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Old Monday 22nd January 2018, 04:17   #1
heavenly snapper
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Talking Newbie here.. But an OLD newbie

Hello from the Pacific Northwest coast of the USA! I'm getting ready to buy a new superzoom bridge rig for birds, wildlife and the such. I already own a DSLR with many lenses so I don't need another one of those. I'm trying to decide if a 1" sensor with less zoom is a better investment or a 1/2.3 with over double the reach is best. Thoughts on this anyone?

Thanks and as Arnold said, " I'll be back!"
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Old Monday 22nd January 2018, 06:47   #2
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Hi heavenly snapper and welcome to BirdForum. There's a few threads discussing superzooms which hopefully will be of some assistance to you.

Rich
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Old Monday 22nd January 2018, 07:30   #3
heavenly snapper
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClarkWGriswold View Post
Hi heavenly snapper and welcome to BirdForum. There's a few threads discussing superzooms which hopefully will be of some assistance to you.

Rich
Thanks Clark
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Old Monday 22nd January 2018, 07:31   #4
heavenly snapper
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Thanks Clark
Or was that Rich.. Clark?
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Old Monday 22nd January 2018, 08:24   #5
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Hi heavenly snapper and a warm welcome from me too.

I'm sure you will enjoy it here and I hope to hear about all the birds you see when out and about. I've also subscribed you to the thread so that you can find it more easily.

I've moved your post to the Camera Forums, as I think you'll get the answers you need there... it's all double-Dutch to me LOL

Oh and BTW his name is Rich.... he just seems to like "ClarkWGriswold" for some weird and wonderful reason.
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Old Monday 22nd January 2018, 08:42   #6
heavenly snapper
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Hi heavenly snapper and a warm welcome from me too.

I'm sure you will enjoy it here and I hope to hear about all the birds you see when out and about. I've also subscribed you to the thread so that you can find it more easily.

I've moved your post to the Camera Forums, as I think you'll get the answers you need there... it's all double-Dutch to me LOL

Oh and BTW his name is Rich.... he just seems to like "ClarkWGriswold" for some weird and wonderful reason.
Hello Delia and thanks for your help getting me going here. I'm old and slow sometimes but I still learn new things daily! Yeah I figured it was Rich right after I posted it so I thought I'd follow up with a silly one!
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Old Monday 22nd January 2018, 08:46   #7
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You're welcome HS!!! I like being silly sometimes too

Glad you found your way to the thread OK.
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Old Monday 22nd January 2018, 09:25   #8
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I much prefer more zoom and less sensor just put 3 P900 samples in this thread.

http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=356271
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Old Monday 22nd January 2018, 14:07   #9
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I'd tend to go the opposite direction of Nikonmike - I like the larger sensor and less reach of that choice. But I guess it much depends on just how far off the wildlife you often shoot will be. In Florida, we can sometimes get pretty close - 600mm is usually enough for smaller birds in the forest, and more than enough for wading birds...what we run into much more often is challenging lighting - shady forests with heavy tree canopies, and birds often trying to avoid the sun as we're so warm down here. Plus, through much of the year it's so hot and humid here that you can't really shoot birds too far away even if you have the reach, because atmospherics will destroy the shot if the bird is more than 100 feet off.

If I were in the market for a bridge cam, I'd likely get the Sony RX10 IV. It's pricey, but seems to be the best bridge cam at covering all the bases - larger sensor to help in more challenging light, good reach up to 600mm, and actually very capable with BIF with fast OSPDAF focusing.

I shoot with a DSLR system, but also with a mirrorless system which is small enough and light enough that I haven't been tempted enough by the bridge wildlife cams. I have an original RX10 (only 200mm) for a travel cam, but it doesn't have the reach for wildlife or birding.
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Old Monday 22nd January 2018, 17:14   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heavenly snapper View Post
Hello Delia and thanks for your help getting me going here. I'm old and slow sometimes but I still learn new things daily! Yeah I figured it was Rich right after I posted it so I thought I'd follow up with a silly one!
I needed a username I could easily remember and I do enjoy the films

Rich
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Old Monday 22nd January 2018, 19:49   #11
heavenly snapper
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Talking Nikon P900

Quote:
Originally Posted by nikonmike View Post
I much prefer more zoom and less sensor just put 3 P900 samples in this thread.

http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=356271
The Nikon P900 was my first draw to the superzooms with it's 2000mm reach and AMAZING Moon shots BUT, I started shying away from it due to lack of RAW capabilities. Nice photos btw!!

In the small sensors I've been tossing up the Nikon B700, Canon SX60 and Lumix DC-FZ80 with the Lumix in front!

