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ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

New Zeiss Spotting Scopes (1 Viewer)

new zoom makes the 85 version the best for cr-birding

With the new zoom Zeiss reaches the same cr-potential of the Nikon ED82 with the zoom, and hopefully with the bonus of better eye-relief - just did simple estimations and the AFOV of the new zoom is the same of the 3x zoom, both at maximum magnifications. This means that it result on the best 80-88mm scope for cr-birding.
I was hoping for a better AFOV on this eyepiece but a 3.75x is already an answer to my hopes (see it at http://www.pt-ducks.com/cr-telescopes.htm#Introduction). Unfortunately I can't adapt this zoom to my Optolyth: - Zeiss release a 100mm version (25-93.75x...) and I will be one of your clients... :-O
A 100mm version of one the top 5 brands it's also one of my expectations...
"Fanatics" of wide fields probably were expecting a zooming system of the photoscope, but it probably would be more expensive and heavy. I was more interested in the fact that it would easier to adapt a binoviewer.
Zeiss you can do all people happy by releasing a 100mm version with the zooming system of the photoscope...3:)

David
 
I know Zeiss has factories located in several countries around the world. I went to their factory/showroom in central Tokyo a few years ago to look at some opera bins that were not currently in stock at the usual shops. Besides medical equipment, it also appeared they were making small (micro?) lenses. The factory also has a sports optics department, but I think it is just a marketing and repair function.

Rick
 
Capture-Release? I think he needs high power to read the ID bands.

Rick
 
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Yeah, that's it, probably. Thanks Rick. I subsequently found this in the text:

"For cr-birding the main objective of your telescope is to have the best resolution at great distances. Ok, there are people reading colour rings with 10x binoculars or with a 20x eyepiece of a telescope but that’s not the most usual."
 
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CR == colour ring or in US Birding English "color band". But if he used cb you'd be really confused ;)

i.e. reading the rings (or bands) or VID tags of marked birds (ducks and geese in his case). Seattle Crows or Cooper's Hawks (in my case).

From David's pt-duck web site:

For cr-birding the main objective of your telescope is to have the best resolution at great distances. Ok, there are people reading colour rings with 10x binoculars or with a 20x eyepiece of a telescope but that’s not the most usual.

Well it is for me but in a urban area it's a bit easier. I really want a 15x Canon IS bin ;)

See http://www.cr-birding.be/ for more info.
 
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Aside from better internal baffling I wonder if the basic scope optics are changed at all in these new models. Apertures, focal lengths and the number of lens elements are all the same as the old Diascopes. I don't see any mention of a new optical design.
 
I've recently read where Meopta actually made the current Zeiss 85 T FL. Is this correct? I know Meopta supplies Zeiss with some glass, but if true didn't realize they actually made that spotter.
 
Has Zeiss dropped its long standing close relationship with Schott?
These two companies have been the pioneers of optics technology for a century plus and I thought they were still very close.
Schott formulated the glass and Zeiss calculated and built the lenses.
Asahi is the Japanese counterpart, as far as I know, but presumably Bosma has its own sources in China..
Schott does supply other binocular makers, such as IOR, but presumably makes more money today from flat panel substrates and related technology applications.
 
I don't see any mention of a new optical design.
Phew! Thanks for that, Henry. Now I won´t feel a need to splash out a fortune on a new scope, especially as I´ve just done so on new Swaros. As regards "yellow bias" mentioned in an earlier post, my Zeiss FL 85mm doesn´t show it when used with Baader zoom or fixed eyepieces.
 
Sancho,

I'll try to spoil your peace of mind a bit.

I don't think there was much need to tinker with the optical design of Diascopes anyway. Only with the quality of the implementation. It is not too much of an oversimplification to say that, assuming objective size remained the same, room for improvement was to be found in color balance, reduction of internal reflections and - in my view most importantly - production quality consistency. On my unrealistic wish-list would also have been the adoption of Fieldscope-type oversized offset Schmidt prism to make consistency easier to achieve.

Otherwise, possible improvements were in the area of usability and eyepieces, both of which break some new ground.

But we will only know after we have tried the beast.

And luckily for you, you can always just get the new zoom for a quarter of what the scope would cost.

Kimmo
 
Sancho,

I'll try to spoil your peace of mind a bit.


.................you can always just get the new zoom for a quarter of what the scope would cost.

