Hi Tenex,
You might want to give it one more try and contact Cory Suddarth in Oklahoma for repairs.
If he can't fix it it probably can't be fixed. Review his website in the link below for more information.
https://suddarthoptical.com/
Bob
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Zeiss (USA) service problems (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter tenex
- Start date
Hi Tenex,
You might want to give it one more try and contact Cory Suddarth in Oklahoma for repairs.
If he can't fix it it probably can't be fixed. Review his website in the link below for more information.
https://suddarthoptical.com/
Bob
PYRTLE
Old Berkshire Boy
tenex,
Were you charged for the service and return carriage? I note you are not sending them in a second time but personally am puzzled why you are willing to accept a unit that now has a diopter problem that maybe wasn't there before.
Shame that this lovely model does not meet your wishes.
Pyrtle
Were you charged for the service and return carriage? I note you are not sending them in a second time but personally am puzzled why you are willing to accept a unit that now has a diopter problem that maybe wasn't there before.
Shame that this lovely model does not meet your wishes.
Pyrtle
Tenex
This is unacceptable. Re-setting the dioptre is a routine part of most servicing and this has clearly been not done.
I would contact Zeiss KY and ask them to arrange for collection of the bino and putting this fault right, all at their expense.
Lee
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tenex
reality-based
I don't know for sure, but there's no indication it was sent anywhere from Kentucky. My impression (from an email I received after 3 weeks) is that nothing had happened yet by then, so there really wouldn't have been time.
No, that problem wasn't there before. And while it is a lovely object, without phase coatings the view stopped interesting me a long time ago. There just isn't much detail at long distances.
To all: Under the circumstances, I really don't care to pursue this further. I thought the Dialyt was worth sending in to see how it might be improved, but at this point it's not worth any more trouble or attention for me. Thanks though for your concern.
tenex
reality-based
...and the truth is revealed at last...
I just want to add that someone higher up at Zeiss USA has helped me learn more about the situation. It's actually impossible to upgrade my Dialyt to P* prisms, because serial # 1791xxx was manufactured in 1982 and had a slightly different prism size from the later model that became P* in 1988. End of story.
And now I know the beginning too. Ever since I verified that this bino wasn't phase coated (with the LED-screen and polarized-glasses test I found here on BF; of course it doesn't say P either, only T*) it's been clear that someone at B&H unloaded an outdated model on me when I bought it in 1989, the year after P* coatings came out. I had imagined it could have been one of the last made without them, but in fact it was seven years old already! Totally unethical either way, of course.
So once again I have to say: caveat emptor. Know exactly what you're supposed to be getting when you buy a binocular. (I had somehow missed the news about phase coatings, being occupied with my father's death, trying to sell his house in a down market, getting through my first year of university teaching, and so on...)
I just want to add that someone higher up at Zeiss USA has helped me learn more about the situation. It's actually impossible to upgrade my Dialyt to P* prisms, because serial # 1791xxx was manufactured in 1982 and had a slightly different prism size from the later model that became P* in 1988. End of story.
And now I know the beginning too. Ever since I verified that this bino wasn't phase coated (with the LED-screen and polarized-glasses test I found here on BF; of course it doesn't say P either, only T*) it's been clear that someone at B&H unloaded an outdated model on me when I bought it in 1989, the year after P* coatings came out. I had imagined it could have been one of the last made without them, but in fact it was seven years old already! Totally unethical either way, of course.
So once again I have to say: caveat emptor. Know exactly what you're supposed to be getting when you buy a binocular. (I had somehow missed the news about phase coatings, being occupied with my father's death, trying to sell his house in a down market, getting through my first year of university teaching, and so on...)
Also, those were the days when it was not so easy to be decently informed.
Interview with Zeiss Head of Customer Service
A major interview with important information concerning Zeiss Customer Service can be found at: https://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?p=3906351#post3906351
Lee
A major interview with important information concerning Zeiss Customer Service can be found at: https://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?p=3906351#post3906351
Lee
tenex
reality-based
Interesting, thanks for that interview. People today seem increasingly to value what I consider secondary factors like logistics over primary ones like expertise, some of which might even be irreplaceable. I myself would rather have had expert service at the cost of an extra day or two of transit, which seems insignificant compared to overall repair time. The proposition here is that new hires should be doing just as well within a year, and better after that; I wonder how the previous staff would take that. And in the meantime, well...
Final report: I did after all send back the Dialyt a second time, with a return label from Zeiss. Once again it took several weeks, and was returned without notice. I think the diopter can now be adjusted better, though the lens spacing still looks unequal (at 0) for some reason unknown to me. This time the form also states that realignment was performed, where previously it was merely said to have been checked. On the other hand, now there's more play in the focus wheel again, which was the original complaint. It's sort of like roulette.
