Join for FREE
It only takes a minute!
Zeiss - Always on the lookout for something special – Shop now

Welcome to BirdForum.
BirdForum is the net's largest birding community, dedicated to wild birds and birding, and is absolutely FREE! You are most welcome to register for an account, which allows you to take part in lively discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.

x32 SF: the waiting begins

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread
Old Wednesday 29th May 2019, 09:51   #76
Troubador
Moderator
 
Troubador's Avatar

 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Sheffield
Posts: 9,084
Quote:
Originally Posted by temmie View Post
Hi Lee,

I was actually hoping you could get some more 'hard' info about the development of the SF 32:
1. Will Zeiss develop one?
2. If so, how far are they in the process?
3. If so, do they have a (vague) planning to bring it to the market?

Temmie

Who needs Zeiss when we have CJ?

Lee
Troubador is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 29th May 2019, 10:58   #77
Chosun Juan
Given to Fly
 
Chosun Juan's Avatar

 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Central West NSW, Australia
Posts: 5,744
Talking

Lol ! All I am permitted to say is that anyone hankering for a triple bridge 32mm SF is wishing for a bridge too far ......


Interesting snippets from the vault ...... from 2014 no less! :)
https://www.birdforum.net/showthread...12#post3729812 ..... search for 32mm, or 32SF, etc
Quote:
Originally Posted by ticl2184 View Post
I agree... Nice to have a large FOV.....Without distortion preferably, otherwise,, whats the point??

When I spoke to Dr Dobbler at Birdfair, we discussed a future 8x32 SF with a fov of over 150m and a 10x32 of 130m plus....


Cheers Tim
Quote:
Originally Posted by ticl2184 View Post
Yes, In my conversation, I asked if there would be a 32mm SF version with a greater fov than 150m plus for the 8x and 130m for the 10x. He confirmed this....

There was no time frame attached to these models release though sadly. But I think it would be a fair guess thats its goin be 2016 or
sooner.

Cheers Tim
At this rate I think it will be a race between Brexit and the 32mm SF to see which one gets here first ...... !




Chosun

Last edited by Chosun Juan : Wednesday 29th May 2019 at 12:42. Reason: Lynx :)
Chosun Juan is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2016 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Wednesday 29th May 2019, 11:35   #78
PYRTLE
Registered User
 
PYRTLE's Avatar

 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: North Norfolk
Posts: 3,907
Naughty CJ!

I now see that a 3 point bridge couldn't be squeezed in to keep the focusing wheel in position and allow your fingers to be wrapped around the tubes / barrels. What a task for the designers but maybe that is why the Swaro 32 ELs work so well. I still love my Zeiss 8 x 32 FL for handling and image.

Stop teasing young lady.

P
PYRTLE is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 29th May 2019, 12:40   #79
Chosun Juan
Given to Fly
 
Chosun Juan's Avatar

 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Central West NSW, Australia
Posts: 5,744
Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by PYRTLE View Post
Naughty CJ!

I now see that a 3 point bridge couldn't be squeezed in to keep the focusing wheel in position and allow your fingers to be wrapped around the tubes / barrels. What a task for the designers but maybe that is why the Swaro 32 ELs work so well. I still love my Zeiss 8 x 32 FL for handling and image.

Stop teasing young lady.

P
* Honestly, it's not an either / or question .... and it's not rocket science ....
* There's what - half a billion plus more people on the planet than when the speculating kicked off .... so the market is hardly shrinking ....
* Plenty of people like the form factor of the x32 FL ..... so just fill it full of HT glass
* Plenty of people love the Swarovski SV and I don't think I've ever heard of anyone dissing the ×32's handling .....
* Since the advent of the Nikon MHG a 32mm SF form factor chooses itself :)



Chosun
Chosun Juan is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2016 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Wednesday 29th May 2019, 15:19   #80
Troubador
Moderator
 
Troubador's Avatar

 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Sheffield
Posts: 9,084
CJ

Bet you didn't foresee the announcement of SF90!

Lee
Troubador is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 29th May 2019, 22:28   #81
Chosun Juan
Given to Fly
 
Chosun Juan's Avatar

 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Central West NSW, Australia
Posts: 5,744
Quote:
Originally Posted by Troubador View Post
CJ

Bet you didn't foresee the announcement of SF90!

