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Zeiss Diascope 85 T* FL year of manufacture

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Old Thursday 12th March 2020, 00:24   #1
Joker9937
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Zeiss Diascope 85 T* FL year of manufacture

Hello. I had posted in another section that I was considering a Swarovski AT80 HD, and still might go that route, but found a Zeiss Diascope that is far less money, and comes with tripod, etc. It does not have original boxes, and stuff, but looks pristine.

I was wondering if anyone would have an idea of the age. It is the silver body with the small blue square with "Zeiss" in white letters. On the large part of the barrel it says "Carl Zeiss" with "Diascope 85 T* FL" under that. It has a black sliding dewshield.

I am just curious about the age, and if I should steer towards something different. Price, I think is pretty good at $850, but not sure.

Reviews are excellent, but I am not sure how many versions or updates have taken place since this specific scope was produced. This is the exact version, but I did not think I should post random pics from google searches, so I posted the link instead.

Any issues or thoughts? Would I be better off paying more money for the Swarovski?

Digiscoping whitetail and maybe occasional lunar observation would be my uses. Thanks, in advance.
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Old Thursday 12th March 2020, 11:12   #2
jring
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Hi,

I only remember one Diascope which was only ok. But it was a very old version and didn't have the Zeiss zoom but an adapted Baader astro EP. Was reasonably sharp but quite yellow.

In general with used spotting scopes - try before you buy - exactly the example you are going to buy. Either in person or with a no questions asked return policy. Sample variation really exists and while extremely bad cases might end up in warranty, the merely not so great ones might just get sold on.

Joachim
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Old Thursday 12th March 2020, 19:14   #3
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Hi

You will no doubt get expert advise about the silver Diascope from others but from my (an amateurs) point of view it will be pre 2013. I bought a black 85 Diascope Victory FL with the single dual purpose focus wheel 2 months ago from a seller in Australia. Mine is the upgraded 2013 model with 20-75 zoom. Like you I read the reviews and they rated it very highly and believe me the optics and image are superb and it's ideal for digiscoping. It really is a class bit of kit but needs a very stable tripod because of its weight.
BUT Joachim is right.....best to try first if you are not sure.
The Diascope, along with the ATS 80 were the the 2 best scopes 10 years ago and in my opinion are still supreme.
Regards... Ian
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Old Thursday 12th March 2020, 23:45   #4
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Thanks, for both replies. I look forward to more input.

I wish that there was a local store that carried anything from the better optics sources. Actually, there are a few places with the lower-end Vortex, Zeiss, and the like. But, the problem is, none of the staff have even as much of a clue about optics as I do. AND...that is saying that they know VERY little then.

On top of that, no one carries used stuff to compare. But, you are both right. It would be smarter to go that route. I hope to make a trip to Cabela's, which is not THAT far away. But, not in the cards right now.

The deal got better and cheaper as we talked, so I did end up paying him. It is supposed to be here Saturday. I hope that you are thinking of a different version, Joachim. We will see. Based on a bit of market research, I should be able to get my money back, if for whatever reason I don't like it. My experience is limited to astronomical telescopes, and binoculars. Not that there is a vast difference, but there is enough that I have much to learn.

We will see how it goes. Thanks, again.
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Old Friday 13th March 2020, 06:04   #5
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Hi,

well, since you bit the bullet, we only can hope for the best -I'll certainly keep my fingers crossed for you to get a good example.

Please let us know how it turned out - if you have experience with astro kit, you might know about star testing...

Joachim
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Old Friday 13th March 2020, 07:11   #6
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Good luck with it.....

I don't think you can go to far wrong. If it is within 10 years old of manufacture, there is still also the warranty that Zeiss will honour if there's a problem.

If your going to digiscope with your smart phone then PhoneSkope do a good package. You might have to hunt for zoom attachment as the width of the lens is 60mm .... As big as they get!

Good luck. Let us know how you get on.

Regards..... Ian
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Old Friday 13th March 2020, 07:23   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jring View Post
Hi,

well, since you bit the bullet, we only can hope for the best -I'll certainly keep my fingers crossed for you to get a good example.

Please let us know how it turned out - if you have experience with astro kit, you might know about star testing...

Joachim
Thanks. I actually posted, and then talked to the seller again. Then, the deal sort of erupted. If I had read your post prior to paying the guy, I would have held off. Live and learn again.

Like you said, I am crossing my fingers pretty tightly. LOL.

I do know about star testing. Not a pro at it, but can fumble along somewhat.

