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tripod head (1 Viewer)

eric s

Well-known member
You mentioned in the tripod/head thread that you replaced your Arca (I assume Arca-Swiss) with a Kirk. Seeing as how I'm currently researching a new head (that sounds bad...) I was wondering what caused you to switch brands? And which did you switch to? (BH-1, I assume.)

I understand if you don't want to bash a given brand, I just wondered. I've heard very good things about both heads (and some bad things about how the Kirk company handles their customers) so I thought I'd ask.

Eric
 
eric s said:
You mentioned in the tripod/head thread that you replaced your Arca (I assume Arca-Swiss) with a Kirk. Seeing as how I'm currently researching a new head (that sounds bad...) I was wondering what caused you to switch brands? And which did you switch to? (BH-1, I assume.)

I understand if you don't want to bash a given brand, I just wondered. I've heard very good things about both heads (and some bad things about how the Kirk company handles their customers) so I thought I'd ask.

Eric
Thanks Eric,
You are right in saying that I switched from Arca to Kirk ball heads and I will tell you why on Monday. My apologies but I am just leaving for a weekend show and I have quite a bit to say on the matter which will be of interest to you (and others).
Regards George McCarthy
 
I appreciate any information you can give. The reason I'm leaning towards the Arca-Swiss is the progressive tension system (comes from the non-circular ball, for those that don't know.). I will use the legs (Manfrotto 3443D )/head both with a spotting scope (Swarovsky ATS80-HD) and with a canon 10D + 100-400L + 550EX. Not having it slide when leaving the setup non-horizontal is appealing (I'm not the only one who uses the scope, so "lock it down" means training someone else... it's not going to happen.) Also, next spring I'm considering some longer... either the 500mm f4 or the Sigma 300-800. Of course, when that happens, I'll have to replace my legs.

I hope the show goes well this weekend and you have some fun.

Eric

ps. And thanks for contributing to the forum. Your wealth of knowledge and experience is very helpful.
 
ARCA SWISS VERSUS KIRK BALL & SOCKET HEADS

For many years I used Arca Swiss Ball & Socket heads with their superb quick release plate system. From my previous equipment list you can see that I owned three of them including the B1G that I used exclusively with my heavyweight Canon 600mm F4L telephoto lens.

I became increasingly aware, way back in the late eighties, that conventional pan and tilt heads were not the answer for the nature photographer. They are just too slow in use, which isn’t a problem when you are photographing a static subject but anything on the move – forget it! The reason is simply that you have to tighten no less than three screws to lock up the head completely and by the time you have done that invariably your subject is long gone. The secret of a ball head is that you only have to tighten one knob and you’re immediately in business. It’s quick, simple and above all extremely fast.
However, back then there was a problem with the Arca Swiss system and I soon discovered it. It was the quick release plates or perhaps I should say quick release plate. There was only one supplied with the head and, if you wanted more, which you obviously did, there was only one size available anyway. This is quite ridiculous because you need custom sized plates for optimal performance with every lens that has a tripod-mounting collar. Secondly if you used just the one plate changing it from lens to lens or camera body to camera body you would not have a quick release system – far from it.

I solved the problem by designing my own plates for each lens and camera body and having them made at a local engineering company. They were grossly expensive but they worked perfectly. All was well until I changed a lens or camera body, something we all do far too often. This invariably meant another trip to the workshop, time wasted until it was made and more expense. That was until I had another idea and one that I have relied upon to this day. Rather than have individual plates made each time I had metre-long lengths of aluminium bar dovetailed that I could then cut and drill to size at home as and when needed.

To-date Arca Swiss have never addressed the problem of the plates leaving it to one or two entrepreneurial companies in the States to manufacture and supply them direct. One such company is:


Kirk Enterprises, 333 Hoosier Drive, Angola, IN 46703-9336, Tel. 219 665 3670
www.kirkphoto.com

Visit their website and you will see that they manufacture an incredible range of plates and associated products for just about every camera or lens on the market. Many incorporate precisely contoured anti-twist flanges or a non-pivoting lip design, whilst others offer multiple screw fixing. These features keep the plates from twisting and assist rigidity.