Lee
Half true Lee - it was eagerly awaited, though perhaps expected at more of a hybrid V6TT "Dino" type 'entry' offering. It is very exciting! that Ferrari has come out with the full whack 1000cv market positioning first up (not entirely unexpected when cost recovery /image etc is taken into account). It has thoroughly put it's competitors to the sword (take that! McLaren! - though I do rather like the Speedtail :)

I have already put my order in (to the Universe :) for a "Assetto Fiorano" variant




Chosun
Chosun Juan is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2016 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Wednesday 29th May 2019, 23:43   #82
[email protected]
Registered User

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 1,857
I just ran across a special Zeiss Bulletin at their website and they have actually RELEASED a prototype picture of what the new Zeiss 8x32 SF is going to look like or at least this is their goal and what they are shooting for!
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	swarovski_32208_8x32_el_binocular_with_1447545061_1176824.jpg
Views:	66
Size:	58.1 KB
ID:	696560  

Last edited by [email protected] : Thursday 30th May 2019 at 15:33.
denco@comcast.n is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 30th May 2019, 18:52   #83
Swissboy
Registered User
BF Supporter 2019
 
Swissboy's Avatar

 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Sempach, Switzerland
Posts: 3,592
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
I just ran across a special Zeiss Bulletin at their website and they have actually RELEASED a prototype picture of what the new Zeiss 8x32 SF is going to look like or at least this is their goal and what they are shooting for!
But please without that stupid strap attachment! Looking into the neighbor's garden is OK, but don't just do a uninspired copy.
__________________
Robert
--PS: That's a Sooty Falcon on the avatar, photo taken near Sharm el Sheik, Egypt. My highest priority raptor at the time.
What's your species on the avatar? I often have no clue
!
Swissboy is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 2011 2012 2013 2014 2015 2016 2017 2018 2019 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Thursday 30th May 2019, 22:12   #84
temmie
Registered User
 
temmie's Avatar

 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Belgium
Posts: 1,250
Looks like a very early prototype, I’ll give my opinion once this prototype is improved significantly
temmie is online now  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2009 2010 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Friday 31st May 2019, 00:48   #85
[email protected]
Registered User

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 1,857
Quote:
Originally Posted by temmie View Post
Looks like a very early prototype, I’ll give my opinion once this prototype is improved significantly
Interesting that Zeiss is changing their color to green. I guess they did a marketing survey and they found out green binoculars sell better for some reason. Possibly brand association. I don't know about that Northern Goshawk emblem though. That is certainly going to cause some trademark lawsuits!

Last edited by [email protected] : Friday 31st May 2019 at 00:55.
denco@comcast.n is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Friday 31st May 2019, 07:54   #86
Troubador
Moderator
 
Troubador's Avatar

 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Sheffield
Posts: 9,084
Quote:
Originally Posted by temmie View Post

Looks like a very early prototype, I’ll give my opinion once this prototype is improved significantly
You are right Temmie, this early prototype programme was abandoned due to glare problems and the inadequate and unambitious field of view of 141m at 1,000m which although sounds plenty, doesn't stand up when SF42 already has 148m. I guess SF32 will be targeting over 150m.

I like the green colour but all of the SF42s produced in this green faded to a kind of grey colour before they even left the factory which is why the later units reverted to traditional black.

Lee
Troubador is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Friday 31st May 2019, 08:19   #87
paddy7
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: suffolk
Posts: 630
Although Zeiss has always had a close relationship with green - according to others, not me!
paddy7 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Friday 31st May 2019, 08:22   #88
Chosun Juan
Given to Fly
 
Chosun Juan's Avatar

 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Central West NSW, Australia
Posts: 5,744
Cool

Quote:
Originally Posted by Troubador View Post
You are right Temmie, this early prototype programme was abandoned due to glare problems and the inadequate and unambitious field of view of 141m at 1,000m which although sounds plenty, doesn't stand up when SF42 already has 148m. I guess SF32 will be targeting over 150m.

I like the green colour but all of the SF42s produced in this green faded to a kind of grey colour before they even left the factory which is why the later units reverted to traditional black.

Lee
Apparently early customers of this model were highly dissatisfied ! Grrrr !

This is despite the class leading ease of view, and finding in practice that any glare problems were just an Internet myth invented by 3 bored mice !

