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Old Friday 5th November 2010, 19:14   #1
Peter Kovalik
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Parrots

Gerald Mayr, 2010. Parrot interrelationships - morphology and the new molecular phylogenies. Emu, In Press.
Abstract
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Old Thursday 14th July 2011, 20:12   #2
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Schweizer et al 2011

Schweizer, Seehausen & Hertwig 2011. Macroevolutionary patterns in the diversification of parrots: effects of climate change, geological events and key innovations. J Biogeogr: in press. [abstract] [supp info]
Also:
Schweizer, Seehausen, Güntert & Hertwig 2010. The evolutionary diversification of parrots supports a taxon pulse model with multiple trans-oceanic dispersal events and local radiations. Mol Phylogenet Evol 54(3): 984-994. [pdf]

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Old Sunday 11th September 2011, 08:49   #3
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L. Joseph et al

In review
Joseph, L., A. Toon, E. Schirtzinger, T.F. Wright, & R. Schodde. A revised nomenclature and classification for family-group taxa of parrots (Psittaciformes) as identified by recent systematic studies. Zootaxa.
http://biology-web.nmsu.edu/twright/...ght_CV2011.pdf
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Old Wednesday 12th October 2011, 15:36   #4
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Kundu et al

Kundu, Jones, Prys-Jones & Groombridge (in press). The evolution of the Indian Ocean parrots (Psittaciformes): extinction, adaptive radiation and eustacy. Mol Phylogenet Evol. [abstract]
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Old Wednesday 12th October 2011, 19:37   #5
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"Eustacy"? It took me a while to find out what that meant!
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Old Wednesday 12th October 2011, 19:48   #6
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"Eustacy"? It took me a while to find out what that meant!
Me too! My Oxford Dictionary of English gives 'eustasy' - which I haven't (yet) found a need to use in conversation either.
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Old Thursday 13th October 2011, 00:47   #7
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Me too! My Oxford Dictionary of English gives 'eustasy' - which I haven't (yet) found a need to use in conversation either.
Perhaps a bit before your time Richard: 'Useless Eustacy'?
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Old Thursday 13th October 2011, 07:29   #8
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'Useless Eustacy'?
That must be it, Mike.
http://www.politicalcartoon.co.uk/ga...5-1983_41.html
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Old Wednesday 1st February 2012, 16:39   #9
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Kundu et al 2012

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Originally Posted by Richard Klim View Post
Kundu, Jones, Prys-Jones & Groombridge (in press). The evolution of the Indian Ocean parrots (Psittaciformes): extinction, adaptive radiation and eustacy. Mol Phylogenet Evol. [abstract]
John Boyd (TiF):
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Old Monday 13th February 2012, 22:42   #10
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It's too bad Kundu et al. (2011) was accepted so uncritically by TiF.

The authors (Fig. 3 and p. 8) split up the subspecies of Long-tailed Parakeet, Psittacula longicauda and Red-breasted Parakeet, P.alexandri and:

- group longicauda longicauda in a clade with Blue-winged Parakeet, P. columboides and Layard's Parakeet, P. calthorpae

- unite alexandri fasciata in a clade with Lord Derby's Parakeet, P. derbiana

- unite alexandri alexandri in a clade with longicauda tytleri

- and embed Blue-backed Parrot, Tanygnathus sumatranus in Psittacula!

These new taxon pairs look nothing like each other, unlike the traditional arrangement. If this study is accepted, it would require the creation of at least 1 new species (P. fasciata), and Tanygnathus sumatranus would become Psittacula sumatrana.

Mascarinus, a monotypic genus comprising the extinct Mascarene Parrot, M. mascarinus of Réunion, is embedded in Coracopsis nigra, with C. n. barklyi of the Seychelles basal to mascarinus, and mascarinus basal to C. n. nigra + libs + siblians, indicating that M. mascarinus is either a subspecies of C. nigra, or that the nigra complex comprises 3 species. Neither conclusion is credible, although barklyi may warrant recognition as a separate species, and it's plausible that Mascarinus was allied to Coracopsis.

Having studied extinct birds for 10+ years, I maintain that Mascarinus was sufficiently distinct from Coracopsis that it should continue to be recognized as a separate genus. Compared to Coracopsis, Mascarinus had a relatively larger, red bill, a red iris and eye-ring, a black facial mask, a light gray head contrasting with a very dark gray (or brownish gray) body, and white bases to the lateral rectrices

Whether Coracopsis should be listed in the Psittacidae sequence after Psittrichras, as the authors indicate in Fig. 2, is also debatable, as the clade receives only weak support.

Thankfully, the IOC World List has not accepted the results of this study.

Rick

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Old Monday 13th February 2012, 23:33   #11
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Here is a painting supposedly drawn from the last Mascarinus mascarin which was alive and in Bavaria.
http://piclib.nhm.ac.uk/results.asp?image=004753 .
Although some people do not believe it was from a live bird.
http://julianhume.co.uk/wp-content/u...iscoveries.pdf .

