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request advice upgrading from bridge camera to DSLR (1 Viewer)

Chosun Juan said:
I'd agree with that - getting good photos is very much a deliberate act. That's not to say it can't be enjoyable just walking around doing a bit of both - it tends to suit more observational type birding :t:

Chosun :gh:
Click to expand...

Dear Sir
Thank you for your helpful comments.
I am not really a serious photographer. I have not got a serious goal to clinch fantastic shots of birds. I have kind of been using my bridge camera as a telescope in a sort of way. What I mean is, that I havent got an actual telescope at all. Ive been going birding with just bins and bridge camera (travelling light!) , and taking shots of birds I see, with the goal of later viewing the shots taken on the computer to clinch identity of the birds seen.
Where birds are distant one often is not able to identify properly the bird until when one gets back home and looks at the photo on the computer. . A prime example of this is when doing wetland birding and birds such as waders are a long way off. With the superzoom camera with zoom fully extended quality has been poor and at times Identification has not happened.

Maybe I would have been better served had I gone for a more modern superzoom bridge camera, but perhaps now I do have the D7100, it might work out for me say, on a future , once in a lifetime trip to the Gambia. Who knows. Do you think taking both cameras out with me would be a good idea please?
 
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Earnest lad said:
Dear all who have contributed. Thank you for generously sharing your undoubted expertise, which is most helpful indeed.
I have taken the plunge and purchased a second-hand Nikon D7100 camera with only 4300 shutter actuations. I was a good price. Now I just need a lens.
I have realised that a bridge camera may be more versatile than a (DSLR plus long lens) because one can get shots of birds very close in as well as distant birds, whereas if you are in the field with a long lens you cannot zoom close in (as far as I can see).
When I obtain a lens (perhaps one of the 600mm lens' mentioned by helpful contributors to this thread) , I can give it a try.
I have only just realised, but as far as I can see, unlike with a bridge camera, with the DSLR set up one will have to zoom in and out manually by turning the dial on the lens. perhaps I am mistaken though, being largely unfamiliar with photography. With a superzoom bridge camera it is obviously all done by the camera function of zoom in .
I guess with the set up I am on the way to obtaining , (if I buy a second hand lens) if I find it doesn't suit, I would probably be able to get most of my money back by re-selling the lens and camera on again. So, hopefully, not much if anything is lost by trying it out.
Click to expand...
That sounds like a plan :t:
The Nikon D7100 is a very nice camera - and yours at 4300 activations has hardly been used.

When it comes to getting the lens - go for the one that you like the handling of the best (optically you can throw a blanket over them, and unit to unit variation could play a big a part as anything - so make sure to test any 2nd hand one out /see previous test photos).

Some of the lenses such as the Tamron G2 you will be able to fine tune at various focal lengths and distances so focus should be spot on. With any of them, turning the zoom ring manually is a big plus as you will be able to do it much faster than waiting for a bridge camera to zoom in or out. Make sure you are happy with the number of turns of the zoom ring for the lens you buy.

If you get a 150-600 for example, you will be able to zoom in or out (to get a bigger or smaller [more background] image) - you just need to make sure you are at least the minimum focus distance away (which is around ~7 to ~10 feet depending on brand).

With the Nikon D7100 you will be able to shoot in 1.3x in-camera crop mode and this will give you an extra fps ....

You are right in that if you buy 2nd hand most of the depreciation has already taken place, so it is very cheap fun :t:




Chosun :gh:
 
Earnest lad said:
Dear Sir
Thank you for your helpful comments.
I am not really a serious photographer. I have not got a serious goal to clinch fantastic shots of birds. I have kind of been using my bridge camera as a telescope in a sort of way. What I mean is, that I havent got an actual telescope at all. Ive been going birding with just bins and bridge camera (travelling light!) , and taking shots of birds I see, with the goal of later viewing the shots taken on the computer to clinch identity of the birds seen.
Where birds are distant one often is not able to identify properly the bird until when one gets back home and looks at the photo on the computer. . A prime example of this is when doing wetland birding and birds such as waders are a long way off. With the superzoom camera with zoom fully extended quality has been poor and at times Identification has not happened.

Maybe I would have been better served had I gone for a more modern superzoom bridge camera, but perhaps now I do have the D7100, it might work out for me say, on a future , once in a lifetime trip to the Gambia. Who knows. Do you think taking both cameras out with me would be a good idea please?
Click to expand...

