Review of 8x25 Victory Pocket (2 Viewers)

NDhunter said:

I have a question for users of the new Zeiss 8x25.

Without glasses, is there enough eye relief where you can place the eyecups up to your eyes
so they can be braced, as you can with larger binoculars?

That is my largest complaint with the pocket types, just too fiddly in use, to get a steady view.

Jerry

Click to expand...

OK, sounds like you know the answer to your own question before asking it, but here goes...

Everything I've read and my own experience indicate the eyecups are too short to place deeper into the eye sockets for non glass wearers. Some are devising ways to extend the eyecups, and some are bracing against the upper portion of the eye socket. The flip side is that this unit appears to be nothing short of a home run in its stock configuration for those that wear glasses (which is not me).

CG

cycleguy said:

OK, sounds like you know the answer to your own question before asking it, but here goes...

Everything I've read and my own experience indicate the eyecups are too short to place deeper into the eye sockets for non glass wearers. Some are devising ways to extend the eyecups, and some are bracing against the upper portion of the eye socket. The flip side is that this unit appears to be nothing short of a home run in its stock configuration for those that wear glasses (which is not me).

CG

Click to expand...

I've tried bracing them low against my brow ridge under my eye brows with some success but I don't use them very often except when I want one to carry with me for casual use like ball games or concerts or when traveling.

What is really frustrating for me is trying to get the diopter setting right.

Bob

NDhunter said:

I have a question for users of the new Zeiss 8x25.

Without glasses, is there enough eye relief where you can place the eyecups up to your eyes
so they can be braced, as you can with larger binoculars?

That is my largest complaint with the pocket types, just too fiddly in use, to get a steady view.

Jerry

Click to expand...

Jerry,

I believe your eye relief question may depend on the shape of your face and eye sockets. Part of the issue with bracing this binocular is that the eye cups are quite narrow.

I have deep eye sockets, and a high nose ridge. Most binocular eyepieces do not get very deep into my eye sockets, either because the eyepieces are too large or because the frame, focuser, or my hands hit my nose ridge. So normally I need eye relief even without glasses (or maybe it is really nose relief). For instance, I could never use the wonderful Fujinon 16x70 FMT-SX for astronomy because there was no way for me to get the full field of view even with no glasses and the eyecups rolled all the way down.

The narrow Zeiss 8x25 Victory eyepieces go deeper into my eye sockets than is usually the case. I use it with the eyecups all the way out (there are really only two setting) and that works well for me. I no longer think about how I bring them up to my eye or how I place them. However, if I press them as close to my eyes as I can get them, even with the eyecups out, I can lose bits of the field to black out depending on just how I point the binocular. OTH, this is not a natural or comfortable way for me to view.

All of this is part of a personal equation, and if you've had trouble with too much eye relief before I imagine it could be a problem. However, for me this binocular is anything but fiddly in terms of eye placement and that may be part of what AP has called its secret sauce. If you want to talk fiddly, I agree with Bob about the diopter adjustment.

Alan

cycleguy said:

OK, sounds like you know the answer to your own question before asking it, but here goes...

Everything I've read and my own experience indicate the eyecups are too short to place deeper into the eye sockets for non glass wearers. Some are devising ways to extend the eyecups, and some are bracing against the upper portion of the eye socket. The flip side is that this unit appears to be nothing short of a home run in its stock configuration for those that wear glasses (which is not me).

CG

Click to expand...

Thanks, that is what I have been thinking, the small diameter eyecups will
be similar to other pockets, and the ease of use would not be ideal.

It does not seem it would be as comfortable to use as a more full size
compact binocular.

I think this is a matter of physics..

Jerry

NDhunter said:

Thanks, that is what I have been thinking, the small diameter eyecups will
be similar to other pockets, and the ease of use would not be ideal.

It does not seem it would be as comfortable to use as a more full size
compact binocular.

I think this is a matter of physics..

Jerry

Click to expand...

I think it is another case of personal preference. I know some appreciate the smaller size of the 8x25 and it is a better fit for what they are looking for, and others appreciate the larger size and weight and larger focus wheel and larger diameter eyecups of the 8x30. I don't think many are going to be indifferent about it. As for me, I prefer the 8x30 format as well...

I think what I like most about this is the bin companies have provided us with two fine choices (not more 8x20 and 8x32)... and of course, now we get to bicker over them, YAY!B

Anyone else having the same thoughts I am having... would a high quality 8x28 make more sense than a high quality 8x30??????

