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Nikon WX 10x50 IF

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Old Friday 17th August 2018, 20:41   #1
typo
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Nikon WX 10x50 IF

Had a chance to try the WX 10x50 at birdfair today. Quite extraordinary! Kicked the EDG 10x42 out of the park.

David
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Old Friday 17th August 2018, 21:51   #2
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Had a chance to use a WX 7X50 a few months ago and it was extraordinary as well. Essentially perfect images for all practical purposes. Just impractical to handhold for more than a minute or so for me at least.

I was actually somewhat surprised to see that the WX had noticeably better micro contrast on landscape details than my 8X42 Noctivid (which exceeds any other glass in micro contrast in the center of the FOV that I have had the chance to compare it to). And not surprising, unlike the Noctivid, the WX had a uniformly well corrected image over almost the entire FOV.

The WX is really an astounding binocular. To me it can only be justified to have if you can make use of a tripod mounted binocular (and if the cost were not an obstacle of course!).

Stephanie
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Old Friday 17th August 2018, 22:16   #3
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Stephanie,

Are you suggesting that 2.505kg/ 5.52lbs was a problem?

The Noctivid was 40 yards away today but I have no doubt it would make mincemeat of that too.

David
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Old Friday 17th August 2018, 23:01   #4
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It would be nice if Nikon spread some magic WX dust on a new alpha to replace the discontinued EDG. Any word from the Nikon reps on new birding binoculars?
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Old Friday 17th August 2018, 23:05   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by typo View Post
Stephanie,

Are you suggesting that 2.505kg/ 5.52lbs was a problem?

The Noctivid was 40 yards away today but I have no doubt it would make mincemeat of that too.

David
Absolutely not! The only problem between me and the 10X50WX is the $6.4K US user fee.

Steph
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Old Saturday 18th August 2018, 05:11   #6
typo
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Absolutely not! The only problem between me and the 10X50WX is the $6.4K US user fee.

Steph
Yes, that was hernia inducing, and even more painful in pounds

I heard nothing about an EDG replacement.

David

Last edited by typo : Saturday 18th August 2018 at 05:32.
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Old Saturday 18th August 2018, 06:58   #7
adhoc
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FWIW offering no comment on the pros and cons of AllBinos!

AllBinos assign their highest title 'Perfect' to the Nikon EDG 10x42, Swarovski EL 8.5x42 and 10x42 and Zeiss SF 10x42 (in alphabetical order). Next below is 'Outstanding'. Only this do they assign to the Nikon WX 10x50.

Among the 10x50 binoculars the Nikon WX is at the top in overall score with 87.24% but within 3 % points of the next 3 models: the Swaro. EL, Leica Ultravid HD, and Fujinon FMTR-SX.

It loses points notably in the 'Distortion' category, "Distance between the first curved line and the field centre compared to the field of view radius", which they find to be 38%4%, and hence scored at 4/10; and in Transmission, found to be 85%, hence scored at 11/15. The Swaro. is scored at 10/10 in 'Distortion', the relevant distance being 95%3%; and the Fuji. 14/15 in Transmission, at 95%. (Each of these points converts to ~0.6 in % points as the maximum total is 170. Thus in these 2 categories relative to these 2 models respectively the Nikon loses a total of 5.3 % points.) It also loses points, relative to them, for 'Whiteness of the image': "Slight greenish-yellow hue. Noticeably slanted transmission graph"; in the summary under Cons', "too low transmission in the blue part of the spectrum".

Last edited by adhoc : Saturday 18th August 2018 at 07:50.
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Old Saturday 18th August 2018, 15:25   #8
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Allbinos has a preference for tangent condition distortion mapping in binoculars and demerits binoculars that are designed for angle condition distortion mapping. This is their prerogative.

Not to restart any debates over distortion in binoculars but to recap the difference:

Tangent condition = straight lines stay straight across the FOV, magnification changes across the FOV causing image distortion when panning known as rolling ball (RB).
Angle condition = lines through the center of the FOV are straight but curve when off center in a manner called pincushion distortion. Magnification across the FOV is constant and panning is more natural.

Many uses like myself prefer angle mapping or a balanced design approach tending toward angle condition. Other users prefer tangent mapping. Many other users are not particularly sensitive to one approach or the other. The perceived differences are accentuated the wider the AFOV of the binocular.

To demerit the outstanding optical performance of the Nikon WX for its design choice of a balanced distortion mapping is absurd to me. With the extreme WFOV of the 10X50 WX the RB effect would be pronounced if the optics were designed for the tangent condition distortion mapping.

