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What is Meopta doing?

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Old Saturday 5th May 2018, 19:57   #26
Gijs van Ginkel
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I wait for Meopta to respond, immediately when I have that I will post it.
Meopta made both for Leica and for Zeiss the telescopes and/or the telescope optics for the now older model telescopes, not for the most recent ones as far as I know. That does not mean that these companies do not recieve some optical components for present instruments and I have reasons to believe that this is the case for Zeiss. There is nothing wrong with that in my opinion, if the components comply with the specifications wanted.
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Old Sunday 6th May 2018, 15:59   #27
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Gijs, thanks for inquiring. I've always found the Meostars a very interesting alternative, and would like to see them improved further... or to know if they already have been?
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Old Tuesday 8th May 2018, 22:24   #28
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Tenex,

Have you tried a Meopta Meostar B1 yet? I would suggest trying one or more before you suggest improvements to them, even though they are an older design. They still offer a lot of amazing view for the price, and often you can improve that by waiting for closeouts. I have done so twice now, and I can honestly say that I think Meopta still has a greatly competing design to offer. They might not be top of the heap, but really, they are very, very good optics from what my eyes tell me, and I am lucky to have been able to take advantage of the deals on them recently. Personally, I don't think they need an upgrade, but then again, I'm not an alpha user either. Still, they are just fine optics to me, but again, it's just one opinion of many here.
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Old Wednesday 9th May 2018, 14:16   #29
Gijs van Ginkel
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Dear all,
To stop all speculations: the Meopta Meostar binocular roof prisms are supplied with di-electric mirror coatings as mentioned in my notes and now confirmed again by Meopta.
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Old Wednesday 9th May 2018, 14:48   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gijs van Ginkel View Post
Dear all,
To stop all speculations: the Meopta Meostar binocular roof prisms are supplied with di-electric mirror coatings as mentioned in my notes and now confirmed again by Meopta.
Gijs van Ginkel
Thank you for this Gijs.

Lee
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Old Wednesday 9th May 2018, 14:51   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tenex View Post
The Meostar line has always seemed interesting, but I really don't understand what Meopta is doing. The 32mm models have FOV that competes with the alphas, but the larger ones don't? $300 China-made binos have dielectric mirror coatings and ED glass, but Meostars don't? (Actually a few models are "HD", but the others aren't, which seems strange.) And this is a company that I read makes scopes for Leica. Are there legal or contractual issues involved here?

(Apologies if this is old hat, please just point me to the appropriate thread I didn't see.)
I have heard the Meostar is a wonderful optic but as you point out the FOV thing was just too small for me to even seriously consider it. I tried a Meopro and have not been impressed with it overall. It's got a decent FOV however.
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Old Wednesday 9th May 2018, 16:27   #32
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Gijs has pointed out that the MeoStars do have dielectric coatings and as for the ED glass: take a look through them and then make up your mind.

Lee
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Old Wednesday 9th May 2018, 18:22   #33
dries1
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Meopta

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gijs van Ginkel View Post
Dear all,
To stop all speculations: the Meopta Meostar binocular roof prisms are supplied with di-electric mirror coatings as mentioned in my notes and now confirmed again by Meopta.
Gijs van Ginkel
Thank you Gijs,

Is it possible to know when they went with di-electric mirror coatings on the Meostar models. I have a 8X42 from 2012 and one from 2015, there is some very suttle differences, the 15 seems to display slightly more brightness.

Andy W.
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Old Wednesday 9th May 2018, 19:08   #34
Gijs van Ginkel
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Andy, post 33,
Perhaps by comparing the differences in color reproduction, the one with di-electric coatings is more color neutral and looks brighter, the one with siver coatings may have a slight red preference giving it a so-called warmer and slightly less bright image impression.
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Old Wednesday 9th May 2018, 19:35   #35
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Gijs,

I will look closer next time. Thanks for that.

Andy W.
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Old Thursday 10th May 2018, 00:51   #36
adhoc
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gijs van Ginkel View Post
Dear all,
To stop all speculations: the Meopta Meostar binocular roof prisms are supplied with di-electric mirror coatings as mentioned in my notes and now confirmed again by Meopta.
Gijs van Ginkel
Thanks Gijs.

Meopta, respectfully, you can prevent confusion by simply stating that in your website, like most or all other manufrs.!

