• Welcome to BirdForum, the internet's largest birding community with thousands of members from all over the world. The forums are dedicated to wild birds, birding, binoculars and equipment and all that goes with it.

    Please register for an account to take part in the discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.
ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

New Old Trinovids (1 Viewer)

Ken’s “tests” are about as useful and realistic as dpreviews. When dpreview published a lab test of the Fuji GFX100 they hadnt even managed to focus the lens.

No, they aren't. Not saying dpreview's "tests" are the cat's meow but they sure are more informative than Ken's stuff. Plus there are plenty of people posting in the forums who know what they're doing.

The only tests that seem to really have a measure of informative repeatability seem to be DXO.

If you're interested in the dynamic range of cameras and so on, try Bill Claff's website: http://www.photonstophotos.net/. I find that more reliable than DXO.

Hermann
 
I've ALWAYS been weak! LOL! I'm pretty sure it won't compare favorably to the HD+ in any way optically, especially since the FOV has been set straight. But absolute optical quality isn't EVERYTHING to an avid birder. It's a smaller, lighter 7X binocular which I do find intriguing.

You summed up nicely what makes the 7x35 interesting. Small package and light. And from what I saw at the fair in early December the optics are at least pretty decent. I compared the Retrovid 8x40 to the Trinovid HD 8x42 and found the Retrovid in anything somewhat better than the Trinovid HD with a - to my eyes - noticeably more neutral colour balance.

Still, this was inside a hall, so this needs to be taken with a grain of salt.

Hermann
 
You summed up nicely what makes the 7x35 interesting. Small package and light. And from what I saw at the fair in early December the optics are at least pretty decent. I compared the Retrovid 8x40 to the Trinovid HD 8x42 and found the Retrovid in anything somewhat better than the Trinovid HD with a - to my eyes - noticeably more neutral colour balance.

Hermann

I don't have nostalgia for old Trinovids, so Chuck's and your statement really ring true to me - the advantage is form factor and weight, with the additional advantage of a less widely available magnification for the 7x. My personal suspicion is there is really only one binocular in this general weight class / size range that makes a valid comparison, which is the 42mm Monarch HG. A comparison of the Retrovid 7x35 or 8x40 vs the 8x42 MHG, or even the Retrovid 7x35 vs MHG 8x30 would be interesting to see.

But it would still just be academic for me, the lack of waterproofing would be a dealbreaker even if I loved them and didn't mind close focus distance.
 
I emailed the Leicastore in SF to see if they had any more Retrovid's 7x35 and here was their answer. They do have the 8x40 and 10x40's if anybody is interested.

"We only received the unit that you purchased. These are not limited editions, but they are a special product with limited production. I should have more later in the month. I have the 8x40 and 10x40 available. We have yet to receive the second shipment of 7x35's. Shall I reserve the next set for you or would you like to try the 8x40's?"

Best Regards,
Sean"


https://redirect.viglink.com/?forma...- BirdForum&txt=https://www.leicastoresf.com/
 
Last edited:
I was shown Ken Rockwell's affiliate commission earnings by colleagues who met with one of the big NY camera shops. He makes an *extremely* comfortable living, or at least did 15 years ago. The way he does that is by faux-folksy inflammatory articles worthy of a carnival barker. It's a deliberate strategy, and an effective one.
 
And to help polarise people into either the pro- or anti-Ken camp, his post today is an excellent example of his style:
'Photo Products of the Decade: 1820 - 2020'
at: https://kenrockwell.com/tech/photo-product-of-the-decade-2000s.htm


- - - -

Ken includes the myth that Oskar Barnack ‘invented’ the 24x36 mm image size used on 35 mm film

Of course it’s unknowable who first thought of using 35 mm motion picture stock in this manner, and then took an image using either a modified or prototype camera
And while we do know that Barnack built his first 24x36 mm prototype in around 1913 - commercial production did not commence until 1925 with the Leica I Model A

In contrast, as early as 1913 or 1914, Simplex of New York marketed a camera taking 24x36 images on 35 mm stock
And another early commercial offering was the Furet by E. Guerin & Cie of Paris which dates from around 1923
(e.g. see pages 210 to 214 of the book Camera by Todd Gustavson, Sterling Innovation New York 2009)

One of Barnack’s great accomplishments was to popularise the format


John
 
Last edited:
The focus wheel is very good on the Retrovid. It is smooth without any stickiness and I find it quite a bit better than the Ultravid. Here is another picture of the Retrovid and the Ultravid HD 8x42. The Retrovid is a lot slimmer and lighter. Notice how the Ultravid has no gap between the tubes and the Retrovid does.

