Of course, you can always remove yourself from the planet for an immediate reduction.
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Birding/Twitching and Global warming (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Johann Sebastian Bach
- Start date
Of course, you can always remove yourself from the planet for an immediate reduction.
jurek
Well-known member
You really believe that people in Indonesia say: those in London don't go twitching so lets stop polluting?
You really think that it is better to give them good example instead of money for recycling?
Steve Babbs
Well-known member
People with no children only have a right to gloat if they chose that option despite wanting children.
But yes encouraging people to have fewer children is important and should not be a taboo subject. Contraception should be widely and freely available and encouraged by all governments and religions.
I would add to the discussion the ownership of pets which consume large amounts of meat.
But I think the original questions was 'have people changed their birding habits?'.
But yes encouraging people to have fewer children is important and should not be a taboo subject. Contraception should be widely and freely available and encouraged by all governments and religions.
I would add to the discussion the ownership of pets which consume large amounts of meat.
But I think the original questions was 'have people changed their birding habits?'.
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We could add a multitude of things each of us does or doesn't do, from flying, having children, driving, owning a small/big house, turning up or down the heating, eating meat, planting trees, etc etc.
The reality is it is impossible to compare our contributions, so claiming sainthood on the grounds that you don't fly or only have one child, etc, is meaningless. Only by carrying out a full audit of our total behaviour could we have even the slightest idea or who is contributing more or less.
I take 30 or more individual flights per year, is my contribution to global warming more than any of the other posters here? Possibly yes, probably no. Do I think about my impact on the environment? Yes. Am I seeking to reduce my flying? Nope, four more flights before the year's end.
The reality is it is impossible to compare our contributions, so claiming sainthood on the grounds that you don't fly or only have one child, etc, is meaningless. Only by carrying out a full audit of our total behaviour could we have even the slightest idea or who is contributing more or less.
I take 30 or more individual flights per year, is my contribution to global warming more than any of the other posters here? Possibly yes, probably no. Do I think about my impact on the environment? Yes. Am I seeking to reduce my flying? Nope, four more flights before the year's end.
World population is booming, but it's third world population. Populations in first world nations are declining. So in effect, the world is becoming less technologically developed, i.e. dumber in regards to finding and adopting solutions.
wolfbirder
Well-known member
Well I'm a right ****.
Bird by myself, drive by myself, turn up for other people's twitches, try to avoid as much discomfort as possible (i.e walking long distances), go on holidays abroad hopping on EasyJet / Ryan Air (including to Israel too). Also eat meat.
Have I got any morals? I did consider myself a decent human being, but I can see I should reappraise that
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Bird by myself, drive by myself, turn up for other people's twitches, try to avoid as much discomfort as possible (i.e walking long distances), go on holidays abroad hopping on EasyJet / Ryan Air (including to Israel too). Also eat meat.
Have I got any morals? I did consider myself a decent human being, but I can see I should reappraise that
-.
wolfbirder
Well-known member
Shouldn't that be a ******* ?
Very likely Jos.
You could insert a multitude of applicable words........take your pick:t:
Interesting conversation though. I've never had mates who bird-watch, and I'm not hard-core enough twitcher to be part of a regular group.
I don't consider myself anti-social, I love to bird with people on site & chat to as many as possible etc, but I like to be in control of what I do when I'm out birding............where I go, what sort of birding I do, depending on a variety of things, how I feel, how I've slept etc. These are often last minute decisions, and I like it that way. I can't walk long distances these days.
Its my hobby, I love it, its something I can indulge in without (I thought) being judged or adversely affecting anyone else. But I'm probably in the worse category of bird-watcher based on how most birders seemingly assess their fellow adversaries.
But I don't lose any sleep over that. I'll continue to do my thing.
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Farnboro John
Well-known member
I agree with Wolfie.
I would also comment that I like a full car as well as the next birder does - birding with a group of friends is a lot of fun. However, circumstances vary for everybody and particularly on instantaneous twitches (e.g. Yellow Warbler Portland Bill) a ring round reveals nobody else can get away, so its of necessity a solo trip.
Also, some kinds of birding just don't lend themselves to group activity, e.g. a long stakeout for a picture of a difficult species with a low probability of success.
Horses for courses.
I certainly don't do as many long trips as I used to, fuel is too expensive. Back in the day my crew probably went from Farnborough to Norfolk for the day almost monthly, but I can't remember the last time I was up there. But I'm still in the field most days, most weekends, and in summer, often after work as well.
John
I would also comment that I like a full car as well as the next birder does - birding with a group of friends is a lot of fun. However, circumstances vary for everybody and particularly on instantaneous twitches (e.g. Yellow Warbler Portland Bill) a ring round reveals nobody else can get away, so its of necessity a solo trip.
