night vision devices (1 Viewer)

Hello,
i am thinking of trying a night vision device for wildlife watch. I don't have experience with these devices, neither about their characteristics, besides some basic things.
I wonder if people from the forum have such things, and if i could be adviced on which one should i get.
I don't want to spent a lot of money (preferably not more than 500euros), so i have to search on 1st generation i suppose.
From the many brands and models out there, which one you think is better for me?
I found some which i could buy, does anybody have an experience with? These are:
1) Night Owl NONM3X-G 3 x 42
2)ATN Night Storm 3,5 x 50
3)Bushnell Equinox 4 x 40

I prefer a monocular than a binocular, a reason is for the lower price.
Thanks in advance,
George

Basic night vision devices often disappoint their user because they only offer crude images with very little detail. So unless you expect to watch larger animals, they may not serve your purpose.
But as long as your expectations are modest, the Night Owl gets the nod, based on reviews posted at Amazon, the US retail site
http://www.amazon.com/Night-Owl-Lig...1351638841&sr=1-1&keywords=Night+Owl+NONM3X-G

etudiant said:

Basic night vision devices often disappoint their user because they only offer crude images with very little detail. So unless you expect to watch larger animals, they may not serve your purpose.
But as long as your expectations are modest, the Night Owl gets the nod, based on reviews posted at Amazon, the US retail site
http://www.amazon.com/Night-Owl-Lig...1351638841&sr=1-1&keywords=Night+Owl+NONM3X-G

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Thanks 'etudiant',
well, i don't think i will use it for small animals, as it will be difficult to see them probably, but at least for mammals with size of a hare and larger it will be (hopefully) ok, and for larger animals. At least for close range.
I will check some reviews in Amazon my self,
George

george-spiridakis said:

Thanks 'etudiant',
well, i don't think i will use it for small animals, as it will be difficult to see them probably, but at least for mammals with size of a hare and larger it will be (hopefully) ok, and for larger animals. At least for close range.
I will check some reviews in Amazon my self,
George

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The issue with these devices is that the actual image is very dim unless the scene is illuminated with an IR light. They lack the power to illuminate more than a short distance, enough to show that they work but not enough to be useful. The experience can be simulated by going out at night with a weak flashlight, one sees, but not far and not well.
Military surplus illuminators from German and Soviet Army stocks used to be readily available for very little money on Ebay. Provided the associated power supply and batteries are also purchased and provided that they still work, one can get a good, albeit heavy (15+kg) portable infra red source that will allow these goggles to perform at their best.

There are several different types of night vision devices and qualities.
I have not tried many, but a generation 1+ device was a bit disappointing.
Although of quite high quality, the field is narrow and there is severe edge distortion.
Also the edge performance is poor.
The only good view I had was of an amazing blizzard.

Another device is a low light level CCD or CMOS detector device, such as made by Meade a few years ago.
Again, binoculars were better, although it was interesting.
They may be getting better as low light level security cameras become better and cheaper.

Another device is an integrating camera I think like a Mintron?
This integrated perhaps up to 128 frames over 2 seconds and gave quite a good view on an old 6inch portable T.V. or a T.V monitor.
But for a moving animal they may not be very useful.

A used generation 2+ device is a revelation. 165mm f/2 coated lens, acting like a 5x 82mm device.
The field is virtually distortion free and of good quality more or less to the edge.
It is a bit heavy and long and is best on a tripod but can be hand held.
For astronomy it performs as well as a 20 x 80 binocular as far as faint stars are concerned, but instead of a 3 or 3.5 degree field it has over 6 degrees field. So one sees many more stars than in a binocular.
However, the resolution is similar to a 5x binocular.
So M 42, The Orion nebula is bright but small.
Jupiter's moons are very bright but difficult to resolve.

One has to take care with all these devices not to use them in bright lights or into a car headlamp as the tubes can be destroyed. Daylight can destroy them. They usually have a tiny hole in a tight fitting cap for daytime testing. The Sun would destroy them, may be even if they have protective circuits.
So one has to check carefully and have a careful programme when using them.

In addition, the tubes have a limited lifetime depending on type, and degrade over time even without use.

The generation 2+ device is impressive.
The infra red beam has three settings. It is claimed up to 150 plus metre range, but the 2 AAs get quickly drained.
The gain control has an enormous range and even at maybe 30,000x the resolution is good.

The device was available for about 650 euros, but I think worth it. New they may be around 2,500 euros?

