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Nikon Monarch 7 new 8x30 and 10x30

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Old Tuesday 20th August 2013, 19:46   #26
NDhunter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Torview View Post
Can`t wait to try the 8x30, looks like a CL to me, perfect serious wet weather compliment to an SE ?
I agree that this new Nikon looks much like the CL, so it is small and
should handle very nicely.

I detect a lot of interest in this new one. For those on this site, Nikon
may sell more of the new Monarch 30's, than the 42's. It seems the 30-32mm
bins are the rage right now, and should be as a nice, lightweight travel
companion.

Jerry
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Old Tuesday 20th August 2013, 20:38   #27
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FK

It was Nikon who told me they had used another manufacturing company for the x30 Monarch 7s. I don't know the current level of staffing but when the Nikon was reorganised to create the Nikon Vision Company it had 45 employees. There was no indication if there was any designers in that number but they were looking after a lot of avenues of business.
http://www.nikon.com/news/2001/nikonvision_e_01.htm

It is a closely guarded secret in the industry who makes what for who, but it would be surprising if Nikon didn't contract third parties for the design, tooling and manufacture of their binoculars. We might speculate that they might also choose to develop and market designs from elsewhere. I really don't know how they operate or what they did in this case.

It was Kite that told me they had jointly developed the 8x30 with Nikon. They would not furnish any more details than that, other than they believed their final specification was slightly different to Nikon's as I said. Kite have worked with Japanese OEMS since 1984 to produce their product range. Of course I would not have any idea what deals were done regarding this model.

David

PS. As far as I can determine Nikon has two operations involved in making cameras and one making microscopes in China but there is not one listed for making sports optics.

Last edited by typo : Wednesday 21st August 2013 at 05:50. Reason: Link added
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Old Wednesday 4th September 2013, 09:47   #28
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Kite only imports their own labeled equipment from subcontractors in China, they are not optical designers in the class of Nikon.
A very well established Japanese company teamed up with the Kite company in Belgium?
Actually Kite has used Japanese sub-contract manufacturing more or less from day one. A number of its binocular and scope models come from Kamakura, for example.

Nikon sub-contracted more or less all of its "entry" to mid-range products in bins and scopes some time ago either to China or Japan. For example, the decision to end one of the field scope ranges was because the sub-contractor did not want to carry on making the line, not because Nikon wanted to.

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Old Wednesday 4th September 2013, 23:51   #29
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I cannot agree with the above statements.

My career was with an international corporation one division of which is in Tokyo. It was owned 10% by Hitachi now Mitsubishi Heavy Industries. They do not subcontract the entire design development to a company outside of Nikon. Components are manufactured to Nikon design and standards. Nikon has strict quality control standards or the components are rejected. I doubt that the ED optical elements are not from Nikon along with the special multi coating, these are very guarded processes and not shared outside to subcontractors. It is well known many of the Nikon cameras and lens are manuf. outside of Japan,,, these are in Nikon owned and operated facilities for final assembly and inspection for quality control. Many of the components are subcontracted to other companies.

If one subcontractor decides not to manufacture a Nikon assembly,, many other sources would be located for the work. Nikon dropped some of their Fieldscope products to introduce new updated models.

The concept that Nikon would co-design and develop a product to compete in their own market is just not possible in a large corporation. A senior manager of a Nikon division would not consider a partnership with a competing company, he would be fired for even proposing it to corporate.

Kamakura has been a subcontractor of optical elements for many Japanese companies for many years. Just because they make components for both Kite and Nikon does not imply a partnership. When I subcontracted to outside vendors,, my designs an parts were not available or visible to any other companies also using the same vendor.

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Old Thursday 5th September 2013, 00:15   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fkrow View Post
I cannot agree with the above statements.

My career was with an international corporation one division of which is in Tokyo. It was owned 10% by Hitachi now Mitsubishi Heavy Industries. They do not subcontract the entire design development to a company outside of Nikon. Components are manufactured to Nikon design and standards. Nikon has strict quality control standards or the components are rejected. I doubt that the ED optical elements are not from Nikon along with the special multi coating, these are very guarded processes and not shared outside to subcontractors. It is well known many of the Nikon cameras and lens are manuf. outside of Japan,,, these are in Nikon owned and operated facilities for final assembly and inspection for quality control. Many of the components are subcontracted to other companies.

If one subcontractor decides not to manufacture a Nikon assembly,, many other sources would be located for the work. Nikon dropped some of their Fieldscope products to introduce new updated models.

The concept that Nikon would co-design and develop a product to compete in their own market is just not possible in a large corporation. A senior manager of a Nikon division would not consider a partnership with a competing company, he would be fired for even proposing it to corporate.

Kamakura has been a subcontractor of optical elements for many Japanese companies for many years. Just because they make components for both Kite and Nikon does not imply a partnership. When I subcontracted to outside vendors,, my designs an parts were not available or visible to any other companies also using the same vendor.

Regards,
FK
FK:

It is very good for you to post. Nikon does things at a very high level, and
that includes manufacture and design.