And, Ian, congrats on your Victory. Too late I figured out that there was a Diascope and a VICTORY Diascope. I read the reviews for the Diascope, and later comprehended that it was a newer version, which was the Victory. The one hope I have, is the that one of the reviews I read commented on an "already excellent scope was made even better". So, hopefully it will live up to that. I did find other reviews that spoke highly of the older version, so we will see.

I do appreciate both of you responding. I will let you know how it goes.
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Old Friday 13th March 2020, 07:41   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian Byrnes View Post
Good luck with it.....

I don't think you can go to far wrong. If it is within 10 years old of manufacture, there is still also the warranty that Zeiss will honour if there's a problem.

If your going to digiscope with your smart phone then PhoneSkope do a good package. You might have to hunt for zoom attachment as the width of the lens is 60mm .... As big as they get!

Good luck. Let us know how you get on.

Regards..... Ian
I think we were posting at the same time. LOL.

Good info on the warranty. I did not think of that, since I am the second owner. Hopefully it won't be necessary.

It is supposed to be here tomorrow. Well, that is the "estimated delivery time". Busy day, but I have a feeling I will find some time, if it actually arrives then.

Thanks for the PhoneSkope tip. Much appreciated.
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Old Friday 13th March 2020, 21:48   #9
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I had the 'old' silver 85mm Diascope, and to be honest I miss it. I found it superb. I sold the vario zoom, and used instead a Baader Hyperion Mk. II. Fantastic combo. Don't fret, I have no doubt you will be amazed!
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Old Saturday 14th March 2020, 08:43   #10
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Thank you. I hope you are right, Sancho.

The Fedex app says that the scope is on the truck for delivery, so I might really receive it today.

I ordered the PhoneSkope too, because I have been looking for a new adapter for my astro telescope anyway. I ordered the attachment specifically for the Diascope, and the general purpose attachment as well. I guess it won't be here until next week.

Crossing my fingers for the scope.
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Old Saturday 14th March 2020, 15:18   #11
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It showed up unscathed. It is gray and dreary here today. Plus, I could only take handheld photos. But, it doesn't look too bad to me.

I figure for the money (less than $800 shipped) it is a good start, at minimum. It came with the scope, tripod and head, and a Kowa stay on cover.

The tripod seems a little shaky when focusing, which was a bit of a disappointment, but not bad. Any recommendations, or is that to be expected?

At 60x it seems to be a bit less than at 30 and 40. Would that change with a different (newer) ep? The gray day certainly factors into my first impressions, but taking that into consideration, this scope seems very sharp. I look forward to star testing it.

The focus knobs are smooth. As silly as it sounds, the fine vs coarse focus knobs are not easily identified by me. If anyone has a suggestion on where to obtain a manual, I would be open to the info. I found focus with no issues, but a manual would be nice to have.

It needs a little overall cleaning, and the glass cleaned too, but it is in really nice shape. One hairline scratch, around an inch or two long, on the body. It is barely discernible. There is a spot on the ep where something scratched the outside edge of the rim around the glass. It is missing the dustcovers.

The eyecup is annoying. It would be nice to be able to push it down, to allow my eye to get a little closer, but I do not see that it is possible. The ER is much tighter than I expected, but I think it might feel tight because of the cup.

Overall, I think it is great deal, and going to work well as I learn how to use my phone/digiscoping adapter with it. My adapter should be here by Monday. I will post some legit pics when it arrives.

The pics include shots of my neighbor's grain dryer/elevator, which is around 1000 to 1500 yards away. One pic is at 20x and one is 60. I think that the 60x pic was taken with the app "Firstlight". Other than that, I made no modifications. Obviously, through the ep is much nicer than the handheld shots.

I will say that the dewshield seems plasticky to me.
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Old Saturday 14th March 2020, 15:34   #12
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After I posted, I saw that there was a Fox Squirrel sitting still for a few minutes. Snapped a quick photo with the "Firstlight" app. First photo is only modified to work on the forum. Obviously, the second one is heavily cropped.

The scope was at 60x. The squirrel was roughly 50 yds away.

Does it look hopeful?
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Old Saturday 14th March 2020, 17:01   #13
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Its quite funny to see how you are getting on.....you seem just like me....an amateur !!
I was like a kid with a new toy when mine arrived and did pretty much the same as you.....took shots of squirrels in the garden.
From the photos it looks pretty good and the tripods a Manfrotto, which are usually good also. The package looks impressive.
I take shots with an old IPhone 5s ... I took this today....bit blurry.uu
How did you down load more than one photo....I can only ever get one at a time to appear?