I do not think the two drawings look that much alike.
Martinet's version:
http://www.biodiversitylibrary.org/i...ge/79/mode/1up .
They are obviously drawn with the bird in the same 3 dimensional space, but the area of the dark facial mask is a different shape in the two drawings and the eye color is dark in the one and light in the other.

Last edited by mb1848 : Tuesday 14th February 2012 at 00:02. Reason: more stuff
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Old Tuesday 14th February 2012, 00:18   #12
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Originally Posted by mb1848 View Post
Here is a painting supposedly drawn from the last Mascarinus mascarin which was alive and in Bavaria.
http://piclib.nhm.ac.uk/results.asp?image=004753 .
Although some people do not believe it was from a live bird.
http://julianhume.co.uk/wp-content/u...iscoveries.pdf .

I do not think the two drawings look that much alike.
Martinet's version:
http://www.biodiversitylibrary.org/i...ge/79/mode/1up .
They are obviously drawn with the bird in the same 3 dimensional space, but the area of the dark facial mask is a different shape in the two drawings and the eye color is dark in the one and light in the other.
Reply to 1st post (originally posted between mb1848's 2 posts, but mistakenly deleted; sorry!):
Actually, that painting, published in 1834, is a copy of an earlier painting by Martinet, published in 1779 that accompanied Buffon's description. According to Buffon, there was a specimen in the Cabinet du Roi (that may however have been a Coracopsis, as it was entirely brown and lacked the characteristic black facial mask and white at the base of the rectrices). However, in 1760 Brisson noted that he had seen a captive bird in Paris.

Reply to 2nd post
In both pictures, the iris is yellow. According to Brisson, the iris was red. If Martinet's illustration was based on a mounted specimen, it apparently had glass eyes of the wrong color.

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Old Tuesday 14th February 2012, 01:03   #13
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Wagler in 1832 said the bird from the Museum Paris had ac irides rubrae. Here is the picture from the Levaillant book.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ma...mascarinus.jpg . The eyes look brownish.?? It appears to me that this artist was drawing from life.

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Old Tuesday 14th February 2012, 03:45   #14
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Wagler in 1832 said the bird from the Museum Paris had ac irides rubrae. Here is the picture from the Levaillant book.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ma...mascarinus.jpg . The eyes look brownish.?? It appears to me that this artist was drawing from life.
The several misrepresented traits in Barraband's plate (Barraband was Levaillant's illustrator) indicate it was based on a mounted specimen with faded plumage, rather than a live bird. According to Brisson (who described a bird from life in 1760), and unlike Barraband's bird, the living bird had very dark gray plumage (with a contrasting light gray head), red irides and orbital skin, and flesh-colored legs. Moreover, Levaillant himself (1805) only reported the existence of 3 mounted specimens, but no living birds.

Another point regarding Martinet's plate: it depicts a bird with white at the base of all the rectrices. However, according to Brisson, the central rectrices were entirely dark brown, and only the lateral rectrices had white bases. According to Hume (2007), it's likely that the mounted specimen illustrated by Martinet was missing its central rectrices; if so, the artist mistakenly added them with white bases. Hahn's 1834 illustration copies the mistake.

Parrots (of unspecified species) were last recorded from Réunion in 1773. Whether Mascarinus still survived in the wild then, and if so, for how much longer, is unknown (Bory did not report it in 1801), but Mauduyt (1784) reported that there were a few captive birds living in Paris. All of these had died by the time Barraband painted his bird, though one of them, after it was mounted, probably served as the model for his plate.

Rick

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Old Wednesday 15th February 2012, 20:05   #15
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oof...yeah major taxonomic revision based on ONE GENE is not the way to go. Although it sounds like they may have been limited based on relying solely on museum specimens. Be nice to see how the inclusion of other genes and nuclear DNA effect the results
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Old Thursday 23rd February 2012, 19:05   #16
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Joseph et al 2012

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Originally Posted by Peter Kovalik View Post
In review
Joseph, L., A. Toon, E. Schirtzinger, T.F. Wright, & R. Schodde. A revised nomenclature and classification for family-group taxa of parrots (Psittaciformes) as identified by recent systematic studies. Zootaxa.
http://biology-web.nmsu.edu/twright/...ght_CV2011.pdf
Published 24 Feb 2012...
  • Joseph, Toon, Schirtzinger, Wright & Schodde 2012. A revised nomenclature and classification for family-group taxa of parrots (Psittaciformes). Zootaxa 3205: 26–40. [preview]
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Old Friday 24th February 2012, 08:23   #17
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Joseph, Toon, Schirtzinger, Wright & Schodde 2012. A revised nomenclature and classification for family-group taxa of parrots (Psittaciformes). Zootaxa 3205: 26–40.
Strigopidae
Nestoridae
Cacatuidae (Nymphicinae, Calyptorhynchinae, Cacatuinae)
Psittacidae (Psittacinae, Arinae)
Psittrichasidae (Psittrichasinae, Coracopseinae)
Psittaculidae (Platycercinae, Psittacellinae, Loriinae, Agapornithinae, Psittaculinae)
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Old Sunday 1st April 2012, 09:20   #18
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Psittaculinae

