Join for FREE
It only takes a minute!
More discoveries. NEW: Zeiss Victory SF 32

Welcome to BirdForum.
BirdForum is the net's largest birding community, dedicated to wild birds and birding, and is absolutely FREE! You are most welcome to register for an account, which allows you to take part in lively discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.

Problem with Zeiss 8x42 FL

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread
Old Tuesday 22nd February 2005, 11:05   #1
devon.birder
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Tiverton
Posts: 1,466
Problem with Zeiss 8x42 FL

Last month I bought a pair of Zeiss Victory 8x42 to replace my Zeizz 8x56. Whilst these bins are excellent I have noticed a very annoying problem with the focusing knob in that if you are not carefull it tends to lift and before you realise it you have altered the Diopter adjustment. This has happened several times now and I am wondering whether this is a fault with my pair or whether I just have to be more carefull when I focus. Roger
devon.birder is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Tuesday 22nd February 2005, 11:13   #2
Andrew Rowlands
Registered User
 
Andrew Rowlands's Avatar

 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Wales.
Posts: 5,971
Could this be related to the way you lift them from the case, Roger?

Andy.
Andrew Rowlands is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2004 2005 2006 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Tuesday 22nd February 2005, 12:37   #3
devon.birder
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Tiverton
Posts: 1,466
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Rowlands
Could this be related to the way you lift them from the case, Roger?

Andy.
Hi Andy. I have not put the bins in the case since I bought them so it can't be that. It must be something in the way I focus that is causing this problem though. I only notice that the focusing knob has lifted when what I am looking at appears to be out of focus. Roger
devon.birder is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Tuesday 22nd February 2005, 15:42   #4
Curtis Croulet
Registered User
 
Curtis Croulet's Avatar

 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Temecula, California
Posts: 1,294
I have found myself inadvertantly adjusting the diopter setting rather than focusing. I think it's usually a result of grabbing them wrong when picking them up, but also it appears that a chance bump in just the right orientation can also cause this. It's rare, but when it happens, it's a nuisance. The less elegant diopter adjustment on my lowly Eagle Optics bin (a collar around the right eyepiece) hasn't budged in the 2-1/2 years since I set it. Fortunately, the diopter adjustment of the Zeiss is precise and repeatable, so I can dial in my preferred setting and know that it's going to be right.
Curtis Croulet is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Tuesday 22nd February 2005, 16:25   #5
Scott Poynter
Registered User

 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Hertford
Posts: 6
Hi Roger,
I tried a new pair of these at Cleyspy and found exactly the same problem.The lock seemed to come loose very easily.I wasn't sure if it was just the pair that had been handled a lot in the shop.It seems not.
Scott.
Scott Poynter is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Tuesday 22nd February 2005, 17:00   #6
Leif
Registered Member

 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 2,959
Quote:
Originally Posted by devon.birder
Last month I bought a pair of Zeiss Victory 8x42 to replace my Zeizz 8x56. Whilst these bins are excellent I have noticed a very annoying problem with the focusing knob in that if you are not carefull it tends to lift and before you realise it you have altered the Diopter adjustment. This has happened several times now and I am wondering whether this is a fault with my pair or whether I just have to be more carefull when I focus. Roger
You could contact the dealer and compare with other samples and see if it is faulty? FWIW I have never had that problem on mine.

Leif
Leif is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2004 2005 2006 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Tuesday 22nd February 2005, 22:06   #7
Swissboy
Registered User
BF Supporter 2020
 
Swissboy's Avatar

 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Sempach, Switzerland
Posts: 3,769
Quote:
Originally Posted by devon.birder
Last month I bought a pair of Zeiss Victory 8x42 to replace my Zeizz 8x56. Whilst these bins are excellent I have noticed a very annoying problem with the focusing knob in that if you are not carefull it tends to lift and before you realise it you have altered the Diopter adjustment. This has happened several times now and I am wondering whether this is a fault with my pair or whether I just have to be more carefull when I focus. Roger
This has been a problem with my Victory I. I thought Zeiss had eliminated it for the new model. It's a shame they did not come up with a better solution. I never ever have had such a problem with the Leica Trinovid. And Leica (also in the Ultravids) has that convenient dial for immediate checking. In the Zeiss, one always has to lift the focus knob to check the setting.
__________________
Robert
--PS: That's a Sooty Falcon on the avatar, photo taken near Sharm el Sheik, Egypt. My highest priority raptor at the time.
What's your species on the avatar? I often have no clue
!
Swissboy is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 2011 2012 2013 2014 2015 2016 2017 2018 2019 2020 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Wednesday 23rd February 2005, 01:06   #8
Rich N
Registered User

 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: California
Posts: 237
I've not had the problem with my Zeiss 10x42 FL.

The thread title mentions 8x42 FL but in the binocular is called a Victory. Is the binocular in question an FL?

