orbitaljump
Well-known member
All Im showing is a 7x35 Neptune Mark II.
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Swift historians (1 Viewer)
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elkcub
Silicon Valley, California
Correct. That's the US model that was called a "Neptune." (There are at least two.) Swift-Pyser imported and distributed somewhat different models in the UK and Europe, one of which was the 7x50 Neptune Mk I. I don't think we got any on this side of the big pond.
Ed
orbitaljump
Well-known member
Yeah, Im not up on the European models.
The one Im showing is in a 1969 catalog.
The one Im showing is in a 1969 catalog.
elkcub
Silicon Valley, California
It's all somewhat confusing. Except for the Audubon, the European and American lineups were not exactly the same. In fact, even with the Audubons, Type 2 was distributed in North America, and Type 3 was distributed in Europe. The optics were the same but the focus knob location was different. In addition, the manufacturer, Hiyoshi Kogaku, made binoculars for other companies that looked very similar. I have an 8x40 Linet Fieldmaster, for example, with 12 deg. FOV that looks just like a Type 2 Swift. That's a extra-wide-angle apparent field of 8 * 12 = 96 deg., — and it has big Bak4 prisms.
Ed
Ed
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elkcub
Silicon Valley, California
Hi Adrian,
Your Saratoga was made in 1968, as indicated by the first two digits of the s/n. The 1969 Swift catalog says it has a FOV=393', close focus of 25', and weighs 24.7 oz. It was marketed for $63.95 (vs. $132 for the Audubon). That would be $370.28 today, which isn't too shabby.
Hope that helps,
Ed
Your Saratoga was made in 1968, as indicated by the first two digits of the s/n. The 1969 Swift catalog says it has a FOV=393', close focus of 25', and weighs 24.7 oz. It was marketed for $63.95 (vs. $132 for the Audubon). That would be $370.28 today, which isn't too shabby.
Hope that helps,
Ed
Simon S
Well-known member
Nice to be back, here is a classic early Swift for you!
http://www.flickr.com/photos/binoculars/3990000691/in/set-72157613812824211/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/binoculars/3990000691/in/set-72157613812824211/
elkcub
Silicon Valley, California
Hi Simon,
That's interesting. The first "Swift" binoculars, I believe, were sold by Swift & Anderson (S&A) and imported from France and Germany back in the early 1930s. These were all of so-called "German" design and later given a catalog designation of Z (for Zeiss). S&A also imported the Hensoldt Dialyt line into the US.
Japanese made products were imported by S&A in the early 1950s, but I have no record of a Toko 7x50. It may have been among the oldest Japanese imports, as you suggest, but it's not the oldest Swift by any means.
Looking at the second binocular, incidentally, an "American pattern" (named after B&L type binoculars) 8x30 Apollo of Japanese origin was marketed by S&A as early as 1959. However, the one shown was from Swift Instruments, Inc. in 1967. By 1969 the Apollo was no longer in the Swift catalog.
Ed
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Ardy
Well-known member
Are these made by Swift?
Just saw these,and was wondering if they're a Swift?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300411676329&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT
Just saw these,and was wondering if they're a Swift?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300411676329&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT
elkcub
Silicon Valley, California
I doubt it. My guess is that these date to the late 1950s or early 1960s. German pattern binoculars sold by Swift during that period did not include a 7x50 "Saratoga." Their 7x50 model was the #788 "Nighthawk," which had a slightly larger field of view of 376'. The Swift model #801 Saratoga of that era was an 8x40 and had an American pattern body (see posts #66±3).
It is possible, of course, that the same Japanese company that made the binocular on eBay also made the Swift Nighthawk, but I wouldn't count on it.
Ed
It is possible, of course, that the same Japanese company that made the binocular on eBay also made the Swift Nighthawk, but I wouldn't count on it.
Ed
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James Bean
Well-known member
Ed, guess what I've just bought? It's compact and bijou, perfectly formed, is a clone of a rubber armoured Zeiss 8x30BGA (even to identical body ribbing) except it's a 7x35, an fov of 428ft at 1000yds, it's a J-B 35, has the unusual (for a Swift) serial no. Z201362, has a gold spot, is a roof prism model, yet has the name of a famous ornithologist, with a genuine Swift velvet-lined black soft leather case, all in mint condition, made in Japan. It looks like a smaller version of my Zeiss 10x40 BGAT*; even the zip cases are similar. I wonder where Swift got the idea from! So, it's an ..........?
Kevin Purcell
Well-known member
Any photos of that one, James?
James Bean
Well-known member
James Bean
Well-known member
Have you got it yet? The two focus wheels on the Swift seem at first sight to have the same functions as those on the Zeiss, but the front one on the Zeiss is a dioptre adjuster, while the Swift has a separate dioptre ring on the right ocular, so the Swift's two focus rings are... twin focus controls, revolving together, so you use whichever is the handier. The Swift also has the legend "Immersion Tested", presumably meaning it's fully waterproof, and it appears to be made mostly of metal. If any further clue is needed, go to the Swift Historical document, near the end, where it refers to roof prism models (pp.21-22).
