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ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

Canon SX60HS in Action (1 Viewer)

I always like to think of the magnification in terms of binoculars and telescopes (of which I frequently use) - I know it's a bit 'rough and ready', but it gives me a bit of an indication of the reach in a way that I can best understand it......I think the 400mm image (X 1.6) is like looking through 12X binos......
For me, reach is a factor of getting a clear image, how far away (in meters generally, because of the nature of this forum's audience).

By your method, stated in 35mm equivalencies:

  • My digiscoping rig was a 1250mm scope ("42x zoom") with a 155mm Nikon Coolpix 4500 (using about "2x zoom" at the eyepiece). This setup is 4MP resolution.
  • The Canon SX60 by itself has a 1350mm optical zoom ("65x zoom"). This setup has 16MP resolution.

I haven't photographed the White-Tailed Kites yet with the SX60 (a pair of them I have photographed for over a year so I know how close I can view them with the digiscoping setup), but as near as I can tell I have about the same "reach" with the SX60 as I do with the digiscoping setup...and get far better photos without being tethered to a big setup and a tripod.

Another reference: I also have a pair of 10x25 binoculars. And my girlfriend is borrowing a Nikon D700 full-frame DSLR long term that has a 300mm lens. Judging by her photos, I'd say she can't photograph as close as the binoculars can see, though it may be fairly close (tough to make this sort of comparison without doing it intentionally, which we've never bothered).

It may not be until Spring when I can catch the White-Tailed Kites again, so I won't know until then what I've really lost or gained with the SX60 compared to my digiscoping setup...but I certainly will report back when I figure it out.
 
Re the Nikon full frame with the 300mm lens - my 'rough and ready' calculation would be 6x (ish), so indeed, not as powerful as your 10x25 binoculars.
Jont
 
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For me, reach is a factor of getting a clear image, how far away (in meters generally, because of the nature of this forum's audience).
I think that's a logical definition of reach, but I recall being dragged over the coals in a dpreview forum for suggesting reach might be anything other that focal length. A very intolerant lot.
 
I've always favoured comparing to binoculars - but only because I have used them over such a long period - this gives me a much more practical understanding of how I am seeing things. Yes of course, the purists will hate this and can be quite condescending......makes me smile.
Jont
 
calvinfold said:
For me, reach is a factor of getting a clear image, how far away (in meters generally, because of the nature of this forum's audience).
I think that's a logical definition of reach, but I recall being dragged over the coals in a dpreview forum for suggesting reach might be anything other that focal length. A very intolerant lot.
Well, then it's a good thing I never claimed to be a professional or purist photographer then, eh? 8-P

I'm sure they are just as purist as forums all over the web tend to get about "but, but, but, but it's just not the same as a DSLR, therefor it's a horrible camera" whenever talking about just about any camera.
 
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I am really loving the power of this cameras zoom,in the first pic below you can see a wall crossing a stream,beyond the wall you can see a smaller part of the stream with a rock in the water,just to the right of the rock was a dipper feeding,the second pic is the dipper taken with the 2x converter
 

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I think that's a logical definition of reach, but I recall being dragged over the coals in a dpreview forum for suggesting reach might be anything other that focal length. A very intolerant lot.

Yeah, the DPReview crowd can be tough, but there's good info to be had there. For instance, someone recently mentioned that if you back off slightly from full zoom on the SX50, the F stop moves fairly quickly from 6.5 to 5.6.
I had C1 set to 2x tele and fully extended, but after reading this, I found the point on the zoom where it goes to 5.6 and re-saved. Now when I switch to C1, the camera automatically zooms to exactly that spot, so I don't have to waste time trying to find it while the bird gets away.
Don't know how many tips in this thread can be applied to the SX60, but it seems like some could be. Here's a link to the post I mentioned, maybe somebody here can figure out where that "sweet spot" is on the SX60 and share the info.
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/55091832
 
Glad to see more people getting results they are happy with from the SX60. It's really depressing going to DPR and reading how everyone sent theirs back and are delirious now they are back to an SX50, thank God etc

