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Nikon FF (and DX) Mirrorless rumours/ announcements (2 Viewers)

Chosun Juan said:
According to the latest Nikon Rumour, the FF Nikon Mirrorless could be:
* announced before Photokina 2018,
* shown at Photokina 2018, and
* released about a month later in October 2018 ......

They also say that it will use the Z mount and have a "Very sophisticated new F-mount adapter"
https://www.nikonrumors.co/nikon-full-frame-mirrorless-camera-may-start-shipping-in-october-2018/

Woo-Hoo ?? Curiouser and curiouser :cat:

Chosun :gh:
Click to expand...

We'll have to wait until Spring 2019, according to Nikon themselves:

https://www.dpreview.com/news/66458...s-new-mirrorless-system-coming-by-spring-2019
 
Vespobuteo said:
We'll have to wait until Spring 2019, according to Nikon themselves:

https://www.dpreview.com/news/66458...s-new-mirrorless-system-coming-by-spring-2019
Click to expand...
Vespo, that's the same interview source mail that Optiholic posted about in post#98, and I posted (from a different gatekeeper) in post#100.

Now from Nikon Rumours (original source for my post#101) comes further mail that says the new Nikon Mirrorless (FF) will be announced before Photokina 2018, and .....
"The new Nikon mirrorless camera will definitely be on display at Photokina in September"
https://nikonrumors.com/2018/05/04/nikon-mirrorless-camera-rumors-the-most-likely-scenario.aspx/

I suppose this is well and truly "by" Spring 2019 ....... :)

Certainly if it is fully ready, it would be prudent to beat (or at least match) Canon to the punch.

It looks like being a strange 'everything to everyone' type animal ..... rumoured to have 2 electric motors in it ...... :cat:



Chosun :gh:
 
HermitIbis said:
Chosun Juan said:
....They also say that it will use the Z mount and have a "Very sophisticated new F-mount adapter"
Click to expand...
More sophisticated than the FT1 for the Nikon1? Probably means it offers AF-C from the start.
Click to expand...

I would say that would be absolutely mandatory!

I wonder if they will go with at least 2 adapters -
one for the recent electronic lens owners, and ...
another for the older mechanical aperture and screw drive crowd?


Chosun :gh:
 
I hope the EVF is 3.6MP (not dots) - hard to see how it would meet Nikon's criteria for excellence otherwise, especially given Sony has come out with a ~2MP one https://m.dpreview.com/news/6857011184/sony-reveals-faster-higher-res-oled-viewfinder-display

I seem to recall a prototype research unit (I think it was a French mob?) a few years ago that was around ~4 or ~5MP, so I had hoped for better by Nikon. The proof will come if it has zero blackout and in-viewfinder histogram and focus peaking .....

The 9fps hardly sets the world alight either .....

No mention of an adapter available at this early stage, but jeez, you want to hope it was included for that price ! I would think it is a must have for launch time .......



Chosun :gh:
 
Nikon 1 system Officially Discontinued ..... :(

It's Official ! ...... Nikon 1 is no more .....
https://www.dpreview.com/news/3989109657/nikon-inc-confirms-the-nikon-1-is-officially-discontinued

This may free up needed resources for the launch of Nikon's new Mirrorless FF (to be followed by the DX).

I can't help but think that they should have doubled down and made it into all that it could be ..... :(

Perhaps after the new Mirrorless launches, they will renew the "1" series with truly revolutionary curved stacked BSI CMOS sensor tech, computational photography processing, fast diffractive optics, CFRP materials, transformer style ergonomics, and the type of connectivity Gen Z demand. Maybe this will be a prototype developed which will not only stick it to MFT, but serve as a testbed for a new generation of curved FF and DX systems ! (Lol. I'm obsoleting the nascent Nikon flat sensor FF Mirrorless system before it's even arrived! - Steve Jobs would be proud :) :cat:



Chosun :gh:
 
Chosun Juan said:
It's Official ! ...... Nikon 1 is no more .....
https://www.dpreview.com/news/3989109657/nikon-inc-confirms-the-nikon-1-is-officially-discontinued

This may free up needed resources for the launch of Nikon's new Mirrorless FF (to be followed by the DX).

