Advice for buying a bridge camera (1 Viewer)

Saxatilis · Dec 20, 2015

Dear forumers

I'm considering buying a bridge camera that would use 95% just to photograph raptors in flight (to document rarities, age classes, anomalous plumages, moult conditions etc ...) during the monitoring sessions of migrating raptors through my region - along with binoculars and spottingscope.

The offer is very wide and a bit confusing to me; I was looking at the Nikon P610.

Have you any advice for me considering the use that I am doing?

Thank you

Stonefaction · Dec 20, 2015

For birds in flight I'd choose an SLR before a bridge camera every time. The shutter lag on the bridge cameras I have used has made catching birds in flight rather difficult. Also the more distant/higher the bird, the less 'good' detail captured. However, having said that I use the Nikon P900 from time to time and the video mode could be a slightly better option for capturing birds in flight than the photo mode.

MTem · Dec 20, 2015

Agree with ^^^^

I have both a bridge (Canon SX60) and a DSLR (Canon 70D). Never taken a decent flight photo with the bridge, many with the DSLR, although I have seen some good in flight photos with a bridge. The shutter lag might be less of a problem with soaring (slow-moving) BOP, but for e.g. hunting falcons I think you'll struggle.

Mick

ClarkWGriswold · Dec 20, 2015

Agree with what's been said. The Panasonic FZ1000 could possibly be an exception though?

Rich

Saxatilis · Dec 20, 2015

Agreed, but I have to deal with the rest of my equipment.
In my backpack I manage to accomodate the Nikon ED82A, both the 7x42 and 15x56 binoculars and start having limitations of weight and volume. I also carry the two tripods (for the telescope and the bigger binoculars) in their bags, one by the shoulder.
I have a Pentax digital SLR with a SMC-A 400 f./5.6, but after increasing my observation equipment, that is from 2011, I stopped to take that.
Everything can not be put in a backpack. This is why I start looking around for a smaller and lighter bridge camera.
The Nikon P900 is an option I considered, perhaps it would be optimal but is a bit pricey to me: the video option you suggest is very interesting indeed, thank you

Stonefaction · Dec 20, 2015

I can certainly sympathise with having to carry too much already. I bought the P900 for that very reason but the reality is that I rarely take it out alone (mostly because I do photograph smaller birds in flight for ID confirmation from time to time) and if it does go with me it is in addition to everything else I'm carrying already, which negates my reason for buying it, though I do use it as a sort of auxiliary scope and video camera.

Could your SLR be used as a substitute for one of the binoculars?

Saxatilis · Dec 20, 2015

Stonefaction said:
I can certainly sympathise with having to carry too much already. I bought the P900 for that very reason but the reality is that I rarely take it out alone (mostly because I do photograph smaller birds in flight for ID confirmation from time to time) and if it does go with me it is in addition to everything else I'm carrying already, which negates my reason for buying it, though I do use it as a sort of auxiliary scope and video camera.

Could your SLR be used as a substitute for one of the binoculars?

Stonefaction
I agree with your thinking, but I can not give up one of the binoculars with ease: not the primary (the Zeiss Victory 7x42) nor the ancillary (Vortex Kaibab 15x56 HD) one which is very useful for scanning horizons and finding hawks in long-distance observations.
How fast is the response of your P900 when photographing small birds in flight? This is of interest to me

Stonefaction · Dec 20, 2015

I don't even attempt bird in flight shots with it now as the few I have managed successfully have been gulls hanging in strong headwinds (so almost stationary).

Stonefaction · Dec 20, 2015

https://youtu.be/CsJtsbVWPr8

This video clip of a Sparrowhawk may be more relevant to you (best watched at 0.25 speed and 1080 HD quality - change using cog wheel icon).

https://youtu.be/OUErBySn2yY

Quite a distant Osprey hunting (best watched at same settings as Sparrowhawk clip).

https://youtu.be/Hbn-doRKz_s

Buzzards soaring (same settings).

All taken with the P900. It is possible to save a frame from the video as a photograph (using the built-in camera software), but the quality is not as good as with an 'actual' photograph.

njlarsen · Dec 20, 2015

I would encourage you to look at the panasonic line as well. They take 4k video from which you can save each frame as an 8mpix photo.

Niels

Biancone · Dec 20, 2015

Saxatilis said:
I'm considering buying a bridge camera that would use 95% just to photograph raptors in flight (to document rarities, age classes, anomalous plumages, moult conditions etc ...) during the monitoring sessions of migrating raptors through my region - along with binoculars and spottingscope.

I have tried to use a bridge camera (Panasonic FZ45, then FZ200) for the same purpose you have in mind. In my limited experience I have been able to get 'adequate' images only under limited conditions: bird quite close, not moving fast, lit from beneath or the side in good sunlight, and against the sky rather than the ground or vegetation. So you might get OK results with soaring buzzards, Honey-buzzards, Short-toed Eagles, etc, when migrating overhead, but it would be almost impossible to get focus on these against grassland or trees, and also very difficult to capture sharp images of fast-moving birds.
So autofocus is one constraint, and image quality is another. I think it might be unrealistic to hope to get enough sharpness and resolution from a bridge camera for you to be able consistently to analyse feather generations for age determination.
Guess I'm just suggesting that you might be happier with relatively low expectations if you try the bridge camera option!! Perhaps some others, probably more skilled than me, will give you a more positive view?
I am now trying to work with a m4/3 camera (Olympus e-m10, 75-300 II). This has given me a definite step up in image quality but this particular setup has similar autofocus limitations as the bridge cameras I've tried.
Good luck!
Brian

ikw101 · Dec 22, 2015

I think you're doing very well to carry 2 pairs of binoculars, a large scope and until recently an SLR.

