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Malaysian or Hodgson's Hawk Cuckoo? Singapore (1 Viewer)

jalid said:
How about these two identified as saturatus:

Kennerley P 1998: Oriental Cuckoos at Tuas, Singapore on 21st October and 2nd December 1995. Oriental Bird Club Bulletin 27 55-57.

In Tring collection there is an optatus with wing length 209 labelled Singapore, number NHM 81.5.1.3291, but for some reason there is no date in my notes.
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Yes I was told that Kennerley did some private ringing exercises at the reclaimed land at Tuas in the 1990s when he was based in Singapore. But I am not privy to his Oriental Cuckoo ringing records. So did his 2 ringing records nailed the ID conclusively?
 
Grahame Walbridge said:
Bryon, I cannot get your link to work. My earlier reference to no Australian records was to the mainland. Sorry, I should have made that absolutely clear. Indian Cuckoo is on the Australian List by virtue of a sole AOT record of a female on Cocos (Keeling) Is in Feb 2011-I'd hardly call that Australia.

There no records of Himalayan or Sunda.

Grahame
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Grahame,
we are talking about Ashmore Reef and Cartier Islands. A superb area for observing these birds with beautiful clear images. There is one, long pointed winged individual shown that looks like our own cuckoo. This probably would have been labelled horsefieldi/ii in the past. It has even reached New Zealand, before now. Also there are a number of records of H. varius from the region but inspite of the recent record from Oman they must owe more to skin trading routes than actual distribution. If Bruce from Brisbane said Fair Isle was not part of the UK lots would be up in arms!
 
Bryon Wright said:
Hi all,
is this definitely saturatus and not optatus?
Click to expand...

jalid said:
How about these two identified as saturatus:

Kennerley P 1998: Oriental Cuckoos at Tuas, Singapore on 21st October and 2nd December 1995. Oriental Bird Club Bulletin 27 55-57.

In Tring collection there is an optatus with wing length 209 labelled Singapore, number NHM 81.5.1.3291, but for some reason there is no date in my notes.
Click to expand...

Fairly self explanatory Bryon....Peter Kennerley trapped two saturatus in 1995 while the skin at NHM Tring is optatus, also from Singapore. The latest edition (2017) of the Singapore Bird Checklist only lists saturatus (Himalayan) so I assume they are unaware of the Tring optatus (Oriental) specimen.

Grahame
 
Last edited:
Grahame Walbridge said:
Fairly self explanatory Bryon....Peter Kennerley trapped two saturatus in 1995 while the skin at NHM Tring is optatus, also from Singapore. The latest edition (2017) of the Singapore Bird Checklist only lists saturatus (Himalayan) so I assume they are unaware of the Tring optatus (Oriental) specimen.

Grahame
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I had spoken to Dr Yong Dingli and he is unaware of the optatus skin at Tring.

Dr. Yong also told me that only one of the bird ringed by Peter is confirmed a saturatus.
 
SeeToh said:
I had spoken to Dr Yong Dingli and he is unaware of the optatus skin at Tring.
Click to expand...

Yes, there is at least one. But it is a different question if it is acceptable as a local record. Skin trading was common at that time. For example, the type locality of Setaria albogularis (Grey-breasted Babbler) is Singapore, but it is not in the checklist either, and surely for a reason.
 
jalid said:
Yes, there is at least one. But it is a different question if it is acceptable as a local record. Skin trading was common at that time. For example, the type locality of Setaria albogularis (Grey-breasted Babbler) is Singapore, but it is not in the checklist either, and surely for a reason.
Click to expand...

If I am not wrong, the current Nature Society of Singapore's Bird Group checklist is based on the sightings in the last 30 years. As such, Grey-breasted Babbler may have occurred in Singapore before the rapid urbanization era. The babbler is still found in Panti (Johor, Peninsula Malaysia) which is around 1 hours drive after clearing the land border checkpoint at Woodlands.
 
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