Lol - not often that I get called Sir ! :)

Lately, due to an injury, I've been really minimizing the kit I cart and so have been leaving the bins at home. If you use the Nikon D7100 with say a Tamron G2 150-600 (the one I have and would try and get) and use it in 1.3x crop mode you are getting 600 x 1.53 (APS-C sensor crop) x 1.3×in-camera crop = ~1200mm equivalent focal length. This is the same as looking through a pair of (1200/50) = 24x binoculars ! Then you can even zoom in further from there on the camera's LCD screen.

So such a camera set up can replace the function of binoculars, telescope, and bridge camera - certainly for review and id purposes. In fact there are times when I have looked in a specific location for birds with my 8x binoculars and not been able to see any birds - so I took a shot at ~1200mm eq of where I thought they might be, and then zoomed in on the LCD to find them crouched down there ! So yes certainly it is useful and you don't need another bridge camera as well.

The only considerations are that you are mainly using the system in a review fashion (you can also view in real time but are then limited to 24x) , and so a bit of shelter from glare is best for reviewing images on the camera's LCD screen.

The other thing with a 600mm supertelephoto zoom lens is getting used to the system's ~6lb weight, and something to steady on helps. It gives you capabilities that are difficult to replicate elsewhere and you will soon come to get a lot of enjoyment out of that.

The last point I think is of importance if you are buying one of these 600mm supertelephoto zoom lenses 2nd hand is - why is the seller selling it?
Is it just that they are seeking something lighter /or more compact for inconspicuous travel?
Upgrading to newer better equipment?
Or because they are not particularly happy with their units performance (on the softer side of average IQ)?
Or because of some damage or fault?
Do your homework and you should be OK.





Chosun :gh:
 
You are most welcome - thank you
By the way, it is helpful to read of your shared experience.

I have seen the G2 on ebay, and it seems a bit dear to buy.
I have noticed other Tamron 150-600mm models such as for example

Tamron SP 150-600mm f/5-6.3 Di VC USD Telephoto Zoom Lens A011N Nikon AF Fit and others

some are which are less expensive than the G2. Please do you know if these are OK?


The other thing with a 600mm supertelephoto zoom lens is getting used to the system's ~6lb weight, and something to steady on helps. It gives you capabilities that are difficult to replicate elsewhere and you will soon come to get a lot of enjoyment out of that.

I have seen a guy with a similar set up and he had a kind of monopod

The last point I think is of importance if you are buying one of these 600mm supertelephoto zoom lenses 2nd hand is -

Thank you for that tip. I would be heartbreaking if the outlay of that kind of money landed one with a faulty unit.
 
Earnest lad said:
You are most welcome - thank you
By the way, it is helpful to read of your shared experience.

I have seen the G2 on ebay, and it seems a bit dear to buy.
I have noticed other Tamron 150-600mm models such as for example

Tamron SP 150-600mm f/5-6.3 Di VC USD Telephoto Zoom Lens A011N Nikon AF Fit and others

some are which are less expensive than the G2. Please do you know if these are OK?


The other thing with a 600mm supertelephoto zoom lens is getting used to the system's ~6lb weight, and something to steady on helps. It gives you capabilities that are difficult to replicate elsewhere and you will soon come to get a lot of enjoyment out of that.

I have seen a guy with a similar set up and he had a kind of monopod

The last point I think is of importance if you are buying one of these 600mm supertelephoto zoom lenses 2nd hand is -

Thank you for that tip. I would be heartbreaking if the outlay of that kind of money landed one with a faulty unit.
Click to expand...
The first generation Tammy (A011) is still a good lens but is missing a few bells and whistles versus the G2 (A022). The most important of these is the "tap-in dock" - a USB portal for downloading changes in firmware into, and also imporant for doing the fine tuning I mentioned. The other important difference is better weather sealing. Tamron really listened to the feedback from the first version and improved on just about all of it for the G2.

Optically the G2 has 1 extra lens over the G1 which is meant to help slightly with CA, and edge sharpness. It's just one lens so the differences are not going to be great.

If it was me I would stump up the extra and get the G2.

If the budget really doesn't stretch that far I would get the Sigma C which is only a smidge behind.

They are your best bets. Tammy G2, or if that's not possible, then Sigma C. The Nikon 200-500 f5.6 is also a very good lens (equal to the G2 and about the same price) though a bit heavier.