I don't think you'll find a bridge camera that will be good enough to record the details you require - age classes, anomalous plumages, moult conditions etc. You might get luck occasionally but to achieve consistent results you need a SLR.

Personally I'd trade in both pairs of binoculars for a 12x42 or similar. Maybe even worth thinking about selling the scope and buying a smaller one eg an older Leica 62mm APO complete with 26/32 wide angle lens.

If carrying the camera is a real struggle try a different camera strap eg Optech sling strap. Makes a massive difference.

Saxatilis · Dec 22, 2015

ikw101 said:
I think you're doing very well to carry 2 pairs of binoculars, a large scope and until recently an SLR.

I don't think you'll find a bridge camera that will be good enough to record the details you require - age classes, anomalous plumages, moult conditions etc. You might get luck occasionally but to achieve consistent results you need a SLR.

Personally I'd trade in both pairs of binoculars for a 12x42 or similar. Maybe even worth thinking about selling the scope and buying a smaller one eg an older Leica 62mm APO complete with 26/32 wide angle lens.

If carrying the camera is a real struggle try a different camera strap eg Optech sling strap. Makes a massive difference.

Thank you all for your posts. In some respects my ideas are now a bit more confused than before, but this is not a bad thing.

Ikw101, I can not absolutely give up my current set-up (from 2004 I spend 36 days each year along three monitoring sessions of migrating raptors): I spent years realizing the needs and then putting together my optical equipment for this.
The 7x42 is indispensable for its widest FOV, less eye strain due to lower mag (I am spectacle wearer), etc. The spottingscope is simply a must in hawkwatching and the 15x bins fill well the gap between the former and the latter... so the camera is, in my case, a "plus", it's not a priority.
Of course it can be extremely useful in certain situations....indispensable, I know.

These days I got to know a friend that has a Coolpix P530...first, I ask him to lend it to handle and experiment a bridge.
I have an old Tamron SP500 reflex supertelephoto lens that I might couple to the Pentax DSLR...perhaps this would allow me to reduce weight and bulk compared to the 400 f/5.6. I will try...

dalat · Dec 23, 2015

I think you need a bigger backpack...

njlarsen · Dec 23, 2015

If I read the information you provide correctly, you have a camera + lens just about 2 kg total. The Nikon p900 would be just about half of that, so not a huge difference in total weight.

What ocular do you use on the scope? A modern zoom ocular should go low enough that you can do away with the 15x binoculars, which would also do away with one of the tripods, which would be a much bigger saving in weight.

Niels

Saxatilis · Dec 23, 2015

njlarsen said:
If I read the information you provide correctly, you have a camera + lens just about 2 kg total. The Nikon p900 would be just about half of that, so not a huge difference in total weight.

What ocular do you use on the scope? A modern zoom ocular should go low enough that you can do away with the 15x binoculars, which would also do away with one of the tripods, which would be a much bigger saving in weight.

Niels

Niels

With the Nikon Fieldscope I do not use a zoom (nor have one), only fixed wideangle eyepieces: 30x or 38x: these are best suited to follow subjects that are moving in the sky .

I intend to try the solutions in post #13 before any purchase.

Saxatilis · Jan 3, 2016

Hello all and Happy 2016

last weeks I have read much on the net and am going with one of these bridge, new or used (I can not and do not want to spend too much anyway): Panasonic Lumix DMC FZ72, Canon SX50HS, Sony DSC HX400V that appear to be particularly well suited (according to many opinions...) to general birding and hopefully also to my special purposes.
Tomorrow I will be able to try an used Canon SX50: the Coolpix P530 of a friend of mine I tried seemed to me to be a bit too slow

Best wishes and regards

Vespobuteo · Jan 4, 2016

I have been considering a bridge camera for a while,
50x zoom or more seems very impressive,
but I really wonder what the effective resolution is,
images seem very noisy to me, even at low ISO.

Will a bridge cam be more useful than annoying
(when the light is low) trying to document some flying birds or a
bird hiding in the bushes?

etudiant · Jan 5, 2016

Vespobuteo said:
I have been considering a bridge camera for a while,
50x zoom or more seems very impressive,
but I really wonder what the effective resolution is,
images seem very noisy to me, even at low ISO.

Will a bridge cam be more useful than annoying
(when the light is low) trying to document some flying birds or a
bird hiding in the bushes?

Your post summarizes the weakest aspects of current bridge cameras. The resolution at full zoom is indeed closer to 2 megapixels than to 20,
noise is always around and low light performance, especially focusing, leaves much to be desired.
Against that, they offer extraordinary reach in a compact and inexpensive package. Evidently they are aimed at birders who take photographs, rather than at photographers who go birding.

HermitIbis · Jan 6, 2016

Saxatilis said:
Tomorrow I will be able to try an used Canon SX50 [...]

May I ask whether you were satisfied with the results?

I've just posted about my experiences with the SX50 for birds in flight in the other (SX50) thread. Obviously, for small birds, you'll always need some luck. For other birds, including raptors, I am getting decent results - sufficient for identification. It took some practice though, and I still failed miserably when I tried to get a BIF of an Eurasian hobby. With Black terns I had a little more luck.

Advice for buying a bridge camera (1 Viewer)

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