This is a vast subject. I am sure othere have much more experience with these devices.

For some countries there are restrictions on high end devices.

Hope that helps

Look at the Yukon Ranger series about 350-370 sterling depending where you purchase from. These are relatively new scopes coming on the market with the new optics can give Generation 2 performance and work in normal light conditions too.Without the steep price hike
http://www.nhbs.com/night_vision_scopes_eqcat_356.html
some very good info on this site. Regards Jack

Perhaps read reviews of the Ranger or wait for a user report.

Sometimes the advertising does not tell the whole story.
Some Yukon products are very good, some not so good.
They vary.

The review /field test was carried out by staff from Alana Ecology years of experience in practical field equipment for Naturalists so I would read their assessments/judgements carefully ----- they are not advertising the product as such merely listing it. The products they are selling you can trust. Not got shares in the company just know them by reputation and a satisfied customer.
Regards Jack.

Jack Daw said:

The review /field test was carried out by staff from Alana Ecology years of experience in practical field equipment for Naturalists so I would read their assessments/judgements carefully ----- they are not advertising the product as such merely listing it. The products they are selling you can trust. Not got shares in the company just know them by reputation and a satisfied customer.
Regards Jack.

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Jack,
sorry but i did not understand ecxactly what you wrote, which is the review you write about? Can i read those people review and where can i dind it?
George

etudiant said:

The issue with these devices is that the actual image is very dim unless the scene is illuminated with an IR light. They lack the power to illuminate more than a short distance, enough to show that they work but not enough to be useful. The experience can be simulated by going out at night with a weak flashlight, one sees, but not far and not well..

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I had a Russian Night vision scope. It suffered like you say, but worked quite well together with a maglite and a red or yellow filter to boost the light without disturbing the animal.
To be honest, I sold it after a while. We had one memorable moment in Africa when we saw a pretty much new born hippo through the scope which we wouldn't have seen without the scope.. then a couple of days later we nearly walked into a fully grown hippo despite scanning in front of us with the night vision scope. so a bit hit and miss I guess!!

peter.jones said:

I had a Russian Night vision scope. It suffered like you say, but worked quite well together with a maglite and a red or yellow filter to boost the light without disturbing the animal.

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That is a brilliant improvisation for an IR illuminator. Much more available than surplus miliutary gear.
It suggests that a big hand carried flood light, the kind built around a 6V battery, could be similarly filtered to give an even better source.

There is a warning with the Generation 2+ device NOT to shine the infra red light at anybody's eyes.
This is even though the power source is only 2 AAs.

With a powerful floodlight even if filtered to pass only infra red I would think there is even more reason not to shine the beam into someone's eyes.

The infra red light source run by the 2 AAs is visible as a dull red glow on all three settings, so it does pass some visible light but not much.

Of course another person with a night vision device or camcorder with night light detection will see your source as a very bright illuminator from a long way off.

I don't know if some animals see further into the infra red than humans.
Perhaps owls do?
Some do see further into the blue end of the spectrum.

Hi George,

I have used a number of night vision devices, ranging from fairly cheap Gen 1 monoculars right up to a Gen 2+ monocular and on the whole all have been reasonably decent.

I think some of the other answers so far are spot on and as long as most of what you are viewing is as least as large as a rabbit and not too far away in complete darkness, you will be fine.

In general NV binoculars tend to perform better than monoculars as you get two lenses to collect light, but tend to cost more. If possible, I would try and keep the magnification as low as possible with a cheaper device as the higher the magnification, the thicker the lenses need to be and therefor the less light they tend to transmit.

I actually have also just had 3 Night Owl Optics delivered to me (2 monoculars and a binocular) that I am currently reviewing - unfortunately none happen to be the one that you have listed on your shortlist, but I have been pretty impressed with them all so far - very good build quality and perform as good as any comparable brands that I have tried before.

Interestingly one of the Night Owl devices that I have just finished reviewing is their iGen 20/20 Digital NV Monocular - there are two models, one that takes photos and is a little above your budget and another that does not which is about around what you are looking at. Other than that they are pretty much the same. I found that it performed very well, better than all Gen1 monoculars that I have used and as good as the Gen 2+ . The real advantage of it is you can make adjustments to the frame rate depending on your situation and they don't have many of the issues that you get with standard NV that uses intensifier tubes, so may be well worth considering.