What really p****d customers off was the blue ring around the periphery of the Fov, the loose and squishy faded armouring which showed up grubby fingerprints, and the dodgy cheap focuser components supplied and of course we won't even mention the horrible eye cups which caused those 3 mice to poke their eyes out in despair !






Chosun
Chosun Juan is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2016 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Friday 31st May 2019, 08:43   #89
Troubador
Moderator
 
Troubador's Avatar

 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Sheffield
Posts: 9,084
One thing is very clear and that is that the present management of Zeiss Sports Optics are determined that there will be no more premature announcements of new product such as happened with HT, SF and Harpia.

Lee
Troubador is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Friday 31st May 2019, 10:17   #90
David in NC
Registered User
 
David in NC's Avatar

 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Jonas Ridge, NC USA
Posts: 751
Quote:
Originally Posted by Troubador View Post
One thing is very clear and that is that the present management of Zeiss Sports Optics are determined that there will be no more premature announcements of new product such as happened with HT, SF and Harpia.

Lee
Wasn't it the HT release that gave us the COUNT DOWN (and the COUNT UP ) "clock"?
David in NC is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Friday 31st May 2019, 10:36   #91
Troubador
Moderator
 
Troubador's Avatar

 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Sheffield
Posts: 9,084
Quote:
Originally Posted by David in NC View Post
Wasn't it the HT release that gave us the COUNT DOWN (and the COUNT UP ) "clock"?
HT was only the first David, SF and Harpia also suffered long delays before supplies reached the dealers. All three were examples of how not to launch a new product.

Lee
Troubador is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Friday 31st May 2019, 14:57   #92
Pinewood
New York correspondent
 
Pinewood's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: New York, USA
Posts: 3,787
Hello,

Would anyone care to comment on what he considers to be the useful lifetime of an "alpha" binocular and even how often a manufacturer should redesign a product? Perhaps, time to upgrade is solely dependent on the introduction of new technology. The short lived, original Zeiss Victory, not the FL line, was rather unimpressive. The FL line claimed to reduce chromatic aberration and a better colour rendition and had a generally positive reception. The SF line's improvements were better ergonomics and wider field. Was that enough to encourage anyone to an early upgrade?

Happy bird watching,
Arthur
__________________
Bread is not enough. Give us circuses!
Pinewood is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Friday 31st May 2019, 20:42   #93
[email protected]
Registered User

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 1,857
Quote:
Originally Posted by paddy7 View Post
Although Zeiss has always had a close relationship with green - according to others, not me!
Are you referring to bias or binocular color?
denco@comcast.n is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Friday 31st May 2019, 21:26   #94
paddy7
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: suffolk
Posts: 630
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
Are you referring to bias or binocular color?
Well, there has been long debate about the colour cast of Zeiss favouring the green range. Whether i see it or not is a matter i'm taking psycho-analytical advice for.
It was kind of a joke. I laughed; a bit.....
paddy7 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Friday 31st May 2019, 22:42   #95
elkcub
Registered User
BF Supporter 2019
 
elkcub's Avatar

 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Northern California
Posts: 4,471
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinewood View Post
Hello,

Would anyone care to comment on what he considers to be the useful lifetime of an "alpha" binocular and even how often a manufacturer should redesign a product? Perhaps, time to upgrade is solely dependent on the introduction of new technology. The short lived, original Zeiss Victory, not the FL line, was rather unimpressive. The FL line claimed to reduce chromatic aberration and a better colour rendition and had a generally positive reception. The SF line's improvements were better ergonomics and wider field. Was that enough to encourage anyone to an early upgrade?

Happy bird watching,
Arthur
Hi Arthur,

In my opinion, forever! I'm perfectly happy with my alpha binoculars, which include Swaro, Zeiss, Leica, and Swift products. They're all over 10 yrs. old and stood the test of time. The last "upgrades" that Swarovski and Swift introduced were actually downgrades, e.g., the 8x42 SLC, and last Swift 804ED Audubon, from which I learned a sobering lesson: Achieving the ultimate can hurt business, so always leave flaws to improve upon in the future.

Ed
__________________
Understanding optics is child's play compared to understanding child's play.
"Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts." Richard Feynman

Last edited by elkcub : Saturday 1st June 2019 at 02:01.
elkcub is online now  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2009 2010 2011 2012 2013 2014 2015 2016 2017 2018 2019 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Friday 31st May 2019, 23:52   #96
NDhunter
Registered User
 
NDhunter's Avatar

 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: ND
Posts: 4,047
Quote:
Originally Posted by David in NC View Post
Wasn't it the HT release that gave us the COUNT DOWN (and the COUNT UP ) "clock"?
Zeiss is famous for the initial branding of the Victory HT Binoculars, "Designed by Hunters for Hunters".

