Boycott Malta (1 Viewer)

Andy Adcock · Nov 12, 2019

Simon Wates said:
Yes they certainly welcome support. There are some really good folk on Malta doing what they can. I will probably be going to Malta at some point in the future not really because of birding but because my partner is a historian and is writing a book, which includes much about Malta's heritage.

To see what Maltese conservationists do, the Birdlife page has a lot worth reading. I believe that education, especially in schools is the key to the demise of the illegal and "semi-illegal" hunting/capturing problems:

https://birdlifemalta.org/us/

Perhaps a chapter on the bird slaughter would open a few eyes?

I personally would like to visist and see the places my Dad, who was stationed there with the Navy, told me about, but I won't.

Simon Wates · Nov 12, 2019

Its all very well to deprive Malta of tourists to force them to change. But I bet not even 1% of Malta's visitors are birders, surely then its more effective to work from afar with lobbying the UK/EU to make meaningful pressure and by raising awareness generally. On the other hand, I strongly feel that birders working on the ground in Malta is fundamental and is a force that albeit slowly, is producing a move in the right direction. There is hope.

Bottom line is that these unacceptable activities have to stop and that will take time. Very sad I know and I feel outrage every time I'm reminded about it.

Andy Adcock · Nov 12, 2019

Simon Wates said:
Its all very well to deprive Malta of tourists to force them to change. But I bet not even 1% of Malta's visitors are birders, surely then its more effective to work from afar with lobbying the UK/EU to make meaningful pressure and by raising awareness generally. On the other hand, I strongly feel that birders working on the ground in Malta is fundamental and is a force that albeit slowly, is producing a move in the right direction. There is hope.

Bottom line is that these unacceptable activities have to stop and that will take time. Very sad I know and I feel outrage every time I'm reminded about it.

Point 1, Then time to spread the message to a wider audience as already suggested by targeting the likes of Easyjet.

Point 2. Is change happening? If so, it's glacial.

Deb Burhinus · Nov 12, 2019

Nutcracker said:
The Maltese birders would much rather people visited Malta and joined in one of the anti-hunting observation patrols - I would if I could afford it.

I agree - and I would too if I could stomach it

It needs a two pronged approach - working with Birdlife on the ground and through the EU (except the UK is about to stick the latter prong ...)

Andy Adcock · Nov 12, 2019

Deb Burhinus said:
I agree - and I would too if I could stomach it

It needs a two pronged approach - working with Birdlife on the ground and through the EU (except the UK is about to stick the latter prong ...)

As you're so willing to keep telling us, what will you do with your flag after that?

Farnboro John · Nov 12, 2019

andyadcock said:
Perhaps a chapter on the bird slaughter would open a few eyes?

I personally would like to visit and see the places my Dad, who was stationed there with the Navy, told me about, but I won't.

My Dad passed through during his National Service with the RN, and I would be interested to see the WWII stuff, but I also won't. In fact I would like to see the Queen take back their George Cross.

John

Deb Burhinus · Nov 12, 2019

andyadcock;3918516[B said:
]As you're so willing to keep telling us[/B], what will you do with your flag after that?

I dont understand this comment Andy - what have I been so ‘willing to keep telling’ ?

I have the EU flag because I am half Eastern European.

not sure what this has to do with Malta other than once we are out of the EU, the UK will loose the influence it could currently use to put pressure on Malta through the EU.

kb57 · Nov 12, 2019

andyadcock said:
Comparing the UK to Malta is a nonsense and it's attitudes such as this, that allow the likes of Malta to continue the slaughter.

Keep banging the EU drum, the sound is growing fainter, they've never done anything meaningful to stop this these activities.

If you were referring to my post (and not Nutty's), my comparison with UK stated AFAIK things are much worse in Malta. But UK's ability to take the moral high ground is compromised by our own pitifully ineffective raptor protection laws.