Chosun :gh:
 
When the first gen of Tamron 150-600 came out many owners suffered from occasional focus freeze on them with Nikon cameras, the lens had to be removed and refitted.

My first one was returned to Tamron three times and they couldnt fix it so replaced it, the replacement started doing the same after a few thousand shots so i returnded it and got the Sigma.
 
nikonmike said:
When the first gen of Tamron 150-600 came out many owners suffered from occasional focus freeze on them with Nikon cameras, the lens had to be removed and refitted.

My first one was returned to Tamron three times and they couldnt fix it so replaced it, the replacement started doing the same after a few thousand shots so i returnded it and got the Sigma.
Click to expand...
That's an interesting (if annoying) experience. I believe that Tamron offered to have all initial Gen 1 units returned to service centre's and have new firmware installed all at their cost which fixed the problem. That's the first time I have heard of something like your experience .....

My G2 certainly has no such issues (thank goodness ! :)



Chosun :gh:
 
Dear Chosun & Mike.
Thank you
I may try the G1 as , going off ebay, prices for this model seem a good bit lower than the g1
(bearing in mind it is just a start)
I see from ebay the Sigma C seems to be only a little behind the G2 in price.
In view of possible issues you both mentioned I would have to try the lens out before purchase.
One would hope such a setup (D7100 and 600mm lens) would get me better photos when shooting at a distance than the present camera I have which is the fuji S8500 bridge camera 46x optical zoom

Another thing I just thought about doing is hiring a lens from a shop and trying out that way
 
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Earnest lad said:
Dear Chosun & Mike.
Thank you
I may try the G1 as , going off ebay, prices for this model seem a good bit lower than the g1
(bearing in mind it is just a start)
I see from ebay the Sigma C seems to be only a little behind the G2 in price.
In view of possible issues you both mentioned I would have to try the lens out before purchase.
One would hope such a setup (D7100 and 600mm lens) would get me better photos when shooting at a distance than the present camera I have which is the fuji S8500 bridge camera 46x optical zoom

Another thing I just thought about doing is hiring a lens from a shop and trying out that way
Click to expand...
In practical terms, optically, throw a blanket over the three (or four) 600mm (500mm) offerings on the market ...... :cat:
There seems to be only up to a couple of hundred £ difference in price between them all.

I would do whatever it takes (within the bounds of the law! :) to get the Tammy G2. Whether that be cutting back on the smashed avo's on toast and vegan caramel latte's, or coasting downhill in neutral or whatever ! just do it ! :-O

The Tammy G2 has the shortest minimum focus distance out of all of them at 2.2m @600mm. This makes it more versatile for animals/ flowers/ insects/ reptiles etc, and you will surprised at the number of little birds that will wander inside of 2.7m (9ft) !

The Tammy G2 being a current model (with the Tap-in Dock) allows you to upgrade new firmware released, or for new bodies down the track (the mythical D500S, or Z70 if either ever materialize). As such it's a bit more future proof. (The first version Tammy - A011 would still work, but you may have to send it in to a service centre for them to download new firmware into the lens directly)

The Tammy G2 also has better build quality and weather sealing.

These reasons are enough to say go Tammy G2, the extra moolah is worth it.

Here is the original press release of some 3 years ago detailing the changes made in improving the A011 to A022 (G2): https://m.dpreview.com/news/6044873650/tamron-announces-2nd-generation-sp-150-600mm-di-vc-usd-g2

I think that's about the 18th time I've recommended the Tammy G2 ....... there might be something in that - hint hint hint ! ;)

P.S. (see my post#35) - your FujiS8500 is only a 22x optical zoom (over normal 50mm equivalent view). The D7100 + Tammy G2 when shot in 1.3x crop mode will be ~23x optical zoom (due to a slight bit of 'focus breathing' reducing it from the nominal 24x). As such the image should be a p**fteenth bigger on the Nikon setup, and the quality of the pixels and latitude to alter exposure in processing, and to crop further should be a fair bit better. Take care in getting a steady shot. Things like a sling (invaluable for carrying as well as being a useful brace for shooting), monopod, rest, or tripod, help.






Chosun :gh:
 
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Chosun Juan said:
In practical terms, optically, throw a blanket over the three (or four) 600mm (500mm) offerings on the market ...... :cat:
There seems to be only up to a couple of hundred £ difference in price between them all.