Another brand that I have quite a bit of experience with is Luna Optics that you may also consider as they make a couple of relatively inexpensive monoculars that I thought performed pretty well - take a look at the Luna Optics LN-SX3 or the SM50

I don't want to add all the links here - but if you take a look round my bino site, I have a whole section on NV with full reviews - also feel free to ask any more specific questions if you need to.

All the best

chirundu said:

Hi George,

I have used a number of night vision devices, ranging from fairly cheap Gen 1 monoculars right up to a Gen 2+ monocular and on the whole all have been reasonably decent.

I think some of the other answers so far are spot on and as long as most of what you are viewing is as least as large as a rabbit and not too far away in complete darkness, you will be fine.

In general NV binoculars tend to perform better than monoculars as you get two lenses to collect light, but tend to cost more. If possible, I would try and keep the magnification as low as possible with a cheaper device as the higher the magnification, the thicker the lenses need to be and therefor the less light they tend to transmit.

I actually have also just had 3 Night Owl Optics delivered to me (2 monoculars and a binocular) that I am currently reviewing - unfortunately none happen to be the one that you have listed on your shortlist, but I have been pretty impressed with them all so far - very good build quality and perform as good as any comparable brands that I have tried before.

Interestingly one of the Night Owl devices that I have just finished reviewing is their iGen 20/20 Digital NV Monocular - there are two models, one that takes photos and is a little above your budget and another that does not which is about around what you are looking at. Other than that they are pretty much the same. I found that it performed very well, better than all Gen1 monoculars that I have used and as good as the Gen 2+ . The real advantage of it is you can make adjustments to the frame rate depending on your situation and they don't have many of the issues that you get with standard NV that uses intensifier tubes, so may be well worth considering.

Another brand that I have quite a bit of experience with is Luna Optics that you may also consider as they make a couple of relatively inexpensive monoculars that I thought performed pretty well - take a look at the Luna Optics LN-SX3 or the SM50

I don't want to add all the links here - but if you take a look round my bino site, I have a whole section on NV with full reviews - also feel free to ask any more specific questions if you need to.

All the best

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Thanks a lot Jason for your opinion and advice!
I check about the igen and there are many great commetns about it.

After your comment, i am also trying to find night vision binoculars, cause as you stated they are 'normally' better because of their double tubes, and this seems very logic.
Can you tell me some good night vision binoculars?
I am looking at your site also.
Thanks again,
George

depends on what you want from a night vision, they are fine for seeing your way, but even x5 mags are limited for wildlife etc.

i have owned various gen 1 devices (not that good for anything away from your garden or away from full moon and infra red)

owned a yukon digital device, promised performance like gen 2 but at £400....not a patch on gen 2.

i have had a couple of gen 2 devices, a custom built UK sourced one, that was actually very good and around £2,000 new.

my last gen 2+ monocular was awesome, older and had the XX1441 tube, brilliant light gathering and exellent resolution....few samples here:

the gen 2 + is much better than a gen 1, you cant really compare them, plus you can use them in very low light and run them without infra red light....the slightest light from stars and distant light sources are enough to give you a clear sight picture.







with normal eye sight....



with scope and infra red turned off



again, before



after



few shots of garden etc







i used the head strap for various things, but driving about at night on country roads isnt something you should do really :-O

i have a gen 3 now....pics here

http://s21.photobucket.com/albums/b263/rsalt/Pvs 7 gen3/

What is the cost of a gen.3 New? and Used I am at the moment into owls and need something that could give me the views that you have. Eddy.

eddy the eagle said:

What is the cost of a gen.3 New? and Used I am at the moment into owls and need something that could give me the views that you have. Eddy.

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Check your local hunting websites and classifieds in your country.

Here in the uk they are around £1500+ second hand, new your looking at £3500+

I was just watching a barn owl hunting with mine and its an unreal experience.

Why not try the home brew option. Here is a link to a guy providing plans for a cascaded gen1 system. 2kg Pringles can size, but low gen3 quality! There are posts by this guy "cj7hawk" on several other forums at the moment. Cheaper than pretty much all commercial units too. Give it a go! I am about to. Being able to go walkies in the pitch black totally stealthily is cool ;-)

Another option is used by people who don't like rabbits and rats... Couple a powerful IR illuminator with a low light CCTV camera looking through a fast lens using a tiny little monitor, you can see clearly to huge distances. Again there are forums giving more information, the watec range of camera being preferred.

Cheers

PeterW