Join for FREE
It only takes a minute!
Zeiss - Always on the lookout for something special – Shop now

Welcome to BirdForum.
BirdForum is the net's largest birding community, dedicated to wild birds and birding, and is absolutely FREE! You are most welcome to register for an account, which allows you to take part in lively discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.

Velvet Ant - Russia

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread
Old Saturday 2nd February 2019, 06:59   #1
andyadcock
Registered User
 
andyadcock's Avatar

 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Nottingham UK and St Petersburg, Russia
Posts: 13,370
Velvet Ant - Russia

I had a this a couple of years ago in St Petersburg in sandy, boggy, heath habitat and have tentatively ID's as Mutilla marginata, can anyone confirm or correct?
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Velvet Ant Mutilla marginata.jpg
Views:	21
Size:	383.8 KB
ID:	686268  
__________________
Andy A
andyadcock is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Monday 18th February 2019, 23:04   #2
CerambyX
Registered User
 
CerambyX's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Latvia
Posts: 275
Do you have any other angles? Maybe top view - marginata has noticeably more narrow thorax than europaea? But the silvery haired legs (especially tibias) are indeed reminiscent of marginata.
__________________
upiterans.blogspot.com
Latvian lists: Birds: 286 (Last: Barn Owl) Butterflies: 103 (Last: Brown Argus) Dragonflies: 57 (Last: River Clubtail)
CerambyX is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Monday 18th February 2019, 23:12   #3
RafaelMatias
Registered User
 
RafaelMatias's Avatar

 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Lisbon, Portugal
Posts: 2,387
Yes, I can confirm it as M. marginata (as in the previous post where it was identified, a few months ago). Besides the silvery pubescence covering legs (not shown by M. europaea), the abundant dark pubescence (including over thorax/mesosoma) is also characteristic of marginata. Ukraine is the type locality for marginata, and that species is one of the most abundant species in Russia, that far north (not many species there as well).

PS: sorry, but I'm only now seeing this thread, due to the previous reply.

Last edited by RafaelMatias : Monday 18th February 2019 at 23:52.
RafaelMatias is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Tuesday 19th February 2019, 05:33   #4
andyadcock
Registered User
 
andyadcock's Avatar

 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Nottingham UK and St Petersburg, Russia
Posts: 13,370
Sorry, I'm getting old.....
__________________
Andy A
andyadcock is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Tuesday 19th February 2019, 05:52   #5
RafaelMatias
Registered User
 
RafaelMatias's Avatar

 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Lisbon, Portugal
Posts: 2,387
No worries Andy, I actually wasn't too assertive with my first answer, and meanwhile I had time to look at it properly: there's a work on Russian mutillids, but it's in Russian, still one of the main references on Palearctic mutillids; it takes some time (to me) to wade through it. Mutillid wasps are among my very favourite insects, so please do post photos of them if you get some more (if you manage to make them hold still long enough for a photo that is); sadly, some species are not identifiable from photos (only under a potent microscope), and one's required some practice to understand individual variation. I'm not sure how many species you have around there (St Petersburg), but I'd guess less than 10 (between 5 and 10?), whereas they're in the order of 60 species in Iberia (with some species probably yet to be described), making it a bit complicated. Cheers
RafaelMatias is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Tuesday 19th February 2019, 10:42   #6
andyadcock
Registered User
 
andyadcock's Avatar

 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Nottingham UK and St Petersburg, Russia
Posts: 13,370
Many thanks again Rafael.
__________________
Andy A
andyadcock is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Saturday 23rd February 2019, 22:34   #7
CerambyX
Registered User
 
CerambyX's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Latvia
Posts: 275
Quote:
Originally Posted by RafaelMatias View Post
No worries Andy, I actually wasn't too assertive with my first answer, and meanwhile I had time to look at it properly: there's a work on Russian mutillids, but it's in Russian, still one of the main references on Palearctic mutillids; it takes some time (to me) to wade through it. Mutillid wasps are among my very favourite insects, so please do post photos of them if you get some more (if you manage to make them hold still long enough for a photo that is); sadly, some species are not identifiable from photos (only under a potent microscope), and one's required some practice to understand individual variation. I'm not sure how many species you have around there (St Petersburg), but I'd guess less than 10 (between 5 and 10?), whereas they're in the order of 60 species in Iberia (with some species probably yet to be described), making it a bit complicated. Cheers
I think there should be only 4 mutillid wasps around St.Petersburg - Mutilla europaea, M.marginta, Smycromyrme rufipes and Myrmosa atra (if you count this one as Mutillidae - opinions differ I guess). At least that's the situation in Latvia and we are located even a bit more south but don't get any more additional species. From my experience from two Mutilla species the M.europaea is more common than M.marginata over here, but I have feeling that marginata has been expanding in recent years, similar maybe like scoliid wasp Scolia hirta that's arrived only recently (~year 2014) but now has reached even Estonia in N.
__________________
upiterans.blogspot.com
Latvian lists: Birds: 286 (Last: Barn Owl) Butterflies: 103 (Last: Brown Argus) Dragonflies: 57 (Last: River Clubtail)
CerambyX is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Saturday 23rd February 2019, 22:59   #8
RafaelMatias
Registered User
 
RafaelMatias's Avatar

 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Lisbon, Portugal
Posts: 2,387
Quote:
Originally Posted by CerambyX View Post
I think there should be only 4 mutillid wasps around St.Petersburg - Mutilla europaea, M.marginta, Smycromyrme rufipes and Myrmosa atra (if you count this one as Mutillidae - opinions differ I guess).
Many thanks, interesting. That's what I suspected.
RafaelMatias is offline  
Reply With Quote
Advertisement
Reply


Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Velvet Ant Sicily Muppit17 Insects, Dragonflies, Arachnids, Beetles & More 7 Sunday 21st October 2018 09:39
Velvet Rollrim? Davebutterflyman Fungi & Lichens 2 Wednesday 17th October 2018 11:59
Velvet scoter behaviour eanin1 Bird Identification Q&A 2 Thursday 20th November 2008 06:47
Velvet Scoter Sancho Your Birding Day 4 Sunday 12th November 2006 22:32
Velvet shank Leif Trees, Flowers, Plants and Shrubs 3 Saturday 10th April 2004 18:31

{googleads}

Fatbirder's Top 1000 Birding Websites

Help support BirdForum

Page generated in 0.22727489 seconds with 21 queries
All times are GMT. The time now is 08:20.