ICZN Case 3572, BZN 69(1): 51–55.
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Old Sunday 1st April 2012, 09:44   #19
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Wagler in 1832 said the bird from the Museum Paris had ac irides rubrae. Here is the picture from the Levaillant book.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ma...mascarinus.jpg . The eyes look brownish.?? It appears to me that this artist was drawing from life.
This is the Parisian bird
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Old Monday 2nd April 2012, 01:34   #20
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Thank you Justin for posting your Mascarinus mascarin photograph. The tail is very worn. I assume the eyeball is glass but it is light brown?
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Old Monday 2nd April 2012, 11:24   #21
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Thank you Justin for posting your Mascarinus mascarin photograph. The tail is very worn. I assume the eyeball is glass but it is light brown?
indeed you are correct, remember this specimen was collected at the Sonnerat voyage... so it is a very old specimen, that is why this wear is on the bird.
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Old Monday 2nd April 2012, 12:18   #22
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The Parisian bird was not collected on the Sonnerat voyage. In 1784, Mauduyt recorded that he had seen several Mascarinus mascarinus alive in Paris, and it is probably one of these captives that is preserved in Paris today.

The plumage has not only suffered from great age, but was probably also damaged by sulphuric acid used to fumigate the cases in the Paris museum in the 1790s. Hence, much of the tail and distal wing feathers have been destroyed. In addition, the skull was removed, which is why the head has a peculiar shape and the nostrils are missing.

In life, the iridies, cere, and bare skin around the eyes were red, like the bill.

Rick

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Old Tuesday 3rd April 2012, 06:55   #23
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The Parisian bird was not collected on the Sonnerat voyage. In 1784, Mauduyt recorded that he had seen several Mascarinus mascarinus alive in Paris, and it is probably one of these captives that is preserved in Paris today.

The plumage has not only suffered from great age, but was probably also damaged by sulphuric acid used to fumigate the cases in the Paris museum in the 1790s. Hence, much of the tail and distal wing feathers have been destroyed. In addition, the skull was removed, which is why the head has a peculiar shape and the nostrils are missing.

In life, the iridies, cere, and bare skin around the eyes were red, like the bill.

Rick
You are right Rick, was confused with the pigeon, that was collected on the Sonnerat vovage.
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Old Tuesday 3rd April 2012, 13:32   #24
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Understandable, Justin. The two came to the museum around the same time.

Although you and I both referred to the "Sonnerat voyage," he never led a voyage. Pierre Sonnerat was an artist who accompanied the traveler-naturalist Philibert Commerson on Bougainville's circumnavigatory expedition (1766-1769). Commerson remained on Mauritius in order to study the natural history of Madagascar and the Mascarenes. He died in Mauritius in 1773 after accumulating a huge trove of specimens and notes, which were brought back to Paris in 1774 by another of his artists, Paul Jossigny.

Only three 18th century bird specimens from the Mascarenes survive in the Paris museum today, a Masacrene Parrot, Mascarinus mascarinus, a Mauritius Blue Pigeon, Alectroenas nitidissima, and a Hoopoe (or Reunion Crested) Starling, Fregilupus varius. The origin of the parrot is uncertain, but the starling was probably collected by Commerson, and the pigeon either by Commerson or Sonnerat, who described the species in 1782 and presented the specimen to the museum. It's likely Sonnerat used Commerson's specimens and notes when compiling both of his books.

In addition, there are several drawings of extinct Mascarene birds in the Paris museum that were done by Jossigny, including the Hoopoe Starling (indicating that the specimen in Paris was collected by Commerson), the Mauritius Owl, Mascarenotus sauzieri, and the Rodrigues (or Newton's) Parakeet, Psittacula exsul.

Rick

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Old Wednesday 4th April 2012, 11:52   #25
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Only three 18th century bird specimens from the Mascarenes survive in the Paris museum today, a Masacrene Parrot, Mascarinus mascarinus, a Mauritius Blue Pigeon, Alectroenas nitidissima, and a Hoopoe (or Reunion Crested) Starling, Fregilupus varius.
Dear Rick, not completely correct as (but I researched not all full), the books in Paris indicate more specimens that should be still present for example Circus melanoleucus, Circus cinereus and Athene superciliaris (only did a small part of the books in research). They are all indicated as from Inde from Sonnerat. Did not check them in the collection however. Cheers, Justin
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