Western Kingbird or Cassin's Kingbird? (1 Viewer)

A

AdamfromCanada

Well-known member

• Jan 29, 2019

• #1

I believe this bird (spotted last week in Griffith Park in Los Angeles) is a Western Kingbird, but thought I'd check with the experts in here as it's crossing the range of the Cassin's there...

Thoughts?

And while I have you here, the second bird is puzzling me. Looks junco-esque...but doesn't match. I appreciate the help on this ID.

 

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A

arcadillor

Well-known member

• Jan 29, 2019

• #2

Cassin's kingbird and California towhee

 

A

AdamfromCanada

Well-known member

• Jan 29, 2019

• #3

arcadillor said:

Cassin's kingbird and California towhee

Click to expand...

Thanks - what's the indicator for Cassin's? I thought the colouring looked relatively light...

 

A

arcadillor

Well-known member

• Jan 29, 2019

• #4

white edge of tail not extend to tip

 

Jeff Hopkins

Just another...observer

• Jan 29, 2019

• #5

I think the breast/throat is kind of washed out in the photo. But you can see the area just below the eyes is pure white while the breast is greyer. That's another Cassin's feature.

 

T

THE_FERN

Well-known member

Opus Editor

• Jan 30, 2019

• #6

Disclaimer: I've not personally seen either of these species. Most refs suggest that Cassin's has an all-dark tail which may show a buff or whitish tip, and that Western shows white outer tail feathers which may or may not be obvious. They also note the pale-edged wing coverts in Cassin's compared with Western where these are all dark.

However, web photos suggest the tail feather character is variable with some Cassin's showing variable amounts of white in the tail as here. In contrast, the coverts character appears fairly reliable. Since the coverts are pale it should be Cassin's. (Other characters like Cassin's white malar also seem to be variable.)

 

K

Kratter

Well-known member

• Jan 30, 2019

• #7

Looks fine for Western Kingbird. Cassin's may have a pale outer edge to the outer rectrices, but the whole web is white in this bird. The throat is too pale for Cassin's and it lacks the contrasting pale white malar.

Andy

 

KenM

Well-known member

• Jan 30, 2019

• #8

According to Sibley Western Kingbird would not be in range at this time of year?

I note that there are contrasting pale edges to greater coverts and median coverts, is this a feature for WK?

Looking at the white malar which is present...albeit it's efficacy is somewhat reduced by the sun bleaching to the chest?

Cheers

 

Larry Sweetland

Formerly 'Larry Wheatland'

• Jan 30, 2019

• #9

I think structurally it looks better for Cassin's. Chunkier bird, chunkier head, heavier looking bill. Agree colour looks washed out in this shot making it look more Westerny. ...but I don't live among these (wonderful) things.

 

njlarsen

Gallery Moderator

Opus Editor

Supporter

• Jan 30, 2019

• #10

I think it is relevant to pull up this thread for comparison: https://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=369105

My initial impression was Cassin but the end result was late Western. I am starting to think that the white area below the eye goes back too far behind the eye for Cassin also in the OP photo. Are there any additional photos?

Niels

 

Chris Benesh

So much work, so little time...so let's go birding

• Jan 31, 2019

• #11

Hi All,

Looking at the kingbird in its entirety should lead us to the conclusion that it is an overexposed, poorly lit Cassin's Kingbird. The slightly blockier head, strong edgings to the wing coverts, and dark charcoal gray crown (despite being well lit) suggest Cassin's. The tail looks just fine for species too, often showing extensive buff-white to the outer vane of the outermost feather, especially at this time of year. Status wise, we can get some clues too. Checking this heavily birded area on eBird reveals that a small number of Cassin's Kingbirds are wintering in and around Griffin Park, seen by multiple observers. Elsewhere in Los Angeles I saw half a dozen or so this past week without effort. There are no January records of Western Kingbird (aside from a sight record from the central valley) anywhere in the western United States where it is considered rare after September.

Chris