Large sensors, the Sony DSC-RX10 IV, can't bring myself to pop that much cash on it soooo, I'm looking at a used Sony DSC-RX10 III still a little pricey, a new or used Lumix DMC-FZ2500 still a bit price new but doable or a Lumix DMC-FZ1000 unless there's another one I've missed in the pack!

BTW, the ability to transfer directly to my iPhone is a plus. Definitely want wifi capabilities to control camera via my phone.

Thanks for your all feedback, it is much appreciated!

Mark aka HeavenlySnapper... I'm into sunsets, sunrises, and skycapes! Now diving into birding and wildlife.
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Old Monday 22nd January 2018, 19:50   #12
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Talking Large Sensor vs Small

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zackiedawg View Post
I'd tend to go the opposite direction of Nikonmike - I like the larger sensor and less reach of that choice. But I guess it much depends on just how far off the wildlife you often shoot will be. In Florida, we can sometimes get pretty close - 600mm is usually enough for smaller birds in the forest, and more than enough for wading birds...what we run into much more often is challenging lighting - shady forests with heavy tree canopies, and birds often trying to avoid the sun as we're so warm down here. Plus, through much of the year it's so hot and humid here that you can't really shoot birds too far away even if you have the reach, because atmospherics will destroy the shot if the bird is more than 100 feet off.

If I were in the market for a bridge cam, I'd likely get the Sony RX10 IV. It's pricey, but seems to be the best bridge cam at covering all the bases - larger sensor to help in more challenging light, good reach up to 600mm, and actually very capable with BIF with fast OSPDAF focusing.

I shoot with a DSLR system, but also with a mirrorless system which is small enough and light enough that I haven't been tempted enough by the bridge wildlife cams. I have an original RX10 (only 200mm) for a travel cam, but it doesn't have the reach for wildlife or birding.
Thanks Justin!
In the small sensors I've been tossing up the Nikon B700, Canon SX60 and Lumix DC-FZ80 with the Lumix in front!

Large sensors, the Sony DSC-RX10 IV, can't bring myself to pop that much cash on it soooo, I'm looking at a used Sony DSC-RX10 III still a little pricey, a new or used Lumix DMC-FZ2500 still a bit price new but doable or a Lumix DMC-FZ1000 unless there's another one I've missed in the pack!

BTW, the ability to transfer directly to my iPhone is a plus. Definitely want wifi capabilities to control camera via my phone.

Thanks for your all feedback, it is much appreciated!

Mark aka HeavenlySnapper... I'm into sunsets, sunrises, and skycapes! Now diving into birding and wildlife.
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Old Monday 22nd January 2018, 19:53   #13
heavenly snapper
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Talking User name

Quote:
Originally Posted by ClarkWGriswold View Post
I needed a username I could easily remember and I do enjoy the films

Rich
Oh I get that one Rich and I loved all those movies too.. had me in tears at times from laughing so hard!!

Mark aka HeavenlySnapper... I'm into sunsets, sunrises, and skycapes! Now diving into birding and wildlife.
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Old Monday 22nd January 2018, 20:17   #14
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The B700 was a direct replacement for the P610 but with raw added (same lens), i had the P610 before the P900 changed for more zoom.
Some P610 results for you
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Old Tuesday 23rd January 2018, 00:21   #15
heavenly snapper
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Thumbs up B700 vs P900

Quote:
Originally Posted by nikonmike View Post
The B700 was a direct replacement for the P610 but with raw added (same lens), i had the P610 before the P900 changed for more zoom.
Some P610 results for you
Those are nice shots too Mike but I think the P900 images appear more detailed, probably due to longer reach. Do you recall the distance to subject and lens settings?

Thanks
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Old Tuesday 23rd January 2018, 04:34   #16
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The Exif for the above shots in the same order.

Manufacturer: Nikon - Model: COOLPIX P610 - Focallength: 258 mm - Measurement: Pattern - Aperture: 6.5 - ISO: 400 - Exposuretime: 1/200 sec - Flash: No Flash

Manufacturer: Nikon - Model: COOLPIX P610 - Focallength: 258 mm - Measurement: Pattern - Aperture: 6.5 - ISO: 110 - Exposuretime: 1/320 sec - Flash: No Flash

Manufacturer: Nikon - Model: COOLPIX P610 - Focallength: 258 mm - Measurement: Pattern - Aperture: 6.5 - ISO: 100 - Exposuretime: 1/400 sec - Flash: No Flash

The 258 mm is full zoom 258 x 5.7 = 1470mm, i have shot some version of raw since day one starting with Tiff on the early Olympus cameras and NEF from the old D70 days, i still shoot raw with my Panasonic.
The strange thing is with these bridge cameras i don't feel i need it the same,the cameras get it so close it only needs tweaking in photoshop, maybe a little in curves and sometimes a little unsharp mask.