Regards Ian
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Old Saturday 14th March 2020, 17:02   #14
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By the way the squirrel looks great.
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Old Saturday 14th March 2020, 20:23   #15
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Hi,

seems you got a good deal - congratulations. The images look sharp enough at 60x. Let us know how the star test looks like.

The images look about as yellow as I remember the one example I tried. On the other hand you can correct it in images and while observing the brain tends to adapt after a few seconds...

The objective lens does not look like it needs cleaning - you know the astronomer joke about how to best clean optical surfaces and the answer being not.

If you have astro EPs, there is an adapter available to use 1.25" ones in the diascope. The question is, if all come to focus though, as spotting scopes tend to have a bit less focus travel than your average astro scope.

https://www.teleskop-express.de/shop...uf-1-1-4-.html

I probably would first try to get a better tripod - the one shown looks a bit flimsy and is maybe better used for a small camera. A good tripod will also shake a little when you are manipulating the focus at high magnification, but it will be steady again in less than a second.

Joachim
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Old Saturday 14th March 2020, 22:49   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian Byrnes View Post
Its quite funny to see how you are getting on.....you seem just like me....an amateur !!
I was like a kid with a new toy when mine arrived and did pretty much the same as you.....took shots of squirrels in the garden.
From the photos it looks pretty good and the tripods a Manfrotto, which are usually good also. The package looks impressive.
I take shots with an old IPhone 5s ... I took this today....bit blurry.uu
How did you down load more than one photo....I can only ever get one at a time to appear?

Regards Ian
Thanks! It is pretty bad, the way I get excited about new (to me) equipment. I checked my phone 10 times this morning, just to see the tracking progress.

Your photo looks really good. I don't know what it is, but the photo is great.

I am going to have a hard time concentrating at work on Monday, because my PhoneSkope stuff should arrive by then.

Regarding multiple photos, I am not sure I can explain it exactly. I go to "Attach Files" and click on the "Manage Attachments" button. Once there, I go to "Browse", and click there. I select my file, and then click "Upload". Once the file uploads, the window for the file should say "No file selected". I then click "Browse" and start the process over again. Once I have all of the files uploaded, I scroll to the bottom of the "Manage Attachments" window, and click "Close this Window".

I hope that helps you. Feel free to post more photos.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jring View Post
Hi,

seems you got a good deal - congratulations. The images look sharp enough at 60x. Let us know how the star test looks like.

The images look about as yellow as I remember the one example I tried. On the other hand you can correct it in images and while observing the brain tends to adapt after a few seconds...

The objective lens does not look like it needs cleaning - you know the astronomer joke about how to best clean optical surfaces and the answer being not.

If you have astro EPs, there is an adapter available to use 1.25" ones in the diascope. The question is, if all come to focus though, as spotting scopes tend to have a bit less focus travel than your average astro scope.

https://www.teleskop-express.de/shop...uf-1-1-4-.html

I probably would first try to get a better tripod - the one shown looks a bit flimsy and is maybe better used for a small camera. A good tripod will also shake a little when you are manipulating the focus at high magnification, but it will be steady again in less than a second.

Joachim
Joachim, thank you for the observations. I THINK I did get a decent deal. I did notice some internal dust, that I did not see at first. Also, there is a minuscule scratch on the ep eye-lens. That was disappointing. It is barely discernible, but now that I know it is there, it just bugs me. Totally invisible unless the lighting is perfect. No effect on the image.

I wonder if I could send it to Zeiss for cleaning. (?)

Yes, the image seems to be tinted yellow. It does not bother me, but might bother some. Sometimes I prefer this over a more bluish tint. It is early, so I am not sure how I feel about it.

Thank you for the link to the adapter. I will probably pursue that. Maybe not immediately, but soon. I have a Celestron C102F, so I use that pretty frequently, but something as light as this scope would be very convenient.

Speaking of its weight, I found specs at BH Photo that said the scope was 3.9#. However, I do not know if that includes the ep or not. I will have to look into that a bit.

The tripod and head are the Manfrotto 055XB and 128RC. From what I could find, they are rated for 9# and 8# respectively. Not sure what the rule of thumb is for weight capacity ratings and real-life capacity. Based on these weights, would you consider this tripod/mount sufficient for this scope? It doesn't vibrate horribly at all, but more than I expected. It is minimal enough that I am not in a rush to replace it, but just wondered about your opinion.