Kimmo

You can´t spoil my peace of mind today, Kimmo, I´ve taken delivery of my new Swaros and I´m feeling terribly "Zen"....


Old scope, new eyepiece. Now there´s a thought. It´s a shame Nikon didn´t do that with the Fieldscopes, I´d have kept my old ED82A if the new EDG eyepieces had fitted. I can´t wait to see the reviews you guys do on the new Zeiss vario-eyepieces. If I understand correctly, this means they have two magnifications, but "switch" rather than "zoom" from the lower to the higher, in the manner of Leica Duovid binos?
 
If I understand correctly, this means they have two magnifications, but "switch" rather than "zoom" from the lower to the higher, in the manner of Leica Duovid binos?

No, it is just a new zoom, which "goes to eleven"... I mean up to 75x, without significantly sacrificing the FOV at 20x. IMO that is an amazing accomplishment if they have been able to maintain good image quality and viewing comfort. I couldn't find any information about ER.

Kimmo - I think Zeiss have always called their zoom eyepiece a "vario".

Ilkka
 
Ilkka,

I have one Zeiss binocular catalog from 2004 and one Diascope brochure in English, and both call the 20-60x eyepiece a zoom. The brochure on the web right now calls both the old and the new zooms "Vario" eyepieces. So at least they have not been perfectly consistent about what they call them. But you are right, I may have read more into the Vario bit than it warrants.

On eye-relief, since the photos of the eyepieces standing side-by-side in the web-brochure seem to be in scale, one can measure/estimate the new vario to have an eyelens diameter perhaps 10% smaller than the old zoom. Since the field of view is almost but not quite as wide at 20x, eye-relief is likely to be very similar to the old zoom, perhaps slightly less.

Just enjoying speculation.

Kimmo
 
I don't think there was much need to tinker with the optical design of Diascopes anyway. Only with the quality of the implementation. It is not too much of an oversimplification to say that, assuming objective size remained the same, room for improvement was to be found in color balance, reduction of internal reflections and - in my view most importantly - production quality consistency. On my unrealistic wish-list would also have been the adoption of Fieldscope-type oversized offset Schmidt prism to make consistency easier to achieve.

The question was more not that there is "optical redesign" as clearly thre is some changes because the glare is supposed to be reduced and the scope does weight a few ounces more. But clearly this isn't a "start from scratch" redesign probably more of a extensive series of tweaks.

Phew! Thanks for that, Henry. Now I won´t feel a need to splash out a fortune on a new scope, especially as I´ve just done so on new Swaros. As regards "yellow bias" mentioned in an earlier post, my Zeiss FL 85mm doesn´t show it when used with Baader zoom or fixed eyepieces.

Having recently used a 85 FL on teh CBC (Lotutec version maybe 2 years old with a Vario EP) and noticed no yellow bias. And recently bought a second hand pre-Lotutec 65 FL (and Hyperion Zoom plus various 1.25" astro EPs) and noticed just a little warmish bias. I suspect this is due to changes in coatings over time and is perhaps more emphasized when you have both older "tubes" and older Varios. Add that to personal sensitivities and you can see why we have such a range of perceptions of the scopes color bias. Still I was susprised given the "neutral to cold" view of the Zeiss FL bins and the slightly warmer views of both scopes (though I'd say the 85 I tried was close to neutral).

It also made me more cognizant of color biases in a couple of other ED scopes I own -- perhaps haps more stacking them up and looking through them one after the other to see the effect. Clearly I need a Kowa or a Swaro as a reference ;)

And yes the Meopta "yellow bias" connection crossed my mind too!

Sancho: how old is your 85 FL? If others want to chime in perhaps collecting serials (as we did for Nikon SEs) might clarify things a bit.

On eye-relief, since the photos of the eyepieces standing side-by-side in the web-brochure seem to be in scale, one can measure/estimate the new vario to have an eyelens diameter perhaps 10% smaller than the old zoom. Since the field of view is almost but not quite as wide at 20x, eye-relief is likely to be very similar to the old zoom, perhaps slightly less.

Zeiss seem pretty cognizant of ER so I doubt that's something they'd drop for the extra zoom especially in the mid range where you really need to.

It is interesting though that Swaro and Leica have zigged (with 25x-50x "double" range zooms and long ER at all settings) and Zeiss have zagged to "more than triple" 20x-75x and I (hope) acceptable ER at all zooms.

I guess which the folks prefer will become clear.
 
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