When I try to get to the main Meopta website just now Google or Kaspersky warn it may be unsafe. (That is www.meopta.com, not www.meoptasportsoptics.com, which is as normal.)

Last edited by adhoc : Thursday 10th May 2018 at 03:11.
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Old Thursday 10th May 2018, 05:57   #37
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The complaints on Bird Forum about the Meopta Optik website have been noted by Meopta and the site, which is new, is being rebuilt by a guy with many other responsibilities. Work on the site is proceeding as quickly as possible which is not as quick as he would wish.

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Old Thursday 10th May 2018, 14:29   #38
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I was puzzling over why Gijs and myself got seemingly conflicting information from Meopta about the Meostar prisms. I have checked with them again. It seems, at least in part, to be to do with how we phrased the questions.

If you ask if the Meostar has silver coated prisms, the answer is yes. If you ask if they have dielectric coated prisms, the answer is also yes. I'm told the Bauernfeind prism is silver coated and the Schmidt prism is dielectric. Apologies for the confusion.

David

Last edited by typo : Thursday 10th May 2018 at 14:32.
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Old Thursday 10th May 2018, 15:54   #39
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Looks like lack of tact by me has contributed to a bit of a situation.
Meopta, sorry, your website is okay. I really do like it, its "clinical" look.
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Old Friday 11th May 2018, 00:05   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by typo View Post
If you ask if the Meostar has silver coated prisms, the answer is yes. If you ask if they have dielectric coated prisms, the answer is also yes. I'm told the Bauernfeind prism is silver coated and the Schmidt prism is dielectric. Apologies for the confusion.
Something's still wrong here. There's only one mirror surface in the pair of prisms, and if it's silver it's not dielectric. The word "dielectric" is apparently also used for other coatings, like phase correction, which the other (roof) prism would indeed have. So if we're talking about the mirror, this answer is still "silver not dielectric". And I'm beginning to suspect that the answer Gijs got is the same.
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Old Friday 11th May 2018, 06:22   #41
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Originally Posted by tenex View Post
Something's still wrong here. There's only one mirror surface in the pair of prisms, and if it's silver it's not dielectric. The word "dielectric" is apparently also used for other coatings, like phase correction, which the other (roof) prism would indeed have. So if we're talking about the mirror, this answer is still "silver not dielectric". And I'm beginning to suspect that the answer Gijs got is the same.
Apparently. Gijs asked specifically if the roof prism was dielectric coated and was told it was. I had previously been told by Meopta that the prism was silver mirrored so I asked for clarification on the coatings. This was the reply "The roof prisms are coated with dielectric coatings, nevertheless the prism system includes also half-penta prism which has silver coating."

Anyone who has tried the current generation of Meostars will know that they definitely do not have the yellowish cast of the older models. They are now close to neutral, and to my eyes have a better colour presentation than the current Swaro and Zeiss offerings.

Unfortunately I was asked not to post the transmission spectra I was sent when I reviewed the 12x50HD, but was told I could describe it. The trace hovers around the 90% mark between 500nm and 675nm with perhaps a 2 or 3% high point in the red. At the blue end of the spectrum the trasmission is still 80% at 430nm (what used to be called indigo) and 60% at 400nm in the violet. At the other end of the spectrum in the deeper red, it's still 80% at 700nm and 55% at 780nm. In my book, that is very good..

David
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Old Friday 11th May 2018, 08:14   #42
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David and others interested,
Until some years ago the Meopta roofs were supplied with silver mirror coatings and, in addition to the other coatings the binoculars had a specific color impression which showed a yellow-red preference, but that picture changed quite a bit with the introduction of di-electric mirror coatings and better lens coatings. So the presnet binoculars can compete very well with other top brands like Leica, Swarovski and Zeiss, but at a lower price level. That is probably of importance for the company since traditionally it sold many instruments to Eastern European countries and farther east and for large sales numbers a lower price level was absolutely a must to prevent the loss of many customers (consumers in Western Europe, USA etc. obviously had more money to spent).
David mentions transmission at 400 nm and some at 780 nm. Everybody who has done spectroscopy or used to sit behind a monochromator will have noticed that a these wavelengths you can not see a lot (400nm) or nothing at all (780nm).
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Old Friday 11th May 2018, 08:52   #43
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While thanking all for their information and analysis here, from themselves or another source, I think maybe we should keep in mind that a binocular manufr. may not be willing to divulge information about their products beyond some point.
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Old Friday 11th May 2018, 09:19   #44
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Gijs,

I suggest you read posts #38, #40 and #41 very carefully again.