I would do whatever it takes (within the bounds of the law! :) to get the Tammy G2. Whether that be cutting back on the smashed avo's on toast and vegan caramel latte's, or coasting downhill in neutral or whatever ! just do it ! :-O

The Tammy G2 has the shortest minimum focus distance out of all of them at 2.2m @600mm. This makes it more versatile for animals/ flowers/ insects/ reptiles etc, and you will surprised at the number of little birds that will wander inside of 2.7m (9ft) !

The Tammy G2 being a current model (with the Tap-in Dock) allows you to upgrade new firmware released, or for new bodies down the track (the mythical D500S, or Z70 if either ever materialize). As such it's a bit more future proof. (The first version Tammy - A011 would still work, but you may have to send it in to a service centre for them to download new firmware into the lens directly)

The Tammy G2 also has better build quality and weather sealing.

These reasons are enough to say go Tammy G2, the extra moolah is worth it.

Here is the original press release of some 3 years ago detailing the changes made in improving the A011 to A022 (G2): https://m.dpreview.com/news/6044873650/tamron-announces-2nd-generation-sp-150-600mm-di-vc-usd-g2

I think that's about the 18th time I've recommended the Tammy G2 ....... there might be something in that - hint hint hint ! ;)

P.S. (see my post#35) - your FujiS8500 is only a 22x optical zoom (over normal 50mm equivalent view). The D7100 + Tammy G2 when shot in 1.3x crop mode will be ~23x optical zoom (due to a slight bit of 'focus breathing' reducing it from the nominal 24x). As such the image should be a p**fteenth bigger on the Nikon setup, and the quality of the pixels and latitude to alter exposure in processing, and to crop further should be a fair bit better. Take care in getting a steady shot. Things like a sling (invaluable for carrying as well as being a useful brace for shooting), monopod, rest, or tripod, help.






Chosun :gh:
Click to expand...

Thank you I am thinking now to save up for the G2.
I have been doing a bit of reading up on this photograghic equipment business.
Please can advise on whether a teleconverter lens would be a useful addition to the kit.
For example what if, instead of getting a 600mm lens, I were to get a 500mm lens and a 1.4 teleconverter. I understand that would make for a lighter, more portable kit. However would the quality be any better than the bridge camera I am currently using if I may ask please?
 
Earnest lad said:
Thank you I am thinking now to save up for the G2.
I have been doing a bit of reading up on this photograghic equipment business.
Please can advise on whether a teleconverter lens would be a useful addition to the kit.
For example what if, instead of getting a 600mm lens, I were to get a 500mm lens and a 1.4 teleconverter. I understand that would make for a lighter, more portable kit. However would the quality be any better than the bridge camera I am currently using if I may ask please?
Click to expand...

To be honest any 500mm lens withing budget would not work well with a converter,even with a 1.4 you would lose one stop of light which is not so good for AF.
 
I changed from Superzoom Bridge to DSLR over a year ago and haven’t regretted it. I bought a brand new D5600 with the 18-55mm kit lens and then bought 70-300 and an 18-200 VR lenses. The 18-200 is virtually the ultimate walk about lens for when you’re not birding and the 70-300 gives decent results at sensible ranges. One thing I didn’t like about the D5600 is that there is no info widow on the top plate.

A year on I saw a D7200 body with 29,000 shutter count in a London Camera Exchange and went for it and traded in my D5600 with the 18-55. The D7200 is a beautiful bit of kit and I have agonised long (on here mostly) about a big zoom for birding. I’ve been looking at the same lenses you have but you don’t seem to have considered the Nikon 200-500 f5.6 which is where my wandering gaze has currently settled. It is reviewed as being sharp and generally better, image wise, than the Tammy or Sigma and is reported to perform well with Nikon’s 1.4 teleconverter. Importantly it’s around the same price as the Tammy G2 and the Sigma 150-600 Contemporary. It’s heavier than both the others but still weighs a lot less than the Sigma 150-600 Sport, which is reviewed as a great lens but is too weighty IMHO. I’ve had the Tammy and the Nikon on my camera and shot test photos with both and I’ve handled the Sigma Contemporary but discounted it as I didn’t like the “feel”, the zoom ring was stiff and the zoom rotates “the wrong way” for a Nikon user.

So, hope I haven’t thrown a spanner in the works but them‘s my thoughts and my 70th birthday is fast approaching (as is Black Friday) and I think my cash is going to be splashed on the Nikon.
 