Rich
Rich N is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 23rd February 2005, 04:04   #9
Curtis Croulet
Registered User
 
Curtis Croulet's Avatar

 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Temecula, California
Posts: 1,294
My own post is about the 8x42 T* FL, as it is designated on a small nameplate on the ventral side of the bin. After some wavering on the name of this product, the US distributor has apparently settled on "Victory FL" in their latest advertising. I generally love the bin, but the cited problem with the focus/diopter knob is an occasional nuisance.
Curtis Croulet is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 23rd February 2005, 08:35   #10
devon.birder
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Tiverton
Posts: 1,466
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich N
I've not had the problem with my Zeiss 10x42 FL.

The thread title mentions 8x42 FL but in the binocular is called a Victory. Is the binocular in question an FL?

Rich
The model is 8x42 T FL. On the instruction book it also says Fernglaser Victory.
I hope I bought the new model!!!. Roger
devon.birder is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 23rd February 2005, 12:10   #11
Leif
Registered Member

 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 2,959
Quote:
Originally Posted by devon.birder
The model is 8x42 T FL. On the instruction book it also says Fernglaser Victory.
I hope I bought the new model!!!. Roger
Roger: If it is loose, then I would not be happy given the price, so maybe a word with Zeiss is in order? If it is marked Fl then it is the new model.

Leif

Last edited by Leif : Wednesday 23rd February 2005 at 12:38.
Leif is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2004 2005 2006 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Wednesday 23rd February 2005, 13:43   #12
devon.birder
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Tiverton
Posts: 1,466
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leif
Roger: If it is loose, then I would not be happy given the price, so maybe a word with Zeiss is in order? If it is marked Fl then it is the new model.

Leif
Hi Leif. I have already received a message from Zeiss suggesting that I send them back so that their Engineer can check them out, they obviously monitor Bird Forums. They also suggest that I bring them to the Bird Fair in August when their Engineer will be present. I do not think that anything can be done it is how they are designed that is at fault, I will just have to make sure when focusing that I do not raise the focus knob but it is an irritation all the same. Apart from that they are excellent bins. Roger
devon.birder is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 23rd February 2005, 21:50   #13
Swissboy
Registered User
BF Supporter 2020
 
Swissboy's Avatar

 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Sempach, Switzerland
Posts: 3,769
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich N
I've not had the problem with my Zeiss 10x42 FL.
The thread title mentions 8x42 FL but in the binocular is called a Victory. Is the binocular in question an FL?
Rich
The older Victory models have a 40 mm lens opening, the FLs have 42. So it's easy to tell.

Nevertheless, I wonder why Zeiss decided to keep the Victory name at this point. Just FL would have been clearer, and there would not have been this link to the not so optimal predecessors. But this is likely to be only a temporary problem. So I guess Zeiss is (rightfully) assuming that a catchy name can be kept for the future.
__________________
Robert
--PS: That's a Sooty Falcon on the avatar, photo taken near Sharm el Sheik, Egypt. My highest priority raptor at the time.
What's your species on the avatar? I often have no clue
!
Swissboy is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 2011 2012 2013 2014 2015 2016 2017 2018 2019 2020 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Wednesday 23rd February 2005, 22:06   #14
photo1
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 18
I tried a pair in my local bino store and they had the same problem. I accidentally lifted the diopter adjustment more than once trying them out.
photo1 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 23rd February 2005, 23:49   #15
Curtis Croulet
Registered User
 
Curtis Croulet's Avatar

 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Temecula, California
Posts: 1,294
Quote:
Originally Posted by devon.birder
Hi Leif. I have already received a message from Zeiss suggesting that I send them back so that their Engineer can check them out, they obviously monitor Bird Forums.
Sounds like the UK office monitors Bird Forum, whereas the US office does not. The knob problem sounds like a design bug. Funny -- you'd think this problem would have been discovered long ago, considering that it dates back to the original Victory line.
Curtis Croulet is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 24th February 2005, 18:15   #16
Otto McDiesel

 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curtis Croulet
Sounds like the UK office monitors Bird Forum, whereas the US office does not. The knob problem sounds like a design bug. Funny -- you'd think this problem would have been discovered long ago, considering that it dates back to the original Victory line.
Would a piece of sticky tape fix that?
Otto McDiesel is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 24th February 2005, 18:20   #17
devon.birder
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Tiverton
Posts: 1,466
Quote:
Originally Posted by Otto McDiesel
Would a piece of sticky tape fix that?
It may do but having just spent 900+ I am not inclined to correct a fault in the design by using sticky tape. Would you?. Roger
devon.birder is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 24th February 2005, 18:40   #18
Otto McDiesel

 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,121
Quote:
Originally Posted by devon.birder
It may do but having just spent 900+ I am not inclined to correct a fault in the design by using sticky tape. Would you?. Roger
Uhh...probably not. I would be pi ed. But if you otherwise like the binoculars...
Can you retun them and get a Leica or Svaro?
Maybe you can sell them and replace them with Leica. You might loose $$$ in this deal.