A Schmidt Pechan prism assembly is composed of a Bauernfeind semi penta prism which I'm informed by the same person at Meopta that Gijs spoke to has one silver mirrored surface. The Schmidt roof prism requires no mirrored surfaces, but the roof facets are phase coated, which I understand can be termed a dielectric coating.

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Old Friday 11th May 2018, 09:47   #45
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David,
I did not ask for a phase coating but specifically for a di-electric mirror coating and I suppose that Meopta knows the difference very well at least that was my solid impression when I met and spoke with the outstanding Meopta professionals.
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Old Friday 11th May 2018, 13:51   #46
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Originally Posted by Gijs van Ginkel View Post
David,
I did not ask for a phase coating but specifically for a di-electric mirror coating and I suppose that Meopta knows the difference very well at least that was my solid impression when I met and spoke with the outstanding Meopta professionals.
Gijs van Ginkel

Allbinos says this about the coatings on the Meostar B1 10x42 HD

"The company boasts of using special Meobright coatings, covering all air-to-glass surfaces which are supposed to ensure 99.8% of transmission on one such surface. Additionally you get MeoShield ion-assisted coating which protects external lens surfaces and delivers enhanced resistance to scratching or abrasion in extreme conditions. Of course you shouldn’t forget about phase-correction coating on Schmidt-Pechan roof prisms; unfortunately we couldn’t find any info on the producer’s site concerning the type of reflective coating on the Pechan prism."

Note the last sentence about "the type of reflective coating on the Pechan prism."


https://www.allbinos.com/310-binocul..._10x42_HD.html

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Old Friday 11th May 2018, 14:14   #47
Gijs van Ginkel
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Bob, post 46,
I know and it took me some time to cross the mental barriers at Meopta, since the first message I received was: we are not supposed/allowed to give any information about the secrets of our prisms specific coatings and that was specifically aimed at the mirror coatings. So I had to go deeper into the organisation....and charm in combination with beauty did the trick......up to now.
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Old Friday 11th May 2018, 15:21   #48
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While thanking all for their information and analysis here, from themselves or another source, I think maybe we should keep in mind that a binocular manufr. may not be willing to divulge information about their products beyond some point.
Adhoc,

I think it is fair so say that Meopta are aware of certain predudices in the public domain and have been reticent about providing specific details about their coatings. I have known this person at Meopta for may years, and although I he has previously ackowledged that silver was used in the prism coating, this was the first time I'm aware of that he has furnished this level of detail knowing it would be made public. I am sure there are proprietary details he would not be prepared to disclose.

David
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Old Friday 11th May 2018, 16:40   #49
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I disagree with the word "prejudices"; we're talking about matters of fact (performance and longevity). I consider it normal to want to know the basics of what one is being asked to pay for. Could this be part of the transition to a more consumer-oriented society?

Thanks again to both Gijs and David for inquiring into this, and adhoc is certainly right that every manufacturer has details they keep proprietary -- even though basic type of mirror coating isn't normally one of them. To judge from the spectrum David described, Meopta is getting good transmission (~90%) and neutral color with what are still probably silver mirrors, and that may be a good deal at this price point. The inconsistency regarding ED/HD glass in different models is of course another story. I'll be very curious to see how the Meostar line (and transparency about it) develops further.

Last edited by tenex : Friday 11th May 2018 at 18:57.
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Old Friday 11th May 2018, 20:04   #50
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tenex, post 49,
I have explained it in previous posts, but the transmission spectra we measured of binoculars which are supplied with silver mirrors on the roof prisms are different from the ones with di-electric mirrors and the spectra we have measured on the Meopta Meostars definitely have all the characteristics of roof prisms with di-electric mirrors, so actually I did not have to ask it since we were already convinced. Tht Meopta is not eager to share everything with consumers: that is the policy of the company. In fact it is not all that imprtant it is the performance of the binoculars that count, and that is excellent from the ones we have investigated.
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