CG

ceasar said:

I've tried bracing them low against my brow ridge under my eye brows with some success but I don't use them very often except when I want one to carry with me for casual use like ball games or concerts or when traveling.

What is really frustrating for me is trying to get the diopter setting right.

Bob

Click to expand...

Ditto... and the diopter setting on the 8x30CL isn't much easier and just about as frustrating!

CG

Unfair Comparison

This morning at home viewing out to sea under fairly bright morning light... Weighing in at 10 oz the 8x25 Zeiss Victory, and weighing in at 33 oz, the local heavyweight champion, Maven 9x45.

It seems like Bambi vs. Godzilla, though in sufficiently bright light the larger aperture shouldn't be much of an advantage. Yet the fact is, all of my other 30-32mm binoculars, including the Maven 8x30 do not show the same quality of view as the Maven 9x45. As I've said before, I don't know if it is aperture, a different prism design, or coatings, but the 9x45 has always presented the best daytime view of any binocular I own. It presents crystal clarity and what I perceive as outstanding color dynamic range--whiter whites and better distinction of color shading.

For this reason I was hesitant to compare the little Zeiss 8x25 with my favorite daytime binocular. I was rather shocked that the Zeiss kept pace with the larger binocular under bright lighting conditions. This is consistent with my experience yesterday in the field. Of course under more dimly lit conditions the larger binocular takes the lead, gradually at first, and as twilight fades to dusk it is no contest. However, given the light, the Zeiss Victory 8x25 is as good or better than the Maven at 1/3 the weight and 1/4 the bulk.

The larger Maven is easier to hold steady even with the very modest increase in power to 9x, and it has essentially the same actual field of view at 9x that the Zeiss has at 8x. The control of stray light and internal reflection is excellent in both. The Zeiss has a little better CA control. The Zeiss is a little quicker to get on target, but the Maven has a little better ergonomics--more comfortable eye placement with the larger exit pupil and larger eyepieces. The larger metal focus wheel and focus wheel placement are better on the Maven. The focus mechanism and general mechanical feel of the Maven is somewhat better as well, though both have quick precise focus.

For me, the Zeiss is becoming the little binocular that could. I was quite skeptical when I read AP's review, but this binocular gives as fine a view as any I have used. I still need to get a clear night to do limiting stellar magnitudes, but during the day the view is superior to any 8x30 or 8x32 I have, and my 9x45 only bests it as illumination grows dim.

Alan

Zeiss Victory 8x25 at Night

Last night I finally had a chance to play with my Zeiss Victory 8x25 under clear skies at a dark sky site. I was comparing it to a Cabela's Pro Guide 8x32. Just running the numbers, a 32mm aperture should have a little more than .5 magnitude advantage over a 25mm aperture. I tested with both direct and averted vision, and I could not find a significant difference on axis. I checked my star charts before and after so I knew I would be using star fields with enough variation that I should have been able to see a half magnitude difference. The Zeiss had better edge performance (could more easily detect faint stars at the edge of field). Also the Zeiss had nice tight star images across most of the field of view, though there is some field curvature toward the edges.

Subjectively, at times I thought it was easier to see some faint stars with direct vision using the 32mm binocular, but I simply could not create the conditions where I saw a star with direct vision in the 32 that I could not see in the 25. Maybe it's just my prejudice that the bigger objective should prevail. It is certainly possible that a higher quality 8x32 would have shown me more.

From previous experiments I know that the Maven B3 and Pro Guide are pretty much identical for on-axis limiting magnitude even though the Maven is 30mm vs. 32mm. Frankly, I wasn't convinced I should have been able to tell the difference due to such a small aperture difference even if the two binoculars were otherwise identical. The Maven had better edge performance than the Pro Guide as well.

So I would say that my night viewing experience is consistent with daytime impression of the Zeiss 8x25. It keeps up with or betters my 32mm binoculars under almost all conditions, but is superior in handling glare and tough backlit situations. The Zeiss is my only small binocular that matches the Maven B2 9x45 in image quality given bright enough conditions.

None of these small binoculars is a night glass, but even the little 8x25 can provide some nice views at night in a pinch. Earlier this year I was visiting the Hawaiian Islands, and had a chance to view some Southern objects that never make it above the horizon here. I had only brought my 8x30 binoculars, but I was very pleased with the view and glad to have them.