The 7x42 Ultravid, not the 8x42, is the proper binocular to compare with the 7x35 "Retrovid."

The 7x35 "Retrovid" looks remarkably like the old Leitz 7x35 Trinovid which was a remarkably good looking binocular and the Leica 7x42 Ultravid is and always was plug/ugly!

That is about all we know about them so far and Leica has otherwise sober birders doing cartwheels over them!

What is sorely needed are unbiased comparisons of their specifications, inner workings and views while in practical use as birding tools!

Bob
 
And to help polarise people into either the pro- or anti-Ken camp, his today's post is an excellent example of his style:
'Photo Products of the Decade: 1820 - 2020'
at: https://kenrockwell.com/tech/photo-product-of-the-decade-2000s.htm


John

These writeups are easily digested, opinionated with some reasonable rationales. If the man can earn a decent living that way, more power to him.
Perhaps he will become a shining example to college English majors, proof that it is possible to survive without a STEM degree.
 
These writeups are easily digested, opinionated with some reasonable rationales. If the man can earn a decent living that way, more power to him.
Perhaps he will become a shining example to college English majors, proof that it is possible to survive without a STEM degree.

Indeed. I am sure Mark Twain is raising a glass to Ken :)

Edmund
 
The 7x42 Ultravid, not the 8x42, is the proper binocular to compare with the 7x35 "Retrovid."

The 7x35 "Retrovid" looks remarkably like the old Leitz 7x35 Trinovid which was a remarkably good looking binocular and the Leica 7x42 Ultravid is and always was plug/ugly!

That is about all we know about them so far and Leica has otherwise sober birders doing cartwheels over them!

What is sorely needed are unbiased comparisons of their specifications, inner workings and views while in practical use as birding tools!

Bob
Bob. That is a 7x42 Ultravid HD next to the Retrovid not an 8x42. I agree that the Retrovid is a very good looking binocular. I agree that we need more reviews but right now I think I am the only person in the US that has one. Anybody else have one? Anybody?
 
Last edited:
What is sorely needed are unbiased comparisons of their specifications, inner workings and views while in practical use as birding tools!

Bob

Because, boy are birders and binocular lovers entirely without competent optics at hand able to do the job. ;)

I remain a bit skeptical of their charms, partly because I don't expect the eye relief will work for me. In addition, Dennis's pronouncements are as consistent and stable as a windsock in a hurricane. He'll change his mind eventually, and so his comments are merely temporary, biased utterings intended primarily to trumpet the achievement of owning one, and to try to get others in the forum to purchase one to validate his choice.

I don't doubt its a quality optic. Is a combination of 'retro charm' and good ergos enough to satisfy the discerning folks here? Eventually we will find out, but meanwhile there are certainly a pile of good optics available to meet one's needs.

-Bill
 
.....
.....
.....

What is sorely needed are unbiased comparisons of their specifications, inner workings and views while in practical use as birding tools!

Bob

Such comparisons will come with time, just be patient ... (see below the end of my post ;))

btw., I had some business in town yesterday and some spare time, and as I walked past the local Leica Store, they had several Retrovids in the shop window, so I went in and had a look.

Turns out they so far only got the 8x40 model (but quite a number of them, several were on display). This is perhaps the model that will raise the least interest of the three.
They didn't know when the 7x35 and 10x40 will become available.
Anyway, since I was there, I spent half an hour with the 8x40, inside and outside the shop, and they gave me a Trinovid 8x42 HD (which I own myself and know quite well) for side by side comparison.

This confirmed the excellent impression from my short time in Germany in December with the 7x35 and 10x40 regarding the build quality and finish of the Retrovid. All samples I saw yesterday were impeccably finished, I am not sure I have ever seen better finish quality in binoculars (the Trinovid HD looked almost "cheap" in comparison).

The 8x40 (and, I guess, the same might be true for the 7x35 and 10x40) are probably NOT primarily targeted at the birding community.
Here is why I think that: the 8x42 Trinovid HD requires a 3/4 turn of the wheel to focus from 4m to infinity. The Retrovid 8x40 requires double that, almost 1 1/2 turns, so has a very slow focuser, like the old-time Leitz Trinovids! This allows very precise focusing action, but appears less useful when trying to follow a flock of birds flying off.
However, the focuser worked very well in all samples, precise and smooth, no play. The dpt adjustment goes goes quite hard, but again with precision.

The image in the 8x40 appeared bright, clear and very "steady", with good central sharpness and contrast, almost crisp. Sharpness goes out very far, probably more than 80% or more from the image center, only the very edge appears slightly blurred, but even that blurriness was not horrible.