I am thinking they have control over the whole process, no matter where they are made, Japan or China.

This does matter a lot, especially when buying a binocular made in China.

Jerry
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Old Thursday 5th September 2013, 02:58   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NDhunter View Post
I agree that this new Nikon looks much like the CL, so it is small and
should handle very nicely.

I detect a lot of interest in this new one. For those on this site, Nikon
may sell more of the new Monarch 30's, than the 42's. It seems the 30-32mm
bins are the rage right now, and should be as a nice, lightweight travel
companion.

Jerry
This is a different approach and a simple and brilliant first foray by Nikon into the medium cost 30/32mm Roof Prism world!

Previously Nikon never made Roof Prisms smaller than the 8 and10 x 36mm ATBs which cost under $300.00. (In the 1980's there was a 7 x 26 and a 9 x 31 which were expensive for their day. I believe they were called "Executive.")

It sets them apart from all the others. They are the Monarch versions of 8 x 32 and 10 x 32.

Bob

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Old Thursday 5th September 2013, 19:50   #32
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Kite have the specification for their version of the 8x30 on their web site now. Available November and no prices yet.
http://www.kiteoptics.eu/products/kite/en/1/95/

Differences, apart from styling, seem to be a little wider view, water repellent coatings, a few grams heavier and HD not ED if that has any meaning.

David
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Old Thursday 5th September 2013, 20:06   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NDhunter View Post
FK:

It is very good for you to post. Nikon does things at a very high level, and
that includes manufacture and design.

I am thinking they have control over the whole process, no matter where they are made, Japan or China.

This does matter a lot, especially when buying a binocular made in China.

Jerry
We very much appreciate the comments made by FK and followed up by Jerry. These are absolutely true. I have preached this for years, but seems overly biased coming from a Nikon employee. Well stated, FK.

I haven't seen the 30s yet, but Jerry might be onto something. These might sell well over the full-sized models. I will let you all know my thoughts after spending time with them. Take care all!

All the best,
Mike Freiberg
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Old Thursday 5th September 2013, 20:26   #34
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It's a shame that minimum IPD spec is 56 mm and not something like 50 mm.

--AP
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Old Friday 6th September 2013, 06:35   #35
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Kite have the specification for their version of the 8x30 on their web site now.
Hi, looks interesting indeed! Orniwelt.de lists it already with 520 Euro.

Hope someone tries the Kite and the Nikon soon!
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Old Friday 6th September 2013, 17:44   #36
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New Nikon Monarch 7

On the Nikon uk website they are advertised as coming soon prices are quoted as 319 for 8x30 and 349 for the 10x30.

My query is will they be suitable for spec wearers as eye relief quoted is 15.1
For the 8x30 .
My old Monarchs were about 18 mm anyone know if they are measured the same way as the older models as that seems a bit low for spec wearers or am i
reading things wrong. Harold
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Old Friday 6th September 2013, 18:06   #37
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Harold,

I think that figure is right, certainly shorter than the other Monarchs I've tried. They were OK with my glasses but I suspect some would have problems.

David
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Old Friday 6th September 2013, 18:18   #38
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Thanks David will try to test a pair , I have them on my shortlist along with Opticron Countryman BGA HD 8x32 .
At the moment it looks as though it will be one or the other.
Harold
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Old Friday 6th September 2013, 19:19   #39
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At Birdfair Nikon said they expected to start shipping them to retailers in September. Clifton Cameras, for example, currently say expected mid-October.

David
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Old Monday 9th September 2013, 03:12   #40
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At Birdfair Nikon said they expected to start shipping them to retailers in September. Clifton Cameras, for example, currently say expected mid-October.

David
I don't get the excitement for the Monarch 7 8x30's. They won't be as good optically as the Nikon Monarch 7 8x42's and the 42's are not that great. I thought they were at first until I started comparing them to the Nikon SE, EII and especially the Swarovski SV 8x32. They are not that sharp on-axis. They are not worth the $400 to $500 that they are asking. There are better values out there.
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Old Monday 9th September 2013, 03:14   #41
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Thanks David will try to test a pair , I have them on my shortlist along with Opticron Countryman BGA HD 8x32 .
At the moment it looks as though it will be one or the other.
Harold
The Opticron Countryman BGA HD 8x32 isn't that great. Don't waste your time. I sent mine back quickly.
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Old Monday 9th September 2013, 05:42   #42
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I don't get the excitement for the Monarch 7 8x30's.
Let me try to help. It's because:
- they have a few m more FOV than the SV 8x32
- they are 150 g lighter than the SV 8x32
- they are 2 cm shorter than the SV 8x32
- they are 1800 $ less expensive than the SV 8x32
- the only BF member who looked through it so far found it good (see typo's post #5)