Anyway, I had my optical unit swapped out by a service centre approved by the supplier of my SX60. Has it sorted everything? I don't know. I think things are a bit better, but maybe that's just a little more usage and/or a bit of psychology. If I later learned that no parts had actually been changed I wouldn't fall off my chair, put it that way

Calvin wrote a great description of what the 'Extra IS button' does "--The other button for "IS assist at long range" works like this, for the curious: what it appears to do is "slow down and track" based on the center zone. It keeps you from the natural tendency to over-correct for the shake of your body and hands by slowing-down the perceived motion and reactions by a split second. It does seem to somehow keep an eye on whatever is in the center and assume you want to stay near it. If you use this mode with very slow, relaxed and deliberate motions it makes it easier to take shots that without it would be jittery. NOW I understand why it exists separately from the main IS routines. For me, it seemed a bit more like a mild form of tracking assist combined with a split second delay in apparent motion/movement on screen to keep the user from going crazy trying to micro-compensate for every little exaggerated/magnified motion"

But I don't find use of this button giving consistent results or even operation. I have found that if I focus (green box) and then engage this button it does what Calvin says part of the time. Other times it will still 'bounce' Sometimes this bouncing stops and you can take the pic, sometimes you have to start over, let go and re-focus etc. I have also used it the other way around. Engaging the IS button (white box) and then focusing. Sometimes this works, sometimes not. ('Normal' IS is always on continous mode in these trials)

My percentage of keepers is very low. This could well be lack of skill and experience rather than the camera, though that's the thing - I still don't know. The my SX60 at zoom is really awful inanything other than bright light. I mean with full zoom and digital TC if you manage to get it in focus and zoom in even a little on the PC it's pretty crappy

One thing I do know is I'm not getting anything like the quality of some of the SX50 shots I've seen. What I wish (need) most is to use an SX50 to do direct comparisons with. Maybe, I can borrow one some time or will have to fork out just to put these questions to bed once and for all. I've attached some pics of zoomed out, full zoom and then full zoom with 1.6x and 2.0x. The tryre is 125m away

The last one is a cropped jpg of a buzzard 135m away. I suppose I wouldn't have it at all without the SX60, but I have no ide if any of these results are any good (technically)
 

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Marcobf:

Try these:

--Switch to shutter priority
--Set the shutter speed to 1/320 or 1/400 with exposure compensation at EV -1.0
--(or) Set the shutter speed to 1/500 with exposure compensation at EV -0.6
--Turn off the digital teledapter unless you REALLY need the reach, because detail drops (despite being very cool)

I'm finding these basic settings are getting me good whites and darks as long as the bird isn't too much in the shadows. Check out my more recent gallery shots. I've done photos of good quality at 40-50m, okay photos out to 80-100m.

HOWEVER, despite getting good results with these settings, they do push-around the dynamic range (mostly to avoid clipping whites), so you may need to use Photoshop (or Lightroom?) to "fix" the photo (they will be too dark at first glance). Doesn't bother me, I'm more interested in maximizing the data knowing full well the camera doesn't do it well by default (I had to do this with my Nikon Coolpix 4500 too), and this sort of "shifting the dynamic range" is one of those little secrets to maximizing consumer and prosumer level camera images.

I've gotten to the point that on long-range shots I don't need to use the button on the lens barrel for the added IS, the faster shutter speed compensates well enough and I brace the camera with my face and tucked-in arms. Granted, neck and back aches after a long session at this. ;-p

For images at the far end of the zoom the 1/500 works well (even for BiF), but up to 1/800 works a bit better (1/1000 is a bit overkill at really taxes the camera's ability to get enough light in less-than-ideal sunlight). Or just use a tripod, honestly. If I need a crystal-clear shot at range, I carry a lightweight tripod with me (Velbon S6000 right now, though I have a Vanguard Alta Pro 263AT and a Manfrotto MH293D3-Q2 on order).

Still on my "experiment" list: different noise reduction settings, the effects between "Sunny" and "Cloudy" modes, and using RAW. But I'm getting good results with the settings above for the short term.
 