Earnest lad said:
Thank you I am thinking now to save up for the G2.
I have been doing a bit of reading up on this photograghic equipment business.
Please can advise on whether a teleconverter lens would be a useful addition to the kit.
For example what if, instead of getting a 600mm lens, I were to get a 500mm lens and a 1.4 teleconverter. I understand that would make for a lighter, more portable kit. However would the quality be any better than the bridge camera I am currently using if I may ask please?
Click to expand...
Just get the Tamron 150-600 G2.

It is already 300grams lighter than the only '500' within your budget and that is the Nikon 200-500. If you add a 1.4x TC to that then it will be will be half a kilo heavier. Also as Mike said you will be at f8, lose AF points and slow it right down.

1.4xTC'S on these super zoom telephotos are really a specialist set up that you use where you absolutely cannot get closer and you are shooting from a sturdy tripod with no wind, vibrations etc, use mirror up and timer, have perfect atmospheric conditions and cooperative static subjects. It is also ok for doing semi-macro stuff with the same techniques ....... not exactly high percentage walkabout stuff.

You could add the ~130gram Tamron 1.4x TC to the Tamron 150-600 which gives you f9 but it will report as f8 and so still give you the same AF points and IQ reduction as the Nikon.

The only lighter Nikon lens remotely considerable that will work well with a 1.4xTC is the PF 500 f5.6 ........ but that is 3 X the cost of any of the lenses under consideration.

So basically just forget about the TC idea unless you have spare cash to burn and want it just for interest sake ...... IQ should be better than most bridge cameras still - but not all in good light.

Saving for the Tammy G2 is a good move :t:
Remember that at ~23X (due to a tiny bit of focus breathing) in 1.3x in-camera crop mode you will still have greater reach than your 22X eq bridge camera (1100/50). Save away & Good luck !

Getting closer to the subject in the right light and direction with the right settings and right technique as well as being in the right spot at the right time, is the way to produce the best photos. Worrying about one lens or the other at this level is mostly inconsequential. :cat:




Chosun :gh:
 
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Black Friday deals - Nikon 200-500 is currently £999.99 at London Camera Exchange & Wilkinson Cameras. That’ll do for me!
 
Good luck, I have had the same combination for the past couple of months and I have been very happy with the number of keepers. I have hand held all of the time and found it not as heavy as I imagined.

TBF I have not had the opportunity to try a Tammy G2 but I prefer the Nikon to the Sigma 150-600 C and the Tammy G1. As Chosun said it is more about technique and fieldcraft than which of these lenses are best. It is all down to which feels best for you.
 
Apodidae49 said:
Black Friday deals - Nikon 200-500 is currently £999.99 at London Camera Exchange & Wilkinson Cameras. That’ll do for me!
Click to expand...
Apodidae, Earnest Lad,
From time to time decent specials do pop up and that is a great time to jump on a bit of kit.

They are also doing the Tamron G2 150-600 for £949 :t:
https://www.wilkinson.co.uk/tamron-sp-150-600mm-f-5-6-3-vc-usd-g2-lens-for-nikon-f-mount/


I'm not sure how long these deals last - I'd be on the phone right now. Whichever one you fancy - jump on it ! :)





Chosun :gh:
 
Earnest lad said:
Thank you I am thinking now to save up for the G2.
I have been doing a bit of reading up on this photograghic equipment business.
Please can advise on whether a teleconverter lens would be a useful addition to the kit.
For example what if, instead of getting a 600mm lens, I were to get a 500mm lens and a 1.4 teleconverter. I understand that would make for a lighter, more portable kit. However would the quality be any better than the bridge camera I am currently using if I may ask please?
Click to expand...

Which 500mm would you put a TC on? Something like like the Sigma 150-500 f/5.6-6.3? Don't do it. That would give you an f/9 lens with a 1.4x TC. Your auto focus will be awful and it would only be usable in very good lighting. You would also be limited to the center AF point, if it works at all. The lens would be very slow to focus and hunt a lot.

TC's are only really usable on the highest quality lenses with fast speeds: 400 f/2.8, 400 f/4, 500 f/4, 600 f/4. If the combined f-stop is slower than f/5.6, your performance will be poor. Also, a TC is essentially a magnifier and it will magnify any imperfections in the lens, so they only get used with high-end lenses.

I've gotten OK shots with the Nikon 200-500 f/5.6 and Nikon 500 f/5.6E with a 1.4x TC, but it's not something I'd use regularly. f/8 is slow and the focus is not very snappy.

Marc
 
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