Stephanie
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Old Saturday 18th August 2018, 15:54   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adhoc View Post
FWIW offering no comment on the pros and cons of AllBinos!
Well, Allbinos might be OK to guide a beginner in the right direction, but I nevertheless think that some of their evaluations are bunkum.
Do they really believe that aberrations such as rectilinear distortion, field curvature, astigmatism and coma (if they can differentiate between these) suddenly set in at a precise point in the field of view and are absent up to that point?
It is also unreasonable to compare the transmission of a complex design such as the WX to a Fujinon FMT. I could raise a number of criticisms of my SMART, but its poor towing ability would not be one of them!
Go take a look through a WX and like David and Stephanie you will be flabbergasted.

John
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Old Sunday 19th August 2018, 03:00   #10
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Allbinos is a great source of information, and I agree some of their scoring methods
could be better, as in tripod socket available, and some other things.

I have used some of the binoculars tested on there, and I do agree with their findings.

Gijs, who posts often on here is another good resource, but his work is not posted in English
so I often cannot read it.

For those who like to criticize, go ahead and do all the work required for tests and comparisons like
this.

Jerry
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Old Sunday 19th August 2018, 03:45   #11
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Thank you Stephanie and John. I was hoping for that kind of information. The reason for my post is this. I have thought that the flaws which exist in the best binoculars are due to constraints in size or cost (i.e. price). It seems to me that Nikon were free from those constraints in designing the WX. If the criticism quoted is correct I wished to know why such an instrument was/can not be made as close to perfect in those parameters as technically possible at present.
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Old Sunday 19th August 2018, 09:28   #12
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I'm pretty sure that Nikon had other priorities than getting the highest score in Allbinos ranking system when designing the WX binoculars. Especially as the "stunning view" category seems to be missing.

And as Allbinos write themselves:

"You should never look blindly at just the numbers. Our task is to provide you some food for thought. If you want to use the material, published by us, in a way which is most perfectly suited to your needs the analysis must be done by every Reader on his or her own. Do not hesitate to omit these categories which don’t interest you or give different weights to particular results. Only such a creative approach will help you make a good, well-thought-out choice."

https://www.allbinos.com/2.1-article...noculars_.html

Last edited by Vespobuteo : Sunday 19th August 2018 at 09:44.
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Old Sunday 19th August 2018, 10:11   #13
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Would I be correct ( in the most simplistic terms ) that this binocular is not at all suitable for birding due to ....
a. The focusing system - independent on both sides.
b. The weight of the item.
Apart from mounting on a tripod for observation purposes, what is the market that these are aimed at? I've looked at the Nikon Sports Optics site and it uses images of the night sky for promotion.
So, why is it being demonstrated at essentially a birdwatching event and being discussed on a birdwatching forum?

These come across imho as a lower magnification and costlier version of the Kowa Highlander unit. What am I missing please?
Pat

Last edited by PYRTLE : Sunday 19th August 2018 at 10:21.
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Old Sunday 19th August 2018, 10:17   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PYRTLE View Post
Apart from mounting on a tripod for observation purposes, what is the market that these are aimed at?
Probably astronomy, on a parralellogram mount.
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Old Sunday 19th August 2018, 10:21   #15
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Pat,

You are correct. Here is a more complete reply:
"Area of application
Astronomy very good
Bird watching not recommended
Hunting not recommended
Travel and sports not recommended
Sailing good
Theatre not recommended"

So there you have it---you cannot use them as opera glasses, but I guess you knew that...

Peter
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Old Sunday 19th August 2018, 10:33   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NDhunter View Post
Allbinos is a great source of information, and I agree some of their scoring methods
could be better, as in tripod socket available, and some other things.

I have used some of the binoculars tested on there, and I do agree with their findings.

Gijs, who posts often on here is another good resource, but his work is not posted in English
so I often cannot read it.

For those who like to criticize, go ahead and do all the work required for tests and comparisons like
this.

Jerry
Jerry,

Allbinos is a commercial site. They accept advertising. I'm sure Gijs' interests are academic and his tests objective but even they are published on a dealer's site. There are other sites on the web ranging from amateurish to esoteric gobbledegook. If they are well presented then the rewards are that the authors get lent alpha bins for a few months, or who knows what else?
Personally, I would place much more reliance on some contributors to this forum, such as Henry, Kimmo, Holger or David (Typo).

If Allbinos simultaneously rate a binocular for coma, astigmatism and "blurring at the edge", then one is compelled to ask if they know what they are doing. And if they quantify their evaluations, then these numbers (and i don't just mean the marks) should be the result of measurements and not individual judgement.