Some plates also offer the ability of attaching a quite superb flash bracket that Kirks have designed for use with long telephoto lenses. This bracket makes it easy to add a catch light or fill-flash and, importantly, the flash remains in the same position in relation to the lens even when the photographer swings the camera body from one axis to the other.

So, at the time, I had just bought two new EOS1v camera bodies and having studied Kirks product range I decided the time had come for me to try out some of their gear. I placed my order over the web (very easy) and arranged to have the goods shipped, not here in Sussex but to Florida City. It was from there that my Florida tours began and I would have two weeks to give them a rigorous and extensive field test.

My findings were? ……………well I’ll tell you that next time. I will give you a clue however by telling you that my tour group of 8 photographers on having the products to see and handle at close quarters placed an order there and then totalling over $2500.00. Yes $2500.00 so that must tell you something!

To be continued.
 
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Really Right Stuff has just recently decided to upgrade their presence in the market. For a long time, they didn't allow orders over their website, and they barely advertised.

They're now under new management, according to their latest catalog, and I've been noticing slick ads in the magazines for their products.

I've owned plates, etc. from each company, and they both offer excellent products. I slowly gravitated toward Kirk because it was so much easier to order from them. I own a Kirk BH-1 head, the Kirk window mount, flash bracket, and several quick release plates.

I'd decided to upgrade from my Kaiser ballhead, and decided on the Kirk. My Kaiser head kept slipping when I didn't really bear down on the release knob. I usually noticed this right after I'd slung my rig over my shoulder while moving from location to location. Such terror is known by few men as when your $2000+ worth of equipment is slinging around like a newborn baby's head.

I've not been disappointed in the Kirk's performance. I'm very happy with the service I've gotten, the delivery times, and most of all, the quality of their product.

I don't have a huge budget for my photo equipment, so I carefully research any significant purchase (which for me is anything over $50). Kirk has not let me down.

Steve in Houston
 
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Steve

Does the your Kirk head have progressive tensioning like the Arca Swiss has? In other words, when you tilt the camera/scope off level, do you have to increase the tension because it will continue to tip over? The Arca Swiss heads have a system that causes the tension to increase as you tilt, to make up for the change in CG of whatever the tripod is holding (and therefor preventing them the camera/scope from tipping over on its own.)

Eric
 
Eric S:

The Kirk does have the same 'controls' that the Arca-Swiss has - a main release knob, a panning thumbscrew, and a 'released tension' knob. This third item allows for you to set the amount of resistance on the ball when the main knob has been released.

To my knowledge, the head never self-adjusts at any point (that was your question, right?), but you can eliminate any chance of the head flopping over by adjusting this third knob yourself. If the Arca has that feature, that's pretty cool. I have not noticed that I have to adjust the tensioner on the Kirk once I've begun to tilt the camera up or down, so perhaps it does some of what the Arca does.

One of the drawbacks of the Kaiser I had (the Pro model, I think) was that the 'released tension' knob did not allow for a predictable, smooth amount of tension. This added surprises to my shooting sessions that I didn't appreciate. I will say, however, that the panning on the Kaiser was very smooth. The Kirk is a little stickier, and you need more 'startup inertia' to get the thing panning for you. It's not an extraordinary problem, but I figured that I would offer due diligence.

Steve
 
Thanks for the information. I've been trying to find out if Kirk's heads have "progressive tension" (as Arca Swiss calls it) for awhile. My understanding is that it comes from the shape of the ball. The Arca Swiss ball is not round, but elliptical and therefor when you tilt the camera more pressure is applied, creating more friction.

I also don't know if this feature is actually useful, or just sounds good. The logic is sound (i.e. tilting a large lens on a ball head will shift its CG and creates more down force than when you set the tension when it was horizontal) but it is really a problem which needs a solution?

I don't know.

Eric
 
Arca v Kirk (part two)

One drawback of the Arca that may have been resolved by now - I don't know - is that it had a tendancy to "freeze up". When this happened you could no longer release or tighten the head until some serious pressure was applied. It usually happened when you were right in the middle of some action! It certainly happened to me several times and I have had it happen to workshop clients. I have also met some nature photographers that it has never happened to so maybe it's luck of the draw?

