Pronunciations of species’ names (1 Viewer)

Hi all,

I would like to ask how to pronounce Dunn’s Lark Eremalauda dunni and Rhamphocoris clotbey. For the former, especially how to pronounce the “D”, Dunn is of Celtic origin according to wekipedia. The latter species is named after Antoine Barthelemy Clot (French) known as Clot Bey. So is the “t” of Clot pronounced in French? therefore is it pronounced in clotbey?

regards,
Mohamed

Acrocephalus said:

Hi all,

I would like to ask how to pronounce Dunn’s Lark Eremalauda dunni and Rhamphocoris clotbey. For the former, especially how to pronounce the “D”, Dunn is of Celtic origin according to wekipedia. The latter species is named after Antoine Barthelemy Clot (French) known as Clot Bey. So is the “t” of Clot pronounced in French? therefore is it pronounced in clotbey?

regards,
Mohamed

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'Dunn' is of Celtic origin, but is a well-established English name now. I would pronounce it as it looks - 'Dunn-i' (the 'I' to rhyme with pi).

As for 'clotbey' I really don't know. I suspect that technically it ought to be pronounced 'clo-bey' but I imagine it frequently isn't.

The pronunciation of scientific names is something I have had much fun debating at times, invariably with no conclusion being reached. Peoples preference seems to depend largely on whether or not they ever learned Latin at school, when they did this, and the particular teacher they had. ICZN offers no help. The only reference I have come across that attempts to give any guidance is

Tyler, M.1992 Encyclopedia of Australian Frogs

I paste his suggestions here just in case they help.

PRONUNCIATION
Because most zoological names are constructed from Latin or Greek roots, they should be pronounced and stressed in such a way as to retain the identity of these elements. There are no absolute rules, but the pronunciation recommended in this encyclopedia is reasonably consistent and international. Consonants are given their usual English values: a limited set of vowels is pronounced as below.

ay as in bay
a as in bat
ah as in bah
ee as in bee
e as in bet
er as in fern
ie as in die
i as in bit
air as in fair
oh as in doh
o as in dot
or as in for
aw as in law
ue as in sue
u as in but
oo as in good
ow as in cow
oy as in boy

A point to be noted is that proper names retain their identity, even when Latinised. Thus burrelli (after a Mr Burrell) is bu’-rel-ee, not bu-rel'-ee; sladei (after a Mr Slade) is slay'-dee; godmani (after a Mr Godman) is god'-mun-ee, not god-mah'-nee.

Mohamed,

As David says, Dunn is now a common British name. The Dunn in question is Colonel Henry Nason Dunn (1864-1952), a British army surgeon, and in English the name is pronounced 'dun' (probably something like 'dan' in French?). I tend to favour Ferguson-Lees's and Blunt's recent recommendations (in British Birds, 2008/2009) for the pronunciation of scientific names - ie essentially classical Latin (for maximum commonality with most European pronunciations, especially in vowel sounds), but retaining local pronunciation for eponyms. So dunni would be 'dun-ee' (or approximately 'dan-i' in French).

Can't really comment on pronunciation of clotbey (you must have a much better grasp of French pronunciation!), but the 'Bey' is an Ottoman honorific (Turkish Beğ) awarded in 1832 by Mohammed Ali Pasha (who called him 'Klute Bey' - perhaps a clue ).

Beolens & Watkins 2003. Whose Bird?
Jobling 2010. Scientific Bird Names.

Richard

Richard Klim said:

Mohamed,

As David says, Dunn is now a common British name. The Dunn in question is Colonel Henry Nason Dunn (1864-1952), a British army surgeon, and in English the name is pronounced 'dun' (probably something like 'dan' in French?). I tend to favour Ferguson-Lees's and Blunt's recent recommendations (in British Birds, 2008/2009) for the pronunciation of scientific names - ie essentially classical Latin (for maximum commonality with other European pronunciations), but retaining local pronunciation for eponyms. So dunni would be 'dun-ee' (or approximately 'dan-i' in French).

Can't really comment on clotbey (you must have a much better grasp of French pronunciation!), but the 'Bey' is an Ottoman honorific (Turkish Beğ) awarded by Mohammed Ali Pasha (who called him 'Klute Bey' - now there's a clue ) in 1832.

Beolens & Watkins 2003. Whose Bird?
Jobling 2010. Scientific Birds Names.

Richard

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CLOT-BEY, Antoine Barthélemy (05-11-1793, Grenoble, Rhône-Alpes, France; 28-08-1868, Marseille, Provence-Alpes-Côte d'Azur, France), collector in the Mediterranean area

Worked when 15 years old in a barbershop at Brignoles, and still working as barber, Clot-Bey started by 1812 in a study medicine. He became officer of health by 1816, and became doctor of medicine and surgeon by 1820 at Montpellier. By 1825 Clot-Bey was appointed as chief surgeon In Cairo by Mehemet Ali, viceroy of Egypt. As he gave up his religion during 1832 was honoured with the title Bey. Founded the medical school at Abuzabel (close to Cairo) by 1837 and founded a French school. In 1836 he received the rank of general, and was appointed head of the medical administration of the country. In 1849 he returned to Marseilles, but revisited Egypt in 1856. Also he received the title of Commander of the Legion of honour.

Bibliography
Fransen C.H.J.M., Holthuis L.B. & Adema J.P.H.M. 1997. Type-catalogue of the Decapod Crustacea in the collections of the Nationaal Natuurhistorisch Museum, with appendices of pre-1900 collectors and material. Zoologische verhandelingen 311; 2). Wynne O.E. 1969. Biographical Key – Names of Birds of the World to Authors and those Commemorated. Hants; 3). Mearns B. & Mearns R. 1988. Biographies for Birdwatchers. The lives of Those Commemorated in Western Palearctic Bird Names. London.

As a botanist once told me, "Latin is a dead language. You can pronounce it however you want."

thyoloalethe said:

As a botanist once told me, "Latin is a dead language. You can pronounce it however you want."

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My mother used to say that when she was a student they said "Latin is a dead language. It killed the Romans and now it's killing me!" 8-P

I've always gone with "dunn-ee" ( if only to amuse Aussies ) and "clot-bay.

Chris

Thank you all for your input. From your responses I found that I pronounced dunni correctly as you suggested, however I heard from my colleague something like doonee. I pronounced clotby wrongly though.