Image characteristics appeared quite similar to the Trinovid HD (e.g. when panning), even perhaps a tad brighter in the Retrovid, and while the image of the Trinovid HD seemed to exhibit a slight reddish or yellowish hue, the Retrovid exhibited a very neutral image.
CA appeared slightly better controlled in the Retrovid than in the Trinovid HD; there is still some left, but quite acceptable in the center, a bit more towards the edge.

The size of the field of view in the Trinovid HD (124m) and the Retrovid (123m) is virtually identical; that's not very much in either of them, but the nice image quality of the Retrovid almost made me forget that (I have to disclose here that I tend to prefer an evenly sharp image in a smaller field of view over an "unsteady image" with varying sharpness in a widefield bino).

The Retrovid showed clearly less spikes on bright light sources (shop LED's) than the Trinovid HD. Looking from the front end through the tubes in the Trinovid HD against a bright background, I could spot the roof edge as a very fine line; I couldn't see that in the Retrovid, which tells me that their roof edge seems very properly ground / polished.

Comparing the handling of the Retrovid in the shop with the Trinovid HD, the Ultravid HD+ and the Noctivid (I know all three very well, and the shop had all of them in store), everything felt right about the Retrovid - size, weight, shape, haptics, everything. The other three are all rubber armoured, of course, and I am pretty sure they are better suited for rough use, but the Retrovid has this special feeling of a very fine quality instrument about it (I know Leica is good and famous for creating that kind of impression, esp. also with their cameras).

So, overall even the "least interesting" of the Retrovid models, the 8x40, made a positive impression on me (things like stray-light suppression or ghosting could not properly be explored in the shop, but I could not detect any immediate big flaws there).

Are the Retrovids too expensive ? Hard to say. But after comparing one side by side with the same size Trinovid HD, I would accept that it has to cost more than the latter. Of course, only longer term experience will tell whether that impression is justified or not.

I admit that I really start to like the Retrovids :C

Do I need one? Definitely not!

Do I want one ? Hmm ... :eek!:
 
Last edited:
Thanks Canip for info on the 8X40, I have a feeling you are right that it will be the model of the least interest of the three, with so many quality and lower priced 8x42s out there.

Andy W.
 
Thanks for sharing your impressions Canip. Do you have any comments on eye relief relative to the other binoculars you compared it with?

Bill
 
Here is why I think that: the 8x42 Trinovid HD requires a 3/4 turn of the wheel to focus from 4m to infinity. The Retrovid 8x40 requires double that, almost 1 1/2 turns, so has a very slow focuser, like the old-time Leitz Trinovids! This allows very precise focusing action, but appears less useful when trying to follow a flock of birds flying off.
However, the focuser worked very well in all samples, precise and smooth, no play. The dpt adjustment goes goes quite hard, but again with precision.

The image in the 8x40 appeared bright, clear and very "steady", with good central sharpness and contrast, almost crisp. Sharpness goes out very far, probably more than 80% or more from the image center, only the very edge appears slightly blurred, but even that blurriness was not horrible.

Image characteristics appeared quite similar to the Trinovid HD (e.g. when panning), even perhaps a tad brighter in the Retrovid, and while the image of the Trinovid HD seemed to exhibit a slight reddish or yellowish hue, the Retrovid exhibited a very neutral image.
CA appeared slightly better controlled in the Retrovid than in the Trinovid HD; there is still some left, but quite acceptable in the center, a bit more towards the edge.

The size of the field of view in the Trinovid HD (124m) and the Retrovid (123m) is virtually identical; that's not very much in either of them, but the nice image quality of the Retrovid almost made me forget that (I have to disclose here that I tend to prefer an evenly sharp image in a smaller field of view over an "unsteady image" with varying sharpness in a widefield bino).

I had exactly the same impression of the 8x40 when I compared it to the Trinovid HD at the trade fair in early December. In fact, I also preferred the contrast and the colour balance of the Retrovid. After comparing the binoculars for half an hour I felt the Retrovid was optically better than the Trinovid HD.

BTW, if I were to buy a Retrovid, I'd look at the 8x40 very carefully. I often find 7x is not quite enough magnification, and 10x is often a bit too much. The slower focuser is something I wouldn't worry about too much, I find I can get used to slow focusers much more easily than to fast focusers.

Hermann
 
Last edited:
Brilliant to get some feedback on these bins. I look forward to hearing more about the 7x35s. I am increasingly intrigued! ��
 
Warning! This thread is more than 4 years ago old.
It's likely that no further discussion is required, in which case we recommend starting a new thread. If however you feel your response is required you can still do so.

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top