So when I saw the sheer quality of the Kirk BH1 ball head and the associated products that time, spread out on the bed back in my Florida motel I knew my decision to change was a correct one and one I have never regretted since. As I say the workmanship & the quality was simply amazing and it has worked flawlessly ever since - how I wish I had done it earlier.

Now addressing your problem of "ball flop", not a medical one I hope Eric?

Regardless of what make of ball head you use all of them are prone to this aggravating problem despite all the careful tensioning you apply simply because of the weight of long telephotos and the pressure and stress they bring to bear.

In actual fact when you are using say a 500 or a 600 you really need very little play at all to re-position on your subject if it moves or whatever.

About 5/6 years ago I was sitting in my camper on the Varanger Peninsula in Northern Norway. The weather was atrocious and I was thinking about this very problem. Suddenly I had a brain wave. What if I put a solid rubber ring under the lens plate to take up the slack so that this fine tensioning (that didn't work anyway) wasn't neccessary? I figured this would solve the problem once and for all. But where would I get such a ring? They do sell such rings in pet shops for dogs, maybe I would get one there? Well it would have to wait until I returned from my trip - you don't come across many pet shops in the arctic tundra!

The next morning I went for a walk around a small freshwater pond looking for shorebirds. It was good for Red-necked Phalaropes and Little Stints. To my amazement there floating in the water was a rubber wheel from a childs toy truck, just what I had envisaged going on my Arca head. It wasn't perfect but it did the job. (see new image of Little Stint taken shortly after fitting the wheel)

I believe in fate, by the way.

The following year saw me on Ft Myers beach Florida still using that same rubber wheel when I was approached by another photographer querying what this strange device was. I explained - he was impressed. He was also with a tour group???? Next thing I know is that Art Morris is selling plumbing washers to take up the slack on Arca ball heads!! Perhaps it was a case of "great minds think alike".

Now coming back to the bed in my Florida motel room. There among the products I had ordered was a Snap Collar! What's that you ask?

Well it's something everyone who uses these ball heads should have. Here is Kirks own description of this great ball head accessory.

"A snap collar offers low-cost protection when you plan to carry your camera on your tripod with a lens attached. The all-new snap collar will snap snugly around the top of your Arca Swiss B1, Kirk BH-1, and Kirk BH-3. The collar prevents the ball from flopping to the side and damaging your equipment. They also help avoid undue stress on the locking mechanism, helping your ball head perform and last longer."

Here was my toy wheel again now revamped and it works perfectly. Well, Eric, I hope you haven't fallen asleep reading all this. But there's more - next time I will tell you why ball heads are b....y useless for panning and the cure.

George McCarthy
 
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I am most certainly not asleep! Quality ball heads cost way too much to not be waiting with anticipation for your next post. None of the Pros I know (which is only a few) have a large ball head of any brand, so I don't really have anyone else I can ask for "first hand" experience with them. I greatly appreciate the length of posts and their detail.

I am going to look at a used Arca-Swiss head at a rather low price later this week. I know that they fixed the "Freeze Up" problem several years back, but I don't know if this used one would have the fix or not. I certainly wouldn't want to buy one (even cheaply) that had the problem. Yours is the first account I've heard of it happening during use (I've always heard of it during storing/carrying.) That is really bad/scary news.

Just to be clear, you use the rubber wheel to help support the weight of the lens while carry the camera/lens attached to the tripod? But like the Kirk Snap Collars you take it off while shooting? My problem with droop is when actually using the camera. You tilt it down because your subject has moved closer (always like that) but since the CG has shifted the tension that was proper for the camera/lens when it was horizontal is no longer enough and if left tilted the lens would start to droop. Now the better ball heads have much better tension systems than what I use (or have borrowed), so maybe this isn't a problem with the better made heads.