I can't help but think that they should have doubled down and made it into all that it could be ..... :(

Perhaps after the new Mirrorless launches, they will renew the "1" series with truly revolutionary curved stacked BSI CMOS sensor tech, computational photography processing, fast diffractive optics, CFRP materials, transformer style ergonomics, and the type of connectivity Gen Z demand. Maybe this will be a prototype developed which will not only stick it to MFT, but serve as a testbed for a new generation of curved FF and DX systems ! (Lol. I'm obsoleting the nascent Nikon flat sensor FF Mirrorless system before it's even arrived! - Steve Jobs would be proud :) :cat:

Chosun :gh:
Click to expand...

Why would any of the current camera leaders obsolete themselves by launching a curved sensor?
Afaik, it does not solve any real problems, the chromatic aberration is still there, the only benefit is to reduce the demands on the lens designer somewhat. Should Canon and Nikon spend heavily to make it easier for the Chinese competition??
Perhaps the future could be in optical wave front reconstruction rather than in curved sensors.
 
etudiant said:
Why would any of the current camera leaders obsolete themselves by launching a curved sensor?
Afaik, it does not solve any real problems, the chromatic aberration is still there, the only benefit is to reduce the demands on the lens designer somewhat. Should Canon and Nikon spend heavily to make it easier for the Chinese competition??
Perhaps the future could be in optical wave front reconstruction rather than in curved sensors.
Click to expand...
Curved sensors have many benefits as outlined by the paper I posted earlier in the thread - namely sharper, and over more of the frame, and less elements (hence weight). In concert with diffractive element optics, CA could also be reduced along with even further weight reductions. Who better to offer a superior product than your own company?

With the pace of innovation that CaNikon have demonstrated, I doubt that we would see moves along those lines by the big two any time soon. Canon seems to have even forgotten all about the 7D MkIII .....

With the new mirrorless Z to F lens mount adapter Nikon has given future life to it's lens back catalogue - I expect Canon will follow suit.

With that, perhaps only 3 opportunities really exist for curved sensors - a curved 1" system by Nikon, a curved MFT system by Nikon, or a curved MFT system by the current MFT alliance partners (a bold move no doubt, but one that could bury APS-C competitors) , or of course Canon could jump on any of those format bandwagons itself.

Given enough money and will, there is no reason that a Chinese company or consortium couldn't just go straight to it and leapfrog digital camera format history and legacy product up to this point - much the same way as they are planning to do in the electric powered automotive market .....



Chosun :gh:
 
Well the 23rd is here and we are still in the realms of "teaser" shots and details:
https://www.nikonrumors.co/first-leaked-image-of-nikon-full-frame-mirrorless-camera/
https://www.nikonff.com/here-are-be...ame-mirrorless-camera-and-more-rumored-specs/
It seems from photos so far to be suitably ergonomic in the grip department. Nikon seems to have Sony's AR7III firmly in it's sights with somewhere near ~400 AF points and AF at least as good (I would have thought even better would be the goal? ). Apparently the adapter is suitable for all Nikkor F mount lenses.

The teaser video - WARNING! (do NOT consume any psychedelic substances before watching! :)
https://www.nikonff.com/first-nikon-video-teaser-could-be-nikon-full-frame-mirrorless-camera/



Chosun :gh:
 
Chosun Juan said:
Curved sensors have many benefits as outlined by the paper I posted earlier in the thread - namely sharper, and over more of the frame, and less elements (hence weight). In concert with diffractive element optics, CA could also be reduced along with even further weight reductions. Who better to offer a superior product than your own company?

Chosun :gh:
Click to expand...

Think these are all true, but not enough to be sufficiently compelling to justify a complete product line replacement.
The more plausible approach imho is to do image reconstruction, somewhat along the Light Camera concept, shifting the innovation burden away from the lenses to the digital processing. Leica for one has put some of its limited resources behind this effort. Considering their experience and capabilities, that was a very striking development.
 
etudiant said:
Think these are all true, but not enough to be sufficiently compelling to justify a complete product line replacement.
The more plausible approach imho is to do image reconstruction, somewhat along the Light Camera concept, shifting the innovation burden away from the lenses to the digital processing. Leica for one has put some of its limited resources behind this effort. Considering their experience and capabilities, that was a very striking development.
Click to expand...
Yes, I agree - I think computational photography has a huge role to play - though I don't see it as an either/ or, proposition.

