed is a bit on the slow side.

As regards your situation I'd say experiment. Most people will develop their own technique to suit themselves and their equipment.
 
A rule of thumb regards shutter speed, you want to have a shutter speed equal to or greater than the focal length of the lens you are using (not sure what this equates to on a scope) Aparture Priority is fine when the depth of field is important as in landscape photography but I would have thought shutter speed would be more important with digiscoping so as not to get a blurred photo?
 
Aperture priority suggestion -

Most compact digicams produce their sharpest images around F4-F5.6.
Reducing it to very small settings (F8 etc) usually produces less clear/sharp images due to lens diffraction at these settings on these cameras.

This is not necessarily true however if using a full frame dslr with a high quality lens. When often F8 will produce the best results.
 
Gramayr said:
A rule of thumb regards shutter speed, you want to have a shutter speed equal to or greater than the focal length of the lens you are using (not sure what this equates to on a scope)

The well-known rule-of-thumb is a very rough approximation which doesn't scale particularly well to different camera formats. It's usually quoted in relation to 35mm film cameras. It's a rule (well, more of a vague guideline) for hand-holding, not for tripod use. If you were to translate it to digiscoping scales, where the effective 35mm equivalent focal length is typically 2-3 metres (i.e., 2000-3000mm), it tries to tell us that you need a shutter speed of better than a 2000th to hand-hold a digiscope. I say tries to tell us this, as what it really tells us is that the rule makes no sense at all once you get to digiscoping focal lengths. If you were hand-holding a scope, you'd need way faster than a 2000th - maybe a 10,000 or close.


Gramayr said:
Aparture Priority is fine when the depth of field is important as in landscape photography but I would have thought shutter speed would be more important with digiscoping so as not to get a blurred photo?

You might be misunderstanding aperture priority here, Gramayr. It's not about how far your lens is stopped down, it's all about you controlling how far your lens is stopped down. So, if you want a small aperture for depth of field, you use aperture priority and set it to something small (such as f/16) and let the camera decide what shutter speed to use to make the correct exposure. Similarly, if you want the fastest possible shutter speed, you still use aperture priority, but you set it wide open, so that the camera then uses a faster shutter speed.

You could do this the other way around too - i.e., set the shutter speed high using shutter speed priority, but it doesn't work as well. Consider:
  • You set the camera to a 1000th of a second. The light is such that the camera opens up to f/4. (Which, we will assume for the same of example, is the widest your lens will go.) You get a great shot.
  • Now the light improves a little. You are still at 1000th of course, so the camera stops down to get the exposure right and shots at f/5.6. That's OK but you could have got a better shot (with a long lens) at a 2000th and f/4 - even less camera movement.
  • Then the light fades a bit. You are still at 1000th and the camera wants to open up to f/2.8, but you only have an f/4 lens, so you get an underexposed picture which is useless.

Now let's work the same example using aperture priority. You want the best possible shutter speed, so you set the lens wide open at f/4.
  • You are at f/4. The light is such that the camera uses 100th of a second to get the exposure right. You get a great shot.
  • Now the light improves a little. You are still at f/4, so the camera bumps the shutter speed up to a 2000th and you get an even better shot.
  • Then the light fades a bit. You are still at f/4 so the camera drops the shutter speed to a 500th and while that isn't as good as the faster speeds you got in better light, it's a country mile better than the muddy and underexposed shot you'd have got doing it the other way.

What about auto? Well, we can't be sure about auto because we never really know what the camera will do, but we can guess that, like most cameras, it will assume that you are shooting "normal" scenes at "normal" focal lengths (family happy snap sort of stuff) and thus select mid range values to suit.

Let's work the example again.
  • For the first shot (1000th at f/4 in the examples above) the camera selects a middle-of-the-range aperture, f/8, which makes the shutter speed a 250th. You get a lot of blur. (Or it might select f/5.6, which would be bettter as it gives you a 500th.).
  • Now the light improves a little. Still at f/8 (because cameras like the mid-range apertures if you give them a choice), you get a 500th, which is much better, or maybe even f/5.6 and a 1000th which would be great considering you are on auto).
  • Then the light fades a bit. The camera opens up a bit to f/5.6 and drops the shutter speed to a 250th again - you get blur.

Summary:

Aperture priority: you got the three best shots you could have got.
Shutter priority: you got two out of three, with one of them not quite as good as the aperture priority shotwould have been, but close.
Auto: you got one.

In reality, the ratio of good shots to bad shots using auto for digiscoping is quite a bit worse than this: you really struggle to get any good shots unless the light is absolutely fantastic - a seagull on an Australian beach in summer, for example.

I'm late for work! No time to proof read, hope this makes sense!
 
PS: the only time I consider using shutter speed priority is when the light is really, really bright (seagull on a white beach in full sun sort of thing). Set it to a 2000th or a 4000th and let the camera decide whether to stop down or not. That way you avoid the risk of the camera needing to go to a 16,000th of a second when the shutter can only do an 8000th.
 