Eric
 
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The rubber wheel was replaced some time ago and I now use the snap collars. The SECRET is to leave the collar in place, not only for carrying, BUT WHEN YOU ARE TAKING THE PICS!
By doing so it means that, although your lens movement is restricted, (remember you don't need much movement with the longer telephoto lenses) you can leave the head un-tightened thus making it faster and easier to focus. You ONLY lock it up when taking the shot. It is difficult to explain something like this without demonstrating it. My suggestion to you is if you buy the 2nd hand Arca make sure you buy the Arca snap collar that Kirk makes. Then all will become clear to you. Look at the Little Stint pic I posted - that was taken with a Canon 600F4L plus a 1.4 AND THE RUBBER WHEEL IN PLACE. In fact when I found it I had to cut the wheel to get it round the stem and the glue the two ends together so I couldn't take it off even if I wanted to. I used it like that for over two years.
Hope this is a bit clearer?

George McCarthy
 
Yes, crystal clear! Thanks for the tip.

I would have thought that too limiting, but as you describe it it does make sense (for long lenses, where you need the protection the most.) I was thinking of getting on of the Snap Collars already (and an L Bracket.. so why not get them at the same time?)

I look forward to the rest of your story.

Eric
 
George I use the arca swiss ball head and have found that an exhaust rubber does just fine in preventing ball flop as you put it. The only draw back is if you need to angle the ball at an extreme angle you cannot. It also obviously prevents damage to the surround of the head, should it suddenly flop right over. You need to use a bit of muscle to apply it but it will go.
 
For anyone interested the exhaust rubber part no. is
Bosal 255338, or autogem SR35.
They should have an internal diameter of approx 35mm.
As I said they can take a bit of effort to put on, but if you roll them over the head they will go. Worth a try and they are cheap as well.
Also If you find the ball doesnt run as freely and smoothly as you would like, try cleaning it with Mr Sheen. It hasn't done mine any harm so far.
 
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Just shows that it wasn't just me that experienced and resolved this problem by themselves. The exhaust collar is new to me but the Kirk Snap Collar beats the rest hands down because you can remove it in an instant should you need a greater angle for the lens.

George McCarthy
 
George the other thing I forgot was that Really Right Stuff used to send out info re ball heads etc. If anyone has a problem with lock up it would appear simple to resolve. One of the things was that you should always store the ball head in an unlock mode. If anyone wants to know how to get out of a freeze up situation shout out.
 
Arca - Kirk - ?????? Part three

I was pretty pleased having resolved the ball head flop problem to some degree using my rubber wheel initially and then snap collars but I was still not happy when using it with long HEAVY telephotos for action work and flight photography in particular. It is not easy to set the tension so that it is sufficient to keep the lens upright whilst allowing complete ease of use for panning. If you set it to keep the lens straight it was to tight to pan freely. If you set the tension for panning the lens was so heavy it flopped. The answer – the Wimberley head. There’s nothing to beat this gimbal type head for flight and action work.

Heavy telephoto lenses, once balanced, become weightless and you can move them with ease. What’s more they cannot flop. When I first went to Bosque del Apache, New Mexico end of the 90’s I knew that I was in for a lot of flight work and saw this as an opportunity to put the Wimberley through it’s paces. I contacted Clay Wimberley, the designer, and asked if I could have one sent to my hotel in Socorro and, with the help of that old piece of plastic, there it was when I arrived.
It needs to be set up correctly at the beginning of the shoot and this means levelling the tripod and balancing the lens but once that’s done the head is a joy, in fact a revelation, to use. It is heavy and cumbersome but once used I guarantee you will use nothing else for your action work.
Wimberely can be contacted at;

Wimberly Design
974 Baker Lane
Winchester
VA 22603

Tel 540 665 2744
www.tripodhead.com
 

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Though I'm not in the same league as George or (the?) Major I can wholeheartedly endorse the Wimberley gimbal head. It is excellent for general wildlife photography & especially for flight shots. The kit doesn't come cheap, however it will be money well-spent especially if you invest in heavy glass such as a 500 of 600 f4 lens. Wimberley also do a smaller version called the sidekick which mounts onto ballheads such as Arca or Kirk. This is fine for lighter telephoto lenses but a bit too "flimsy" for the big boys! I've also mounted my large lenses on a Manfrotto 516 video fluid head. These heads can be adjusted to allow fluid dampened movement on panning/tilting but the head then holds it's position without the need to tighten up. The drawback with these heads is that they don't allow sudden quick movements which may be required to follow a bird in flight. They are great if you get into bird video however.
 
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