John
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Old Sunday 19th August 2018, 11:20   #17
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Like many on this forum, I too, of course, am aware of the strengths of AllBinos and criticisms regarding their methods by knowledgeable members here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vespobuteo View Post
...Allbinos...the "stunning view" category seems to be missing...And as Allbinos write themselves...
Also, more simple, resolution, which, too, is explained by them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PYRTLE View Post
...why is it being demonstrated at essentially a birdwatching event...?...These come across imho as a lower magnification and costlier version of the Kowa Highlander unit. What am I missing please?...
The best view and the widest field at 7x and at 10x when mounted?
I could (imho too) not help thinking that of the WX and the Highlander!
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Old Sunday 19th August 2018, 11:45   #18
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The best view and the widest field at 7x and at 10x when mounted?

Yes they may well be, though I still cannot correlate why they're being compared to a birdwatching, sports optics binocular as in the O.P. They may well optically " blow the EDG out of the park" but I doubt you'll ever see a birder using one in the field.

My understanding of Birdforum was it was a community based around birdwatching, nature and all things associated rather than a platform for optics science.

Last edited by PYRTLE : Sunday 19th August 2018 at 11:53.
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Old Sunday 19th August 2018, 13:23   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PYRTLE View Post
The best view and the widest field at 7x and at 10x when mounted?

Yes they may well be, though I still cannot correlate why they're being compared to a birdwatching, sports optics binocular as in the O.P. They may well optically " blow the EDG out of the park" but I doubt you'll ever see a birder using one in the field.

My understanding of Birdforum was it was a community based around birdwatching, nature and all things associated rather than a platform for optics science.
Pyrtle,

Some of us enjoy getting submerged in the technicalities and what's wrong with that? AltaVista above expressed the hope that there might be some cross-fertilization from the WX to future Nikon birding bins.
Ten years ago the latest wide-angle zooms for birding scopes would have been unimaginable, but I suspect the designers have learned from developments in camera zoom lenses and if disc brakes hadn't been the standard for aircraft, we'd all probably still be driving around with drum brakes.

John
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Old Sunday 19th August 2018, 13:29   #20
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Perhaps not in the field as you would use an 8x42, but mounted in the manner of a scope should not be excluded. Birding is obviously not the intention in the 'mobile' sense, but it certainly makes a fantastic birding implement! The 10 seemed more than a 10, and the 50 more than a 50 if that makes sense; an absolutely stunning view, mounted as it was overlooking Rutland Water.
You wouldn't want it round your neck though......
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Old Sunday 19th August 2018, 14:13   #21
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That's one of the points I was attempting to make, I just don't see this binocular being used by modern day birdwatchers given how often one has to adjust the focusing when looking at wildlife from a range of a metre and a half to say, infinity. I've only experienced seeing mounted binoculars on Finnsticks in Finland, seaside resorts, coastwatch lookouts and on large ships.
When I see someone out birding with a pair of these, I'll eat my words.
I'm exhausted now but thanks anyway.
Pat

Last edited by PYRTLE : Sunday 19th August 2018 at 14:18.
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Old Sunday 19th August 2018, 14:55   #22
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I have viewed the WX 10X50 on many occasions (a friend of mine owns one), both daytime and primarily for astro. I have the EL SV10X50, the Leica UVHD 10X50, and the FL 10X56 , the WX 10X50 is not a versatile glass, weight, and of course cost, but from an optical perspective it crushes the aforementioned glass- just my 2c.

Andy W.
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Old Sunday 19th August 2018, 15:41   #23
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I have viewed the WX 10X50 on many occasions (a friend of mine owns one), both daytime and primarily for astro. I have the EL SV10X50, the Leica UVHD 10X50, and the FL 10X56 , the WX 10X50 is not a versatile glass, weight, and of course cost, but from an optical perspective it crushes the aforementioned glass- just my 2c.

Andy W.
And - I suspect its not the first time - I fully concur with all of your your 2c, Andy (I have the privilege of owning the WX).
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Old Sunday 19th August 2018, 15:59   #24
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Pat, sorry I did not clarify that, but Paddy7 now has.
I meant for open terrain, like wetlands in a waterbird survey
--or the wetland at the British Bird Fair (as I picture it)--
or the view from a lodge of a grassland with taller flora...
The WX 7x and 10x-- and the Higlander at 32x--can be of
frequent use for bird observation in my own two examples above
and other places I have been to--maybe also at Rutland Water?
I certainly did not think of carrying around except in a vehicle.
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Old Sunday 19th August 2018, 16:44   #25
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Thanks adhoc........that was also my thought of when one might use this instrument in association with birding or panoramic viewing. As paddy7 suggested, a "birding implement ",for a specific task I guess. And as he commented on another thread, a unit celebrating many years of Nikon science and research. Yes, it will be interesting to see who stocks them in the UK, let alone demonstrates both models. My guess would be special order only with perhaps a very limited number of specialist outlets handling them.
Pat

Last edited by PYRTLE : Sunday 19th August 2018 at 17:09.
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