Also, some kinds of birding just don't lend themselves to group activity, e.g. a long stakeout for a picture of a difficult species with a low probability of success.
Horses for courses.
I certainly don't do as many long trips as I used to, fuel is too expensive. Back in the day my crew probably went from Farnborough to Norfolk for the day almost monthly, but I can't remember the last time I was up there. But I'm still in the field most days, most weekends, and in summer, often after work as well.
John
mjh73
Well-known member
Looking on the Loco2 website it appears London - Cadiz is more like 200-250pounds each way. There might be cheaper tickets with a bit more effort.
The website does highlight that "262.54 kg Estimated CO2 saving from taking the train versus flying" for that specific trip.
This is a good resource (train focused) for people looking at long distance travel around the world without flying: https://www.seat61.com/index.html
I got the sleeper train from Da Nang to Hanoi in Vietnam earlier this year (more for the experience than to avoid flying to be honest) and our local guide thought I was slightly mad (it took about 12 hours, about 10x longer than the flight and was only marginally cheaper!)
I've looked into longer distance travel by train in Europe, but as prices are still quite much higher than flying, let alone the traveling time of course, it's not unexpected people will keep taking planes. Once the race to the bottom of flying prices slows down/ends because of carbon emission taxes, then more people will take the shift, myself included. I do like long train journeys but when time and money are slim, what do you do? Yep, fly.
I think in the future we'll see a contraction of our "big open world". Same as production in China, and transport to here, becomes more expensive than producing locally. The same way flying all over the world will become more expensive and people will stay more local. There transport will go faster: bullet trains, e-bikes, electric automated cars maybe even in vacuum tubes. So national and continental travel will get faster and easier but intercontinental travel will be expensive and more time-consuming so less people will do that. Until a new generation of planes, zero emission electric powered, comes along and becomes more and more affordable. Just another ebb and flow.
I think in the future we'll see a contraction of our "big open world". Same as production in China, and transport to here, becomes more expensive than producing locally. The same way flying all over the world will become more expensive and people will stay more local. There transport will go faster: bullet trains, e-bikes, electric automated cars maybe even in vacuum tubes. So national and continental travel will get faster and easier but intercontinental travel will be expensive and more time-consuming so less people will do that. Until a new generation of planes, zero emission electric powered, comes along and becomes more and more affordable. Just another ebb and flow.
Paul Chapman
Well-known member
I have decided never to own a private jet and I believe that I can claim credit for that because I have previously wanted one.....
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/50061569
All the best
rollingthunder
Well-known member
Wolfie, you missed one important thing.....are you a Wolves supporter? If so you are indeed a.....
Laurie:t:
Laurie:t:
wolfbirder
Well-known member
Wolfie, you missed one important thing.....are you a Wolves supporter? If so you are indeed a.....
Laurie:t:
Hi Laurie
As the song goes.....”I’d rather be a dingle than a ****”
Only joking of course my fellow Black Country mon!
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Andy Adcock
Worst person on Birdforum
I no longer twitch and I feel no guilt whatsoever, about my annual or often biannual, birding trips.
Maybe we should cancel Birdfair as it encourages people to travel long distances to the event?
Maybe we should cancel Birdfair as it encourages people to travel long distances to the event?
Trystan
Well-known member
Here's how I justify enjoying my life;
Use public transport to work
Car share for birding
Reduced meat eating, been full vegetarian since February
Try to buy ethical products from ethical companies
And most importantly, have no kids
The way I see it, we can live like paupers and keep breeding, or manage the population and have enriched lives.
Or most likely, continue as we are and destroy the planet
Use public transport to work
Car share for birding
Reduced meat eating, been full vegetarian since February
Try to buy ethical products from ethical companies
And most importantly, have no kids
The way I see it, we can live like paupers and keep breeding, or manage the population and have enriched lives.
Or most likely, continue as we are and destroy the planet
wolfbirder
Well-known member
Andy Adcock
Worst person on Birdforum
I make no apologies for having two, wonderful children.
Would the people on here who suggest limiting family size, feel comfortable in promoting the sterilisation of poor families in the so called 'third World' who habitually knock ot 4-8 kids that they can't afford, .....thought not.
Poor countries, with massive populations, fuel the rise in pollution through garbage in the ocean to the burning of fossil fuels. My occasional flight and two children, don't make a ripple in this ocean of excess.
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Here is a map showing CO2 emissions per capita: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/co-emissions-per-capita
Perhaps you might want to revise your conclusions?
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