There may be different approaches taken - ie. multiple different focal length cameras on a mobile phone (given that the modern display is around 90% actual screen and around 6 inches in height - it would make sense to have two groups of lenses - 3, 5? at either end of the device to capture a degree of stereopsis - near Porro I binocular type levels).

Bird photography is still going to require a long focal length lens and dedicated system for the foreseeable future though. I can see a properly implemented curved 1" or curved MFT in concert with diffractive optics AND computational photography giving APS-C lots of trouble. In fact I think the only thing APS-C has going for it is the crop factor with FF long lenses for distant /small subjects (Nikon's new 500mm f5.6 PF and 600 hopefully will breathe some new life into DX bodies in this regard) . When the light really drops there's no substitute for full frame, but a computational curved diffractive 1" / MFT could take care of ~80% of duties in a much lighter more portable format, and put APS-C in the shade.

I wonder what this new FF Mirrorless will weigh? It looks quite sizeable grip wise - which is a good thing when needed. I wish they'd devote some resources and innovation into a "Transformer" grip - all things to all people :) :t:



Chosun :gh:
 
Last edited:
Chosun Juan said:
Some more edited (lightened and enhanced) images and videos of the new Nikon FF Mirrorless, including some extrapolated dimensions, and highlighted features.
https://nikonrumors.com/2018/07/24/more-on-of-the-nikon-mirrorless-camera-teaser.aspx/

The official announcement is due 23rd August.
https://www.nikonrumors.co/nikon-full-frame-mirrorless-camera-to-be-announced-on-august-23/

Chosun :gh:
Click to expand...

The new design appears to have enough leeway to accommodate larger than full frame sensors. While that is surely helpful for low light optical performance, is bigger really still better for most camera buyers?
 
etudiant said:
The new design appears to have enough leeway to accommodate larger than full frame sensors. While that is surely helpful for low light optical performance, is bigger really still better for most camera buyers?
Click to expand...
I would think that market would be rather limited - especially once you have to start paying for the expensive (and non-existent at this time) glass that goes with it. I don't think I've ever known a landscape to 'spook' at the click of a shutter :)

I think the ability to accommodate larger than FF sensors (if any) is the function of Nikon setting this new mount up to be a high performer with fast wide angle lenses ..... way back at the start of this that was one of their stated core aims.

I'm interested in one of their other stated core aims - notably AF performance ..... the rumour mill has it that they're 'only' targeting the Sony AR7III in that regard - and while pretty good, it's not known as the best on the market (A9, and DSLR D5, and IDX MkII being better in that regard - but also lower resolution too)

It will be interesting to see if the new 5 and 6?00 PF lenses come out in a native Z mount (surely!?!) and how these perform in practice ...... especially if Nikon follows up with a high MP DX sibling (though I think rumours had it around 24 rather than 30MP or more) ....... :cat:



Chosun :gh:
 
Jeez, while the DPReview comment section seems to have gone into meltdown (1000+ and counting) , I had a poke around on the Australian access version of the Official Nikon website - and ...... Nada !

Depending on your access route, you really have to dig through the site to turn up the News release of 25th July 2018 :
https://www.nikon.com/news/2018/0725_mirrorless_01.htm

It's a completely wishy-washy statement full of flowery generalizations of no real informative value.

Of great concern ! is this little snippet :- "Additionally, a new mount adapter is being developed for the new mirrorless camera."

"being" !!! developed :eek!:

I would have thought this was a MUST HAVE at launch - maybe even as a promotional giveaway or limited time bundled special......perhaps Nikon has other ideas ....... :cat:

I hope the launch (and product ! :) gets better from here :brains:




Chosun :gh:
 
etudiant said:
The new design appears to have enough leeway to accommodate larger than full frame sensors. While that is surely helpful for low light optical performance, is bigger really still better for most camera buyers?
Click to expand...

The only USP for a Nikon mirrorless camera at that size, would be a larger sensor. If the rumors are correct and the bayonet is 65mm, it's possible.

Fuji film GFX bayonet diameter is 65mm (internet spec) and the Hasselblad X1D diameter is 61mm.

Medium format (or close to) would make the Nikon interesting, otherwise, it's just another mirrorless camera, 5 years too late.
 
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