For anyone that is interested, I found that a Fujinon 16x70 objective cover, somehow, fits the Diascope objective. I happened to find one that had been lost. I previously sold the binoculars, so the cover has been in a bag of miscellaneous caps and plugs for awhile. I also found a random Swift bino cap for the ep.

The Kowa case had cat hair, or some kind of animal hair, all over it. Well, not covering it, but enough that it was obvious. I swept it, and cleaned it as thoroughly as possible. When I posted the photo of the cap, I see that one hair escaped me.
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Old Sunday 15th March 2020, 14:42   #17
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Hi,

first of all, please don't panic about a few specks of dust or a tiny scratch. They will not diminish the perfomance! Keep the visit to Zeiss for when there is really some defect.

Weight of the diascope body is 1.5kg, so the 3.9 pound was probably with EP.

The 055 should be ok, interesting how perspective can be misleading - it didn't look like a full size tripod on that shot... the 128RC is often recommended for spotting scopes but my nearly unused example shows that it is not my favourite, at least not for full size scopes - I prefer the 500AH for that due to the possibility to properly balance the scope with a long rail and the counterbalance.

Regarding the two speed focus drive - the fine focus should be the front one...

Joachim
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Old Sunday 15th March 2020, 17:16   #18
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Hi Joker9937

I don't know what I enjoy more - birding or the equipment. I have to check my many deliveries also so that I can get to the door before my wife...so that she doesn't say ' what have bought now!!'

Birding, binoculars and scopes are a real delight and addictive. A day doesn't pass that I don't go out looking for new species. Corona virus is going to be a real problem as Britain are asking for self confinement for the over 70's and I'm 69 so think I should may be do the same as I've got the health problems which put me at risk. I live in the depths of the countryside so am away from heavily populated areas so can still get out locally to do my birding.

Back to the scope....mine has a few air bubbles in the objective lense which irritate a little but don't detract from the performance. What phone will you be using with your PhoneSkope? You obviously had no trouble getting the 20-60 lense attachment. The fit with mine is very good.

So I'll try and download a few more pics......

NO....failed again oh well....

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Old Monday 16th March 2020, 00:19   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jring View Post
Hi,

first of all, please don't panic about a few specks of dust or a tiny scratch. They will not diminish the perfomance! Keep the visit to Zeiss for when there is really some defect.

Weight of the diascope body is 1.5kg, so the 3.9 pound was probably with EP.

The 055 should be ok, interesting how perspective can be misleading - it didn't look like a full size tripod on that shot... the 128RC is often recommended for spotting scopes but my nearly unused example shows that it is not my favourite, at least not for full size scopes - I prefer the 500AH for that due to the possibility to properly balance the scope with a long rail and the counterbalance.

Regarding the two speed focus drive - the fine focus should be the front one...

Joachim
Thanks, Joachim. I am not too worried about the dust. At least, I THINK it is dust. It is a little weird. I see some specks when I am at 20x, but not not at the higher power(s). And, it is only when I put my eye off axis. So, the black band, when your eye has not found the center of the fov, is when the specks are there. Looking backward through the scope, I can see what I think are the dust specks. As long as that is all that it is, I am not worried. I get a little OCD about stuff like that, so I am trying to ignore it.

I am happy with the tripod, at this point. But, I might look into a different one. For now, until I give it a bit more time, I will continue to test it out. The head you mentioned, though, is on my radar. Thank you!

Thank you, regarding the focuser explanation.
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Old Monday 16th March 2020, 00:46   #20
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Originally Posted by Ian Byrnes View Post
Hi Joker9937

I don't know what I enjoy more - birding or the equipment. I have to check my many deliveries also so that I can get to the door before my wife...so that she doesn't say ' what have bought now!!'

Birding, binoculars and scopes are a real delight and addictive. A day doesn't pass that I don't go out looking for new species. Corona virus is going to be a real problem as Britain are asking for self confinement for the over 70's and I'm 69 so think I should may be do the same as I've got the health problems which put me at risk. I live in the depths of the countryside so am away from heavily populated areas so can still get out locally to do my birding.

Back to the scope....mine has a few air bubbles in the objective lense which irritate a little but don't detract from the performance. What phone will you be using with your PhoneSkope? You obviously had no trouble getting the 20-60 lense attachment. The fit with mine is very good.

So I'll try and download a few more pics......