Marco. You say "What I wish (need) most is to use an SX50 to do direct comparisons with. Maybe, I can borrow one some time or will have to fork out just to put these questions to bed once and for all" I've got an SX50, and your idea appeals to me too. Maybe we can meet up and do some experiments? Or if you'd rather have a play by yourself , I could probably lend it to you for a week.

If this appeals, let me have your phone number, and I'll call.

Jeff

PS The ED50's great!
 
What an amazing forum - I'll try those settings CalvinFord, that's a really nice offer Jeff and I've also had a private message offering help too. Knocked out

Will get to the bottom of this thing :)
 
while out shooting on Monday I took most pics on 500 (tv mode) some didn,t look right ,I pressed the display button to check them and noticed they were registering 50 instead of 500 ?I haven't taken any pics with the teleconverter switched off,ill try it next time I am out
 
One thing I forgot to mention is that the picture always looks better in the viewfinder before the capture than it does afterwards. I'm not sure if this is normal or a sign that the sensor is somehow faulty. Is this the case for anyone else?
 
One thing I forgot to mention is that the picture always looks better in the viewfinder before the capture than it does afterwards. I'm not sure if this is normal or a sign that the sensor is somehow faulty. Is this the case for anyone else?

Yes, everytime, unless your literally a few feet from the subject. I posted ages ago about the viewfinder image looking better when taking moon shots. Does the same for alot of BiF shots too...shame really, coz if the images looked that good then everyone would be happy (including the whiney biatches on DPR!)
 
while out shooting on Monday I took most pics on 500 (tv mode) some didn,t look right ,I pressed the display button to check them and noticed they were registering 50 instead of 500 ?I haven't taken any pics with the teleconverter switched off,ill try it next time I am out

Not sure how the teleconverter comes in but are you saying you took about 500 photos but when looking at them with the display button it only shows 50?

The only thing that I can think of is that with the SX50, I don't have the 60, if I take pictures in the HQ burst mode only the first of the burst of photos will show up when reviewing with the display button. They all show up when downloaded though. Is it possible something like that's happening?
 
oops now that I re read my post I see I didn't explain it well, I meant the camera was on tv mode and the shutter speed was 500,the pics that didn't look right registered at a shutter speed of 50 even though the camera was still set to 500
 
oops now that I re read my post I see I didn't explain it well, I meant the camera was on tv mode and the shutter speed was 500,the pics that didn't look right registered at a shutter speed of 50 even though the camera was still set to 500

Not sure about the SX60, but the SX50 has a "safety shift" function that will adjust the shutter speed down if there's not enough available light for the speed and zoom length that was chosen by the operator. I'm guessing it's the default setting, but you can turn the safety shift off, in which case the camera will take the photo at the chosen speed no matter what the conditions.
 
Not sure about the SX60, but the SX50 has a "safety shift" function that will adjust the shutter speed down if there's not enough available light for the speed and zoom length that was chosen by the operator. I'm guessing it's the default setting, but you can turn the safety shift off, in which case the camera will take the photo at the chosen speed no matter what the conditions.

Forgot to say.....with safety shift off, when you depress the shutter halfway, the aperture value will display in orange if there's not enough light for good exposure. Gives you a "heads up" so you can adjust the settings.
 
I just checked my camera, and I leave Safety Shift *on*. The in-camera help says it will only over-ride exposure, not shutter speed. Given that I leave ISO and aperture to the camera, this is kinda redundant anyway.

I've never had the camera second-guess the shutter speed in Tv mode, even on overcast days--it stays set where I set it. So no idea how you're doing that, since "shutter priority" mode on a camera is suppose to let you lock the shutter speed, that's the whole point.

Not sure if it matters but:

--I have ISO limited to 1600 max (my first time out I did tests and beyond that the noise becomes unacceptable)
--I use AF Point for the auto exposure point
--Servo AF
--Continuous AF
--Center-Weighted metering
--I haven't been paying attention to the color of the rectangle much (oops!), but it's been blue or white to my recollection
--I really haven't been watching the aperture and ISO colors, leaving it up to the camera (some day, when I try to control more than shutter speed...)
--I do have the on-screen/on-viewfinder histogram displaying, for those times when I have the time to pay attention while shooting
 

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