There may be a behavioral correction to that problem though. It may take a while to get used to, but how about checking that focus all the time? Before you know it will become an automatic subconsient move that you do with a finger from time to time. I have never handled the new Zeiss binoiculars, but maybe a finger push and/or check move may be ok. I hunt sometimes, or shoot targets, and my finger just goes and checks the safety on the firearm all the time, without me even thinking about it. Similarly, i always keep the muzzle of the firearm pointed towards the sky, but i don't think about this anymore. You get my drift...

This discussion really narrows my choice down. I will buy a pair this year (hopefully soon, as i will start surveying sparrows in New Mexico in April), and i was thinking of trying 10X42 Zeiss FL, 10x42 Ultravid, 10x42 EL, and 8.5x42 EL. I guess Zeiss is out now.
What in the world is going on at Zeiss? You would think that those suckers designing the binoculars would actually use them and try them!
Otto McDiesel is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 24th February 2005, 19:03   #19
Ben O
Registered User

 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Croydon
Posts: 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Otto McDiesel

This discussion really narrows my choice down. I will buy a pair this year (hopefully soon, as i will start surveying sparrows in New Mexico in April), and i was thinking of trying 10X42 Zeiss FL, 10x42 Ultravid, 10x42 EL, and 8.5x42 EL. I guess Zeiss is out now.
What in the world is going on at Zeiss? You would think that those suckers designing the binoculars would actually use them and try them!
I find it surprising that you should dismiss these binos so easily but I find it even more amazing that you should come down so hard on Zeiss when every bino has it's own 'flaw' of some description.

Personally, I have had the focus wheel cover lift up 3 times in several months of extensive use but other than a mild curse at th time, it hasn't bothered me at all. I have a friend whose Swaro EL cover lifts regularly but the knob just free-wheels rather than changes the dioptre setting.

Ben
Ben O is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2006 2007 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Thursday 24th February 2005, 19:37   #20
Leif
Registered Member

 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 2,959
Quote:
Originally Posted by Otto McDiesel
Uhh...probably not. I would be pi ed. But if you otherwise like the binoculars...
Can you retun them and get a Leica or Svaro?
Maybe you can sell them and replace them with Leica. You might loose $$$ in this deal.

There may be a behavioral correction to that problem though. It may take a while to get used to, but how about checking that focus all the time? Before you know it will become an automatic subconsient move that you do with a finger from time to time. I have never handled the new Zeiss binoiculars, but maybe a finger push and/or check move may be ok. I hunt sometimes, or shoot targets, and my finger just goes and checks the safety on the firearm all the time, without me even thinking about it. Similarly, i always keep the muzzle of the firearm pointed towards the sky, but i don't think about this anymore. You get my drift...

This discussion really narrows my choice down. I will buy a pair this year (hopefully soon, as i will start surveying sparrows in New Mexico in April), and i was thinking of trying 10X42 Zeiss FL, 10x42 Ultravid, 10x42 EL, and 8.5x42 EL. I guess Zeiss is out now.
What in the world is going on at Zeiss? You would think that those suckers designing the binoculars would actually use them and try them!
Then you had better avoid Nikon, Leica and Swarovski too because of reports from owners on BF. Oh yes, and Swift. And Bushnell. Better avoid them all to be safe.

The safest way to buy any binocular is from a shop and examine the one you intend to buy before you hand over the readies to the smiling sales people.

Leif
Leif is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2004 2005 2006 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Thursday 24th February 2005, 20:20   #21
Pileatus
Registered User

 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: USA
Posts: 2,641
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leif
Then you had better avoid Nikon, Leica and Swarovski too because of reports from owners on BF. Oh yes, and Swift. And Bushnell. Better avoid them all to be safe.

The safest way to buy any binocular is from a shop and examine the one you intend to buy before you hand over the readies to the smiling sales people.

Leif
Leif,

I disagree with your generalizations. My Ultravid started with a somewhat stiff focus that is now very comfortable to use. That was a break-in issue only. The mechanics of the Ultravid (diopter setting, IPD setting, eyecup design and manipulation) perform flawlessly. The strap and strap placement on the bin are extremely well designed and comfortable to use. In short, it's mechanically perfect IMO.

If you recall, I commented on the Zeiss diopter problem during the original discussion, but after the onslaught I received I refused to discuss it further. Apparently, my initial observations were well founded.

John
Pileatus is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 24th February 2005, 20:52   #22
devon.birder
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Tiverton
Posts: 1,466
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leif
Then you had better avoid Nikon, Leica and Swarovski too because of reports from owners on BF. Oh yes, and Swift. And Bushnell. Better avoid them all to be safe.