NO....failed again oh well....

Attachment 721169
Funny you mention that the indecisiveness on what part of the hobby you like the best. I feel that way too. It is a bit of a black hole for me. LOL. My sweet wife, and our two youngest that are still at home for a few more years, tolerate my obsessions. LOL. Most of my binoculars are older than I am, but I have so many, and have been through so many, that it is almost ridiculous.

I hope and pray that the Coronavirus dies on the vine. It is a wake up call to humanity. We are not invincible. A lowly microscopic organism is bringing us low. Hang in there and stay healthy!

Maybe what I see are air bubbles and not dust??? I never thought of that. Hmmm...

I definitely took your advice on ordering the connector. I looked for the one made specifically for the Diascope. I hope it is the correct one. We will see tomorrow.

I wish I could give you better instruction on uploading multiple pics. Not sure what to say. I wonder if you have a different computer than I do. I am just using a Microsoft Surface. Not sure if that factors in or not.

I love the Cormorant photo. Great job with that! I have always liked those birds. Your pic looks like he is getting ready to dive any second. Love it.

I tried to get a pic of a Lesser Scaup today, but without the adapter, I could not stay on him. Next time.

I am using a Samsung Note 10+. It has a great camera, but I am a bit inept. Not quite 50, but I am sort of a knuckle-dragger when it comes to technology. Learning, though.

Even though I do not have the adapter, I hiked back into the woods behind our house before church this morning. I fumbled around with taking some handheld pics with the scope.

These are all at 60x. The Cardinal pic had the contrast bumped a couple of points, but that is it. I took it through a few branches, so it is not very sharp as a result. The same thing affected the pic of the Bald Eagle. I included the untouched photo of the eagle, as well as the modified one.

I still need to star test it, but I am pretty hopeful that it is a performer. The camera on my phone, though, is pretty amazing, so not sure what gets the most credit. LOL.
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Old Monday 16th March 2020, 05:55   #21
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Well I'm just blown away with your photos, they are amazing and to think that you not only have such a beautiful bird as the Cardinal near you BUT to have the opportunity to photograph a Bald Eagle and at such a close distance is wonderful. What sort of terrain do you live close to down there in Fort Wayne and what sort of proliferation of species do you have?

My iPhone doesn't compare with your Samsung...........looks like another delivery from the postman !! Your shots are brilliant without the phoneskope.

The occurrence of Coranvirus infections and deaths is rising rapidly now. I need to make my last trip out to get some tyres for my car today, then my wife and I are FULLY self isolating. My daughter is dropping food off and we are getting home deliveries from the supermarkets and I think Britain will be in full lock down in a week or so time which means neither of us can leave our home for up to 4 months.....a sobering thought. The rest of Europe is doing the same.....Italy, France, Germany, Spain, Denmark etc are already locked down with borders closed. Poor Italy and Spain have been hit extremely hard and it can only get worse.

Take care and good birding.

Ian
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Old Monday 16th March 2020, 06:44   #22
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Oh and about the air bubbles..... I think may be Zeiss suffered a bit with this 'air bubble' problem from what I have read. It's supposedly the high quality of the lense manufacture that causes it ! If you search for 'air bubbles in objective lens' on Birdforum it brings up other occurrences.

I contacted the UK Zeiss technician regarding this and because I am still within warranty they will replace them for me. I haven't done it yet because of all that's going on but mine was the same as yours.....bubbles and specks at 20 which disappear as you zoom through. But for now I'm not to worried as I don't want to be without the scope for a long period of time.

I'm off to the tyre garage now ...so bye for now.

Ian ( & what's your name?)
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Old Monday 16th March 2020, 12:55   #23
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Originally Posted by Ian Byrnes View Post
Well I'm just blown away with your photos, they are amazing and to think that you not only have such a beautiful bird as the Cardinal near you BUT to have the opportunity to photograph a Bald Eagle and at such a close distance is wonderful. What sort of terrain do you live close to down there in Fort Wayne and what sort of proliferation of species do you have?

My iPhone doesn't compare with your Samsung...........looks like another delivery from the postman !! Your shots are brilliant without the phoneskope.

The occurrence of Coranvirus infections and deaths is rising rapidly now. I need to make my last trip out to get some tyres for my car today, then my wife and I are FULLY self isolating. My daughter is dropping food off and we are getting home deliveries from the supermarkets and I think Britain will be in full lock down in a week or so time which means neither of us can leave our home for up to 4 months.....a sobering thought. The rest of Europe is doing the same.....Italy, France, Germany, Spain, Denmark etc are already locked down with borders closed. Poor Italy and Spain have been hit extremely hard and it can only get worse.