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elkcub
Silicon Valley, California
Hi James,
I have not the slightest idea where Swift got its inspiration for these 7x35 Model 825 Audubons. It must have been a coincidence. J-B 35 corresponds with the manufacturer Raito Koki Seisakujo Co. Ltd. - Lite Koki Seisakujo Co. Ltd, incidentally, so at that time (c. 1989) they didn't use Hiyoshi Kogaku, JB-56. I've handled a pair, but I think Renze owns one. How do you like it?
Swift went off in a couple of strange roof prism directions in search of a worthy Audubon before settling on the Model 828 8.5x44 HHS in 2000—which was made by Hiyoshi Kogaku.
A few years earlier the short lived 8.5x44 Model 827 showed up (c. 1999), which was unquestionably a colossal design mistake by Hiyoshi. What most people don't know is that there was also a sister 8x35 mistake made in the same time period by Hiyoshi, and also called an Audubon. (Unfortunately, I missed out on the auction and could only capture the pictures.)
I don't know the model number for the 8x35 and never saw an ad or flier that mentioned it, but, nonetheless, here it is for all to see. As Renze commented back in 2007, "It must be the rarest Audubon in the world."
Ed
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Renze de Vries
Well-known member
Well phrased Ed, that's about it.
Indeed I bought a 7x35 Audubon model 825 some time ago, but don't own it anymore. It's well made, looks good but optically it's rather typical of most of the midprized roofs of the past century: it sucks imagewise. An interesting feature though - which is also applied to model 827 and probably to the mysterious 8x35 too - is the way it is made waterproof: the ocular lenses move behind a mirror.
To add all information I've got about model 825, I can say that indeed the serial number doesn't give a clue about the year of production. Also, the number is sometimes preceded by a Z like in James' specimen, but I've seen other letters as well, notably B and C. And lastly, there are small differences in appearance of the 7x35 Audubon: some are without the gold badge, and some have Audubon735 on the left prism housing.
Renze
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James Bean
Well-known member
Ed, How do I like my Swift Audubon 825 ? I love it ! Classic design and elegance (unlike the model 827 which appears styled by a Klingon on a bad day) plus a rarity value which affords the quiet satisfaction (smugness?) of knowing I probably won't ever see another one in my lifetime. I couldn't believe my luck when I came across it on UK eBay; I had a bidding contest to contend with, but emerged victorious for the sum of £119 (c. $190). A very similar looking Zeiss 8x30BGA went for over £500, so I'm happy with my bargain. I've always admired the Zeiss ClassiC look (orig. Dialyt) and now I have a nice little Swift to complement my 10x40BGAT*. Do your records indicate when this 825 was made? It's probably around 1989 to the mid 1990s (unlike most other Swifts, the serial number does not give a clue of its production year). As to optical performance, it's not phase coated but then neither is my Zeiss 10x40, and I'm more than happy with that, so the 825 will be good enough. Ergonomically it's very nice and 'feels expensive'. The two focus wheels were a surprise, but a good idea, and I find myself using right or left fingers as the mood takes me. The right ocular dioptre adjustment is nicely firm, so it won't slip. The general cosmetic finish is exemplary, up there with the Alphas, where it was no doubt intended. To quote an old adage, 'it oozes quality and inspires confidence'. I can hardly claim the 825 has a better view than the 'real' Audubon 804, but for its size the 825's a little gem. No doubt about it, I'll be keeping this one...
Renze, I've just seen your post, so thanks for the extra information, but I'm not so sure I'd agree with your comment that 'the image sucks'. It's not 21st century dielectric ED standard but, so far, so good, it seems sharp enough for my modest purposes...
Renze, I've just seen your post, so thanks for the extra information, but I'm not so sure I'd agree with your comment that 'the image sucks'. It's not 21st century dielectric ED standard but, so far, so good, it seems sharp enough for my modest purposes...
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Audubon 7x35
I don't own a pre-1970 Audubon (yet, he says). Here's what I have:
Swift 825 7x35 Audubon #Z201052 (B35).
It is a remarkably comfortable binocular to use, and is currently on loan to one of my Natural History graduate students who has just taken up birding. I chose it over my other loaners--an Eaglet 7x36, Osprey 7.5 x 44, and B&L Zephyr 7x35.
They are my first choice for backpacking and canoeing, and just seem to be a little less finicky than the Eaglet, although obviously without the butterfly-on-your-boot close focus of the latter.
I thought the design was a rather obvious attempt to go head to head with the Germans.
I don't own a pre-1970 Audubon (yet, he says). Here's what I have:
Swift 825 7x35 Audubon #Z201052 (B35).
It is a remarkably comfortable binocular to use, and is currently on loan to one of my Natural History graduate students who has just taken up birding. I chose it over my other loaners--an Eaglet 7x36, Osprey 7.5 x 44, and B&L Zephyr 7x35.
They are my first choice for backpacking and canoeing, and just seem to be a little less finicky than the Eaglet, although obviously without the butterfly-on-your-boot close focus of the latter.
I thought the design was a rather obvious attempt to go head to head with the Germans.
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