Alan

I said I was going to stick with the 8x25 for a week or so and it has now been two weeks using only this little binocular when out walking or birding. It is time for a wrap up evaluation.

This is certainly the best small binocular I own, and in many respects simply the best binocular that I have for daytime use. Of course, no binocular is perfect, and I do enjoy using different binoculars for different applications. I like higher power and larger aperture IS for nighttime viewing. I like a larger aperture and larger exit pupil to cover a wider range of illumination. And frankly, I like a less costly binocular in some circumstance, e.g., always present in my car--my emergency birding kit. But overall, the view through the Zeiss Victory 8x25 is so crisp, clear, and easy, that I have only very rarely thought about my full sized 9x45 Maven B2 over the past two weeks.

If I had to pick a single standout feature of this compact binocular, it would be crystal clarity in brightly back-lit or glare prone conditions. This seems to be a particular challenge for binoculars in the 20mm-32mm range. This was the main reason that I had preferred the 9x45 full size binocular for birding outings over any of my smaller binoculars. Yet the Zeiss 8x25 handles the tough lighting situations just as well as the larger binocular. It also has equally crisp detail and is just as good at color dynamic range. This is my first small binocular "Wow" view under daylight conditions, and it is not simply, "Wow this is good for such a small aperture." The larger binocular does have advantages of greater light grasp and I prefer the mechanics and feel in hand of the Maven 9x45. When it is more overcast or for reach into darker areas under a forest canopy or along a shaded bank, the full sized binocular will show more detail. Also, the 9x45 has a little more magnification, but just as much field of view and it is not hard for me to hold steady. Yet the Zeiss Victory 8x25 is very light and compact and provides just as nice a view under the vast majority of conditions.

As far as pros and cons, much of this has been pointed out earlier but here's my take.
Pro:

• Compact, lightweight
• Excellent clarity, no glare or stray light
• Outstanding in hand, offset hinge provides wide IPD range and makes IPD quick and easy to set
• Easy to point, easy to look through, quick to get on target
• Quick precise focus, excellent snap to focus, good near focus
• Good though not great mechanics

Con:

• Inappropriate case, no rain guard or objective caps, strap is a bit much for size of binocular
• Strap lugs are tiny and oddly placed
• Eyecups have only two settings
• Oculars are narrow and placing them too deeply into eye sockets can cause blackouts
• Diopter difficult to set
• Good though not great mechanics

There is a saying among amateur astronomers that your best telescope is the one that you use the most. In the past the Maven 9x45 has been my most used binocular, but it will be interesting to see if that continues to be true in the future.

Alan

Not to compare apples/oranges though a demo B.2 9x45 is listed just shy of 1/3 more than a new VP 8x25.

Makes for a very tempting offer indeed. Especially since I'm more in the market for the VP size.

Regardless, a mite pricey by the gram.

ETA: Concerns I've noted amongst others: No rainguard/objective covers, tiny/misplaced strap lugs, skinny neck strap, too much ER & MIJ not traditional pocket sized/weight.

Howevah, sub 700 simoleons brings all(?) FL schott glass, plenty ER + FOV w/precious little CA, single/offset hinge, small/lightweight & MIJ.

I'm curious about the view as in Globe effect/RB Vs PC. If rolling ball were on one side w/pincushion showing its hand early, Conquest 8x30/10x40 or mid-70s Swarovski 10x40 Habicht , on the other where's the line?

One key to large FOV is short ER coupled w/RB. Not being flat to the edge, no deduction for that either, w/fairly large FOV, regardless of objective diameter, I tend to speculate more of RB/less of PC view overall.

ETA II: Where Ulysses Everett McGill, O Brother Where Art Thou (2000), was a Dapper Dan man likewise I'm a 10X guy. And at an additional 50 clams closes instead of sealing the deal for me. Perhaps furhter down the road.

I have been using my Swarovski 8,5x42 and Zeiss 8x42 quite intensively during the last 4 weeks observing beavers in the local marsh area were I live.
This week , I bought myself a Zeiss victory 8x25 and I am hugely impressed with this small bin!
Great FOV , incredible sharpness, good ergonomics , really the WOW factor.
Even at dusk , this bin doesn’t let you down!!