Distance ime not sure of but i try to shoot between 15-40 ft
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Old Tuesday 23rd January 2018, 05:16   #17
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This guy uses a FZ72 but he does get close to his subjects a lot of the time.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/114781...h/37103991773/
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Old Tuesday 23rd January 2018, 05:46   #18
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There is no getting away from it......if you want quality images from any bridge camera you have to get close to your subject.
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Old Wednesday 24th January 2018, 02:07   #19
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Lightbulb small vs large sensor

Thanks for all the input so far everyone! I think I'm leaning towards the Lumix DMC-FZ2500 large sensor. Second place is the Lumix DC-FZ80 small sensor and third place is the Nikon B700 small sensor.

My concluded thoughts are the low light abilities of the large sensor along with the fact that free hand shooting will be happening a lot so any reach past 500mm would be hard to keep steady. The ONLY thing drawing me to the small sensors is their reach abilities BUT the fact that a tripod would be needed to be successful shooting anything above 500mm pushes me to the large sensor soooo... Any thoughts?

Thanks

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Old Wednesday 24th January 2018, 05:16   #20
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My hand holding ability is crap,thats why i like the Panasonic m4/3 not heavy and dual IS,i still dont use a tripod as i dont subscribe to the crop value of a system giving a longer lens.
The B700 has only got a 258mm lens not a 1400 + mm,the way i look at it is if you knew you would be cropping a DSLR image with a 300mm lens would you up the shutter speed to allow for it.
I have used a monopod but only have a heavy manfrotto so dont bother with it much, i had my bridge camera set on continuous and took 3 or 4 shots each time in case camera shake was a problem,most of the time it wasnt.
I am considering getting a stupid cheap/light monopod and useing my V head on it to rest the camera on but thats just a thought at the moment.
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Old Wednesday 24th January 2018, 05:42   #21
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I used a panasohic fz200 for a long while......mostly handheld.Even at its longest focal length,it was fairly easy to get sharp images due to good image stabilization and a constant 2.8 aperture.This bridge camera is now old,but due to the large aperture throught its entire range,still relevant.
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Old Wednesday 24th January 2018, 07:36   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heavenly snapper View Post
Thanks for all the input so far everyone! I think I'm leaning towards the Lumix DMC-FZ2500 large sensor. [...]

[...] any reach past 500mm would be hard to keep steady. The ONLY thing drawing me to the small sensors is their reach abilities BUT the fact that a tripod would be needed to be successful shooting anything above 500mm pushes me to the large sensor soooo... Any thoughts?
A dpreview review of the FZ2500 concluded:
Quote:
Good for Video enthusiasts who want extensive controls, inputs, and outputs. - Not so good for Those 'focused' mainly on still photography. There are better choices in this class for less money.
Since you mention sunrise/sunset photos, are you doing long time exposures? In that case the inbuilt ND filter should be useful.

I've gone from a 1/3.2 sensor to a 1'' system (Nikon V2 + CX 70-300) and don't regret it. The reach of a superzoom is useful for static birds. Overall a 1'' sensor offers more possibilities, for superb photos you'll have to be close to the bird anyway. "Successful shooting above 500mm" is a non-issue imo. Recent models all have fine stabilization. At 8 frames per second or more, shooting in bursts rarely fails to get the shot.
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Old Wednesday 24th January 2018, 08:51   #23
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The fz2500 is also limited by the 177mm lens on a 1inch sensor IMO nowhere long enough.
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Old Wednesday 24th January 2018, 10:20   #24
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The fz2500 is also limited by the 177mm lens on a 1inch sensor IMO nowhere long enough.
That is the drawback to it for sure Mike.
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Old Wednesday 24th January 2018, 10:39   #25
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A dpreview review of the FZ2500 concluded:

Since you mention sunrise/sunset photos, are you doing long time exposures? In that case the inbuilt ND filter should be useful.

I've gone from a 1/3.2 sensor to a 1'' system (Nikon V2 + CX 70-300) and don't regret it. The reach of a superzoom is useful for static birds. Overall a 1'' sensor offers more possibilities, for superb photos you'll have to be close to the bird anyway. "Successful shooting above 500mm" is a non-issue imo. Recent models all have fine stabilization. At 8 frames per second or more, shooting in bursts rarely fails to get the shot.
The built in ND is a definite plus, I haven't got into too much long exposure but am heading in that direction and is another reason I'm leaning toward the 1" sensor and the wildlife is just something I want to dabble in so I'm thinking the Lumix DMC-FZ2500 in a good choice giving me both worlds. My Sony SLT-A35 falls way short in low light. I do have a range of several lenses for it that can reach out up to 600mm.
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