Final report: I did after all send back the Dialyt a second time, with a return label from Zeiss. Once again it took several weeks, and was returned without notice. I think the diopter can now be adjusted better, though the lens spacing still looks unequal (at 0) for some reason unknown to me. This time the form also states that realignment was performed, where previously it was merely said to have been checked. On the other hand, now there's more play in the focus wheel again, which was the original complaint. It's sort of like roulette.
bluespiderweb
Great Grey Looking Out
Yes, Lee, thank you for that nice interview. It sounds promising that Zeiss realizes the problems in setting up a new service operation, and seems committed to making it happen.
I like how you always fend for us birdforum people here when you talk to the major optic guys-thank you for that as well. It's good to have big people in high places, routing for us! ; ) Seriously though, I do mean it. Who else do we have in our corner?! Yeah, Lee! If you ever feel like you want a political career, I have the perfect job for you. It would involve relocating, however, across the pond, but we got boids too!
I like how you always fend for us birdforum people here when you talk to the major optic guys-thank you for that as well. It's good to have big people in high places, routing for us! ; ) Seriously though, I do mean it. Who else do we have in our corner?! Yeah, Lee! If you ever feel like you want a political career, I have the perfect job for you. It would involve relocating, however, across the pond, but we got boids too!
If the NY repair centre had been staffed with well-experienced and knowledgeable engineers you might have had a strong argument along these lines Tenex, but the fact is that this was not really the case. The NY centre had not been established long enough after the move from Virginia, so was still very much a 'work-in-progress' rather than a centre with expertise the equal of Wetzlar.
For sure the KY centre was a step back at first but with the planned investment and new systems it will be better for the future.
Lee
dries1
Member
I would rather deal directly with Germany and not go through the USA, however that could be problematic. If I had some repairs to do, I would wait until after March 2020, hunting season is over so the flood of glass repairs has likely decreased, and by then perhaps the repair facility in Ky is up to speed.
Andy W.
Andy W.
tenex
reality-based
OK, so revert my argument to the previous move from Virginia, or wherever they were originally, which I hadn't been following. Leica has been in New Jersey since forever, and can still service old gear. (Or could the last time I needed to, anyway.)
WJC
Well-known member
Senior Chief Opticalman, Warren Nuckols, Zeiss USA, retired years ago and has since passed on. Judging by some of my communications, we will probably never see that level of tech service again.
Optically, the United States government was not ready for WWII. So, civilian Albert Ingalls (on the East Coast) and civilian Prof. G. Dallas Hanna (on the West Coast) stepped up to drag our butts out of the fire. Optically, we are much worse off today than in those days. :cat:
Bill
Tenex's comment about logistics recalls the well worn saying that amateurs study tactics while professionals study logistics. Done right (and our Teutonic friends are nothing if not masters of organization) this could be a win-win situation: Zeiss benefit from lower operating costs while bringing skilled jobs. There's no reason why a Kentuckian workforce can't, over time, reach the skill and experience level that used to be the case in Virginia, or wherever. It makes absolute sense to train technicians in servicing the most common models (that make economic sense to service, as opposed to replace) and send the more exotic stuff over to Germany. I'm sure we all hope the new service center will receive the investment in money and training it needs, and over time build up a reputation worthy of the name.
I also think those of us who own Dialyts and models of that vintage must accept that as parts become unavailable and institutional expertise retires, our much loved classics will inevitably go the way of the Delactems, Silvarems and Amplivids - ie. requiring skilled specialists to service, if that can be done at all.
PS. I can't help but wonder whether the cost of postage and technician time expended upon Tenex's 8x30B over the last few months exceeds that of a binocular that outperforms it optically and that, almost certainly, he'd be happier with - something like an 8x32 Terra ED, perhaps...
I also think those of us who own Dialyts and models of that vintage must accept that as parts become unavailable and institutional expertise retires, our much loved classics will inevitably go the way of the Delactems, Silvarems and Amplivids - ie. requiring skilled specialists to service, if that can be done at all.
PS. I can't help but wonder whether the cost of postage and technician time expended upon Tenex's 8x30B over the last few months exceeds that of a binocular that outperforms it optically and that, almost certainly, he'd be happier with - something like an 8x32 Terra ED, perhaps...
tenex
reality-based
Indeed. If I could have known in advance that an optical upgrade was impossible, I wouldn't have bothered at all. And I only sent it back a second time because they had created a new problem, and provided a shipping label. So after all that we're pretty much back to the original condition and usability, and someone got some practice on an old Dialyt. (As for alternatives, I have fancier taste than Terra... and little need for 8x at all, currently, so not an issue.)