Jose,
I always use Aperture Priority Mode and let the camera select the shutter speed as I'm on a tripod so slow shutter speeds don't worry me too much (I'd like better than 1/125 sec though ). The burst mode on your camera is probably a very fast speed ( on my Olympus 7070wz I can only get 2 frames in burst mode ) and the normal continuous mode is probably slower at about 1 frame per second. Neil.
 
Tannin said:
The well-known rule-of-thumb is a very rough approximation which doesn't scale particularly well to different camera formats. It's usually quoted in relation to 35mm film cameras. It's a rule (well, more of a vague guideline) for hand-holding, not for tripod use. If you were to translate it to digiscoping scales, where the effective 35mm equivalent focal length is typically 2-3 metres (i.e., 2000-3000mm), it tries to tell us that you need a shutter speed of better than a 2000th to hand-hold a digiscope. I say tries to tell us this, as what it really tells us is that the rule makes no sense at all once you get to digiscoping focal lengths. If you were hand-holding a scope, you'd need way faster than a 2000th - maybe a 10,000 or close.




You might be misunderstanding aperture priority here, Gramayr. It's not about how far your lens is stopped down, it's all about you controlling how far your lens is stopped down. So, if you want a small aperture for depth of field, you use aperture priority and set it to something small (such as f/16) and let the camera decide what shutter speed to use to make the correct exposure. Similarly, if you want the fastest possible shutter speed, you still use aperture priority, but you set it wide open, so that the camera then uses a faster shutter speed.

You could do this the other way around too - i.e., set the shutter speed high using shutter speed priority, but it doesn't work as well. Consider:
  • You set the camera to a 1000th of a second. The light is such that the camera opens up to f/4. (Which, we will assume for the same of example, is the widest your lens will go.) You get a great shot.
  • Now the light improves a little. You are still at 1000th of course, so the camera stops down to get the exposure right and shots at f/5.6. That's OK but you could have got a better shot (with a long lens) at a 2000th and f/4 - even less camera movement.
  • Then the light fades a bit. You are still at 1000th and the camera wants to open up to f/2.8, but you only have an f/4 lens, so you get an underexposed picture which is useless.

Now let's work the same example using aperture priority. You want the best possible shutter speed, so you set the lens wide open at f/4.
  • You are at f/4. The light is such that the camera uses 100th of a second to get the exposure right. You get a great shot.
  • Now the light improves a little. You are still at f/4, so the camera bumps the shutter speed up to a 2000th and you get an even better shot.
  • Then the light fades a bit. You are still at f/4 so the camera drops the shutter speed to a 500th and while that isn't as good as the faster speeds you got in better light, it's a country mile better than the muddy and underexposed shot you'd have got doing it the other way.

What about auto? Well, we can't be sure about auto because we never really know what the camera will do, but we can guess that, like most cameras, it will assume that you are shooting "normal" scenes at "normal" focal lengths (family happy snap sort of stuff) and thus select mid range values to suit.

Let's work the example again.
  • For the first shot (1000th at f/4 in the examples above) the camera selects a middle-of-the-range aperture, f/8, which makes the shutter speed a 250th. You get a lot of blur. (Or it might select f/5.6, which would be bettter as it gives you a 500th.).
  • Now the light improves a little. Still at f/8 (because cameras like the mid-range apertures if you give them a choice), you get a 500th, which is much better, or maybe even f/5.6 and a 1000th which would be great considering you are on auto).
  • Then the light fades a bit. The camera opens up a bit to f/5.6 and drops the shutter speed to a 250th again - you get blur.

Summary:

Aperture priority: you got the three best shots you could have got.
Shutter priority: you got two out of three, with one of them not quite as good as the aperture priority shotwould have been, but close.
Auto: you got one.

In reality, the ratio of good shots to bad shots using auto for digiscoping is quite a bit worse than this: you really struggle to get any good shots unless the light is absolutely fantastic - a seagull on an Australian beach in summer, for example.

I'm late for work! No time to proof read, hope this makes sense!

What a brilliant explanation,and it surely does help us novices a great deal;Thanks very much Tannin for going to great length in explaining it all to us, we really do appreciate it.
 
bobwoodcock said:
What a brilliant explanation,and it surely does help us novices a great deal;Thanks very much Tannin for going to great length in explaining it all to us, we really do appreciate it.
Agreed, the best explanation I have yet read, to date I have had the best results by leaving mine set to 1/200 shutter speed but this has convinced me to do some more experimenting.

Mick
 
Tannin said:
What about auto? Well, we can't be sure about auto because we never really know what the camera will do, but we can guess that, like most cameras, it will assume that you are shooting "normal" scenes at "normal" focal lengths (family happy snap sort of stuff) and thus select mid range values to suit.

I totally agree with your excellent analysis of the various settings.

However, I'd like to add one point: There are cameras around that leave the aperture open until there's quite a lot of light around. For instance, the Sony W17 doesn't stop down until the shutterspeed is above 1/320. So, unless it's very bright you can in fact leave the camera on auto and still get the fastest shutter speed that's possbile in the given conditions. In such situations the auto setting works exactly like an aperture priority setting.

In view of the fact that there are nowadays quite a few decent cameras around without an aperture priority setting, I think it's worth checking what exactly the auto setting does in different light conditions.

Hermann
 
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