It's clear you are anti-EU, great, lets get UK out and have more integration of remaining member states, and less derogation from EU laws.

Deb Burhinus said:
I dont understand this comment Andy - what have I been so ‘willing to keep telling’ ?

I have the EU flag because I am half Eastern European.

not sure what this has to do with Malta other than once we are out of the EU, the UK will loose the influence it could currently use to put pressure on Malta through the EU.

I have the EU flag because I'm an Irish and EU citizen, and am thankfully going to remain so in the future.

Good point about UK influence, although we'd first need a government that genuinely cared about bird conservation to even consider putting pressure on Malta.

Andy Adcock · Nov 12, 2019

Repeating theme, three pro EU members, seemingly happy to deflect from the situation in Malta just to have a dig at the UK.

Rotherbirder · Nov 13, 2019

Whilst the emphasis here seems to be on raptors in Malta, what about France - a country that should arguably 'know better'. Upwards of 30,000 Ortolans are slaughtered annually by barbaric means (fattened up and drowned in cognac) in order to perpetuate an elitist 'tradition'. Just because these birds are eaten rather than being killed purely for fun doesn't make it respectable!

RB

Andy Adcock · Nov 13, 2019

Rotherbirder said:
Whilst the emphasis here seems to be on raptors in Malta, what about France - a country that should arguably 'know better'. Upwards of 30,000 Ortolans are slaughtered annually by barbaric means (fattened up and drowned in cognac) in order to perpetuate an elitist 'tradition'. Just because these birds are eaten rather than being killed purely for fun doesn't make it respectable!

RB

Totally agree about Ortolans, it's just another EU failure on the grounds of 'culture', just like bullfighting. There is no will with the top echelons of the EU to stop any of it.

Shooting Turtle Doves in France where they make it that much easier by sitting in treetop platforms. Shooting in Cyprus is bad too, you can't walk without stepping on a shotgun cartridge in parts of the Troodos Mountains.

There is no will within the top echelons of the EU to stop any of it, it's just not a big ticket issue to them.

Jos Stratford · Nov 13, 2019

Since bashing the EU is your primary concern, I guess the many positive impacts the EU has on conservation and the environment are of no importance to you. Be it through raising standards and forcing legislation in new member states or the encouraging of the identification and protection of valuable localities or through taking member states to court to protect areas of importance, eg to stop the logging of protected forests in Poland, there have been many success stories with regard the EU.

So sure, there are many issues where the EU needs to go much further, and Malta is a clear example, but it is totally false to paint a picture of total failure in regard to the EU and conservation.

PS. Who are the 'top exchelons' that you refer to?

Andy Adcock · Nov 14, 2019

Jos Stratford said:
Since bashing the EU is your primary concern,

Nonsense, read the OP and the thread title, the EU was not mentioned until post 3 and not by me.

My subsequent comments were initiated by those seeking to find an opportunity to mention Brexit and criticise the UK's own laws which are not at all relevant to what's happening in Malta.

jurek · Nov 14, 2019

@Jos

No worries, he is just a simple troll.

BTW, number of birds shot in Russia is even bigger than in Malta. Lets propose another self-righteous boycott?

PYRTLE · Nov 14, 2019

jurek said:
@Jos

No worries, he is just a simple troll.

BTW, number of birds shot in Russia is even bigger than in Malta. Lets propose another self-righteous boycott?

A ridiculous comparison jurek if you compare the total land mass of Russia to Malta, on what basis or fact is your statement made please - population / shotguns or rifles owned per household or number of birds reported as killed. Such a sweeping comment and not supported.

Pat

Andy Adcock · Nov 14, 2019

jurek said:
@Jos

No worries, he is just a simple troll.

BTW, number of birds shot in Russia is even bigger than in Malta. Lets propose another self-righteous boycott?

Idiot, you seem to be the troll.

The difference in Russia is that 99% of things shot, will be eaten, it's not just for sick, pleasure.

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