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They won't be as good optically as the Nikon Monarch 7 8x42's
Again, from what our only BF reviewer so far said (birdfair thread), they are better.
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Old Monday 9th September 2013, 06:17   #43
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A few dealers in Germany list it now, for 369 (8x30).
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Old Monday 9th September 2013, 15:48   #44
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I don't get the excitement for the Monarch 7 8x30's. They won't be as good optically as the Nikon Monarch 7 8x42's and the 42's are not that great. I thought they were at first until I started comparing them to the Nikon SE, EII and especially the Swarovski SV 8x32. They are not that sharp on-axis. They are not worth the $400 to $500 that they are asking. There are better values out there.
Prediction: you will soon own a pair. We look forward to your comments.
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Old Monday 9th September 2013, 17:31   #45
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I don't get the excitement for the Monarch 7 8x30's. They won't be as good optically as the Nikon Monarch 7 8x42's and the 42's are not that great. I thought they were at first until I started comparing them to the Nikon SE, EII and especially the Swarovski SV 8x32. They are not that sharp on-axis. They are not worth the $400 to $500 that they are asking. There are better values out there.
Too funny, comparing a $375 Nikon 8x30 Monarch 7 and the $475 8x42 with a $2,160 Swarovski SV 8x32.

I have the Nikon 8x30E poro and the 10x42 Monarch 7.
Yes the 8x30E poro has a flat field to the edges and is sharp.
The Monarch 7 is brighter and can resolve details much better (in the center) than the 8x30E poro. On a bright sunny day I can clearly see insects flying above water at 200 meters,,, they are not visible with the 8x30 E. The color and contrast are far better in the new Monarch 7.

Comparing 8x30's I cannot justify the additional $300 for flat field that I do not use and certainly cannot justify $2160 for the SV Swaro.

Regards,
FK
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Old Tuesday 10th September 2013, 16:27   #46
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Prediction: you will soon own a pair. We look forward to your comments.
Agreed on this one. In the hand is always better than on paper. The 8x36 MONARCH did extremely well, but I expected the enhanced coatings and glass to make these models a real winner.

All the best,

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Old Wednesday 11th September 2013, 00:42   #47
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That squares with my knowledge of Nikon Imaging and Nikon Instruments divisions. Having subcontractors supply parts is a far cry from giving up design control or oversight.



Quote:
Originally Posted by fkrow View Post
I cannot agree with the above statements.

My career was with an international corporation one division of which is in Tokyo. It was owned 10% by Hitachi now Mitsubishi Heavy Industries. They do not subcontract the entire design development to a company outside of Nikon. Components are manufactured to Nikon design and standards. Nikon has strict quality control standards or the components are rejected. I doubt that the ED optical elements are not from Nikon along with the special multi coating, these are very guarded processes and not shared outside to subcontractors. It is well known many of the Nikon cameras and lens are manuf. outside of Japan,,, these are in Nikon owned and operated facilities for final assembly and inspection for quality control. Many of the components are subcontracted to other companies.

If one subcontractor decides not to manufacture a Nikon assembly,, many other sources would be located for the work. Nikon dropped some of their Fieldscope products to introduce new updated models.

The concept that Nikon would co-design and develop a product to compete in their own market is just not possible in a large corporation. A senior manager of a Nikon division would not consider a partnership with a competing company, he would be fired for even proposing it to corporate.

Kamakura has been a subcontractor of optical elements for many Japanese companies for many years. Just because they make components for both Kite and Nikon does not imply a partnership. When I subcontracted to outside vendors,, my designs an parts were not available or visible to any other companies also using the same vendor.

Regards,
FK

Last edited by paul2013 : Wednesday 11th September 2013 at 00:46.
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Old Thursday 12th September 2013, 05:36   #48
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Prediction: you will soon own a pair. We look forward to your comments.
Your probably right. I am going to order a pair right now.
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Old Thursday 12th September 2013, 05:40   #49
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Too funny, comparing a $375 Nikon 8x30 Monarch 7 and the $475 8x42 with a $2,160 Swarovski SV 8x32.

I have the Nikon 8x30E poro and the 10x42 Monarch 7.
Yes the 8x30E poro has a flat field to the edges and is sharp.
The Monarch 7 is brighter and can resolve details much better (in the center) than the 8x30E poro. On a bright sunny day I can clearly see insects flying above water at 200 meters,,, they are not visible with the 8x30 E. The color and contrast are far better in the new Monarch 7.

Comparing 8x30's I cannot justify the additional $300 for flat field that I do not use and certainly cannot justify $2160 for the SV Swaro.

Regards,
FK
That is very interesting and I agree with you. The Nikon 8x30 E is not the sharpest binocular on-axis. Detail could be partly due to the 10x but color and contrast better has to be coatings and ED glass. I have to have a pair of these. Off to Adorama. I like the weight and size.
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Old Thursday 12th September 2013, 05:57   #50
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They are not in stock yet! I put my name on the waiting list. Look for a big review. I will call it "Grandpa porro versus Grandson roof" The Nikon 8x30 EII porro versus the Nikon Monarch 7 8x30 roof. It will be sensational!

Last edited by [email protected] : Thursday 12th September 2013 at 11:34.
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