Hello,
I am aware that 42 vs 25 mm would not be fair to compare them ... but, is there any similarity between them?
best regards
Wachi

With cheaper pocket bins they can seem dark with limited eye relief, but the Zeiss victory pocket 8x25 I have seems bright enough even at dusk comparing to a 42 and this is because sharpness and contrast are so good. Eye placement seems easy and of course compactness (with a different case to that supplied by Zeiss) is great, so I think you don't need a 42 if you have this. But a binocular like this is inclined to give you the binocular bug (if you haven't already got it) and you'll want to experiment with a 42. To better the pocket Zeiss though you'll need a top quality much more expensive glass.

I don't think a Victory 8X25 can replace a premium 8X42 to my eyes. How is the build quality of the glass?

Andy W.

mpeace said:

With cheaper pocket bins they can seem dark with limited eye relief, but the Zeiss victory pocket 8x25 I have seems bright enough even at dusk comparing to a 42 and this is because sharpness and contrast are so good. Eye placement seems easy and of course compactness (with a different case to that supplied by Zeiss) is great, so I think you don't need a 42 if you have this. But a binocular like this is inclined to give you the binocular bug (if you haven't already got it) and you'll want to experiment with a 42. To better the pocket Zeiss though you'll need a top quality much more expensive glass.

Click to expand...

Comparing a 25mm to a 42mm isnt a fair comparison, the difference in objective sizes is huge! All things equal, the 42mm will let in 2.8x more light.

As you would expect, the pocket is darker at low light than a 42mm in the same price range. I compared it side by side to the conquest 8x42, and the conquest is much much brighter.

I would have to disagree that it replaces a 42mm. It’s really great whenever a 42mm would be too heavy, and in good light that brightness disadvantage goes away.

mpeace said:

With cheaper pocket bins they can seem dark with limited eye relief, but the Zeiss victory pocket 8x25 I have seems bright enough even at dusk comparing to a 42 and this is because sharpness and contrast are so good. Eye placement seems easy and of course compactness (with a different case to that supplied by Zeiss) is great, so I think you don't need a 42 if you have this.

Click to expand...

Eye placement is the key to what makes the 8x25 Victory Pocket so special, at least for those of us wearing glasses. Most compacts are extremely finicky, this one is as easy to use as a 8x42. That doesn't mean you will get quite the same sharpness as a 8x42 (because of diffraction) and obviously it will be significantly dimmer.

dries1 said:

I don't think a Victory 8X25 can replace a premium 8X42 to my eyes. How is the build quality of the glass?

Click to expand...

Opinions seem to vary on this. People have said the armor feels cheap, the focus knob is dinky... I thought it was well made, apart from unfortunate defects in my two samples (possibly rushing production for Xmas?). The focusing felt just right, good eyecups and hinge tension etc.

Thanks Tenex good to know.

Andy W.

Hi Andy
I am on North Uist in the Scottish Western Isles and my 8x25 Victory has come with me. It did great duty on the last 200 miles of our drive north-west, hanging around my neck as we drove and it weighed 'nothing'. Since then it has been doing 'window duty' overlooking a fjord and has seen an otter and youngster, harbour seals and Red-throated Divers. Personally there is nothing about it I would call cheap-feeling and although the eyecups only have two positions they move with a feeling of precision that the eyecups on my SFs don't have. Yes the focus wheel is small but thats pocket binos for you. Since these binos could end up being carried in shirt pockets you don't want bulky armour or focus/dioptre wheels that could snag on clothing or add unnecessary weight.

The diopter is a fiddle to adjust but it is doable and once set it has been reliable. When 'armchair' testing these back home I tried them without spectacles and found the eyecups sank too close into my eye sockets due to their small diameter. Another consequence of their pocket-size I thought. But I grabbed them to check out something swimming in the fjord a few days back and because I didn't have my spectacles on at the time I pulled the eyecups up and to my surprise I put them up to my eyes and braced them instinctively under my eyebrows and got a great view of a Harbour Seal without any difficulty or blackouts. I tried this a few more times and found it easy to do so folks who don't wear spectacles shouldn't dismiss these little beauties.

Its hard to find anything to criticise these binos for apart from those things that spring from it being a pocket, folding bino. Optically they are really nice performers and even Alexis has enthused about their optics.

Lee

I have been using my Zeiss victory 8x25 now for 1 week quite intensively and no negative aspect was found!
The focus is very smooth , the FOV is superb, no quality issues whatsoever
Even at dusk , the bin performs very well.
Eyeplacement is just superb , and my wife, who wears spectacles is very positive
I also have the impression that this small bin covers very well my astigmatism as well
Highly impressed!