The safest way to buy any binocular is from a shop and examine the one you intend to buy before you hand over the readies to the smiling sales people.

Leif
I tried the 10x42 Zeiss at Cley Spy and before I bought the 8x42 Zeiss the next day at RSPB shop at Titchwell I spent sometime looking at the Redpolls there. It was not until I had returned to Devon and was out birding that I suddenly found that I could not focus the bins. As you say now that I know the problem I will be extra carefull when I turn the focus wheel and hopefully it will not be too much of a problem. Roger
devon.birder is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 24th February 2005, 21:11   #23
Ben O
Registered User

 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Croydon
Posts: 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Traynor
If you recall, I commented on the Zeiss diopter problem during the original discussion, but after the onslaught I received I refused to discuss it further. Apparently, my initial observations were well founded.

John
I well remember your review of the FL and you mentioned the focus wheel 'poor dioptre design and focus too fast' but I don't remember you elaborating on that, even after Leif had asked you for some detail on the nature of the diopter problem. Maybe it's on another thread.

It doesn't seem like a widespread problem, though I can imagine it would be worse for those who regularly use the carrying case. In fact I can't
easily replicate it at the moment with two fingers on the focus knob and using quite a bit of force.

Ben
Ben O is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2006 2007 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Thursday 24th February 2005, 21:56   #24
Leif
Registered Member

 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 2,959
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Traynor
Leif,

I disagree with your generalizations. My Ultravid started with a somewhat stiff focus that is now very comfortable to use. That was a break-in issue only. The mechanics of the Ultravid (diopter setting, IPD setting, eyecup design and manipulation) perform flawlessly. The strap and strap placement on the bin are extremely well designed and comfortable to use. In short, it's mechanically perfect IMO.

If you recall, I commented on the Zeiss diopter problem during the original discussion, but after the onslaught I received I refused to discuss it further. Apparently, my initial observations were well founded.

John
John. I don't understand the point you are making. Are you saying that because your sample of a binocular is perfect, then all samples from that manufacturer are perfect? Or that because you think the ergonomics are perfect, then everyone will think that they are perfect?

Regarding your review, I thought that it was grossly biased and so did numerous other people. I could have understood if you had disliked one or maybe two things. But according to you the 8x42 FL has poor DOF, a poor image with a very narrow sweet spot, poor build and ergonomics, a poor focus and a poor diopter. The only thing that you did not pan was the brightness presumably because you could not since Zeiss publish objective figures to prove high transmission. The irony is that recently we have someone (Justin) saying they he nearly did not try the FL due to the supposedly poor quality, only to find to his surprise that the criticisms were not valid, and he liked it so much that he bought one!!!

The fact that you gush over the Leica suggests that you are not by nature a hyper-critical person though you do seem to like to add negative comments on the Zeiss FL whenever possible.

On BF there have been mentions of rachety focus on many Leica Ultravids and Trinovids (all those I have tried were excellent) and several reports of Leica scopes (and I own one) breaking in two. I don't conclude that Leica mechanics are crap. My guess is that Leica mechanics are excellent but maybe one or two samples are not quite so good. Maybe 99.9% are perfect, who knows. Or maybe user abuse causes problem? Who knows. I could also mention problems with Nikon (weak eye tubes, armour wearing, faulty focus) and Swarovski (quite a few leaks including 2 or 3 owned by the same person leaking, a few complaints about a ratchety focus) and Swift Audubons (several accounts of leaking). We tend to hear about problems on BF.

Anyway, it seems that Zeiss have offered to check out the binocular to see if there is a fault/issue.

Leif
Leif is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2004 2005 2006 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Thursday 24th February 2005, 22:43   #25
Bill Atwood
Registered User
BF Supporter 2020

 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 857
Unfortunately my FLs have a touch of this problem also. However it doesn't happen often.

I'm totally with Leif on this one.
Bill Atwood is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2010 2011 2012 2013 2014 2015 2016 2017 2018 2019 2020 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Advertisement
Reply


Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
praise for Zeiss FL minimum interpupillary design efforts Alexis Powell Zeiss 7 Monday 11th September 2006 01:35
Comparison of 65mm Scopes: Zeiss vs. Swarovski aomcm Spotting Scopes & tripod/heads 2 Thursday 2nd March 2006 20:40
Problem with Zeiss Jena raven swift Zeiss 4 Tuesday 9th August 2005 19:56
Zeiss 8x42 FL vs Nikon 8x42 HGL laika Binoculars 16 Sunday 12th December 2004 23:41
Zeiss Diascope 85T and focusing problem Glen Anthony Ri Zeiss 6 Monday 6th October 2003 09:17

{googleads}

Fatbirder's Top 1000 Birding Websites

Help support BirdForum

Page generated in 0.29982090 seconds with 39 queries
All times are GMT. The time now is 14:04.