Take care and good birding.

Ian
Ian, thanks for the compliment. Honestly, I am a little surprised at the photos too. Although, I do not think I can personally take any credit. The Note 10+ really does have a highly rated camera. Plus the conditions and the scope itself are the responsible parties. Thank you all the same, though. I wonder if the adapter/holder will make the photos that much better. I hope so.

I just need to do a little research on the proper way to adjust the settings. The stock camera allows a "Pro" mode. I could not really use it handheld, but hopefully will be able to with the adapter. We will see.

Besides my interest in Whitetail photos, and maybe as a number one reason, the Bald Eagles were a primary motivation for me to pursue digiscoping. It still boggles my mind, in a way, to think that I have a nesting pair so close to my house. They have really bounced back. Knowing that they are there, I have tried various times to get photos of them. Failing, and not wanting to invest thousands into a new hobby (photography/cameras), I went this direction.

Regarding the terrain, this area is mostly flat farm fields, creeks, and the scattered woodlot. Some of the woods stretch for hundreds of acres, but most are less than 100. We are around 4 miles from the town, and have subdivision neighborhoods just down the road. This part of the state is sort of a country/suburbia. I would prefer to be much farther from towns, but I will be happy with what I can get.

I am not really a birder, per se, but, I consider myself, an outdoorsman, of sorts anyway. So, I am sure I know a very limited group of birds by sight. I frequently see Cardinals, Flickers, Red-headed and Downy Woodpeckers (I think), Eastern Bluebirds, Indigo Buntings, a variety of other finches, recently started seeing Pileated Woodpeckers. Thrushes, Red-tailed hawks, Coopers, Barred and Great-horned owls, and so on, are not uncommon. I actually rarely see the owls, but hear them nightly. Deer and Coyote are very common. Otters are coming back. Beaver, Mink, and the like, are around. We have some local wetlands that are set aside. They are usually hundreds of acres, but not thousands, at least within a 30 minute drive radius. I don't know very many waterfowl by sight, but see grebes, wood ducks, mergansers, and others there.

I hope and pray that you remain untouched, at least physically, by the virus. Our kids' schools have shut down for a month. Our foster son, in college now, is off for around the same amount of time. Our oldest son, in the military, has been confined to his base. Our oldest daughter, on her own, is a pre-school teacher/daycare provider for toddlers. She is always dealing with some sort of mild cold or something. If her work shuts down for weeks, it will be difficult, at minimum. Thankfully she is local, so we will all help each other out. Maybe that is one good outcome; that we all work together for once...the country and world, I mean.

Stay well!

I used to read James Herriot's books when I was a kid. Have you heard of him? Not sure if he is as famous in the UK, even though he is from there, as he is/was here. Seeing your mention of needing "tyres", threw me back to those days. I thought he was a great writer, and his books nearly caused me to pursue veterinary medicine. Looking back, I still wish I would have.
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Old Monday 16th March 2020, 12:56   #24
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My apologies. I forgot to answer your question. My name is Scott. :)
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Old Monday 16th March 2020, 13:16   #25
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I forgot too, Joachim, that I had a brief moment to try star testing it. It was 30* F here, so I should have let the scope cool down from the warm house. I didn't, though. So, hopefully this would change it for the better. Plus, seeing was below average to almost poor.

Definitely different on each side of focus. I am not good at identifying exactly WHAT the issue is, but on one side it looks good, with concentric circles. Although, either the atmosphere or roughness (I think) caused the circles to not be continuous. I hope that makes sense.

On the other side of focus, the circles were sort of astigmatic. Spiky. Turned edge?

Also, I am not sure what magnification I should use. Hopefully, I will get a chance soon to actually take the time to let the scope settle down, and conduct the test properly.

I was surprised at what I saw, though. I do realize that am excellent scope will have obviously nearly identical de-focused images. This scope did not. I hope that under good conditions that will change. I could easily see all 4 stars in the Trapezium, and they were distinctly separated. I don't remember at what power, though. Should I see that at 20x or would I need to crank up the power to at least 30? I will pay closer attention.

No moon at the time I was outside.

No complaints terrestrially, yet. If this tests poorly, it is just another lesson learned. Unless it is free, try before you buy.

Not throwing the baby out with the bathwater, but still might be learning the hard way.
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