That was the kickoff advertising effort, not sure why they went that direction and the HT line had a relatively short model life.

It is hard to have 2 flagship models, so the SF is the winner here, I agree this
is a very good binocular.

Jerry
NDhunter is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Saturday 1st June 2019, 06:00   #97
paddy7
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: suffolk
Posts: 630
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinewood View Post
Hello,

Would anyone care to comment on what he considers to be the useful lifetime of an "alpha" binocular and even how often a manufacturer should redesign a product? Perhaps, time to upgrade is solely dependent on the introduction of new technology. The short lived, original Zeiss Victory, not the FL line, was rather unimpressive. The FL line claimed to reduce chromatic aberration and a better colour rendition and had a generally positive reception. The SF line's improvements were better ergonomics and wider field. Was that enough to encourage anyone to an early upgrade?

Happy bird watching,
Arthur
Do you mean 'useful lifetime' from a marketing/sales/promo point of view, or for the user? How often does a manufacturer need to re-generate sales by re-inventing its products?
From the user's point of view: if you buy bins that are as good as your particular eyes need or can use (bowing to the inevitability that at least one side of that equation will slowly get worse); that these bins are extremely well engineered and constructed, and that you have them serviced from time to time and keep them in good order, then the only reason to change them would be BinLust when something new comes around.
It will be a test of one's own inner strength if someone completely satisfied by a FL 8x32 is suddenly confronted with a SF....
paddy7 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Saturday 1st June 2019, 07:47   #98
Troubador
Moderator
 
Troubador's Avatar

 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Sheffield
Posts: 9,084
Paddy is right, the bino brands need to sell binos and not just in the first year of a model's introduction but continuously. They don't operate in a vacuum, competitors launch new or refreshed models which attract the attention of customers and sales can drift away from long-established models to newer ones no matter how good the older ones are. Brands respond to this by launching their own new or refreshed models.

You can see this operating on a wide variety of products, not just binos. A walk through any supermarket reveals labels on bottles of shampoo, toilet cleaner, washing-up liquid and many other products all carrying a flash shouting NEW.

New versions of car models are launched at regular intervals as the brands seek to keep them centre-stage.

The pressure to replace perfectly good product comes from the fact that competitors are doing this and getting their products reviewed in the media and creating a buzz and an excitement around their new product that generates sales for them.

None of this means that anyone who is happy with their Dialyt or original EL or their FL or BA/BN has any need to change unless a new model has features that would genuinely increase their enjoyment.

Lee
Troubador is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Saturday 1st June 2019, 09:39   #99
Swissboy
Registered User
BF Supporter 2019
 
Swissboy's Avatar

 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Sempach, Switzerland
Posts: 3,592
Quote:
Originally Posted by elkcub View Post
………..: Achieving the ultimate can hurt business, so always leave flaws to improve upon in the future.

Ed
So true, and likely an important marketing feature in many fields.
__________________
Robert
--PS: That's a Sooty Falcon on the avatar, photo taken near Sharm el Sheik, Egypt. My highest priority raptor at the time.
What's your species on the avatar? I often have no clue
!
Swissboy is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 2011 2012 2013 2014 2015 2016 2017 2018 2019 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Saturday 1st June 2019, 09:43   #100
Swissboy
Registered User
BF Supporter 2019
 
Swissboy's Avatar

 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Sempach, Switzerland
Posts: 3,592
Quote:
Originally Posted by paddy7 View Post
...........It will be a test of one's own inner strength if someone completely satisfied by a FL 8x32 is suddenly confronted with a SF....


That's why I'm NOW buying a FL 8x32.
__________________
Robert
--PS: That's a Sooty Falcon on the avatar, photo taken near Sharm el Sheik, Egypt. My highest priority raptor at the time.
What's your species on the avatar? I often have no clue
!
Swissboy is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 2011 2012 2013 2014 2015 2016 2017 2018 2019 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Advertisement
Reply


Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Waiting for the Sun halftwo Your Birding Day 5 Tuesday 22nd July 2014 06:08
waiting mauricek Birds & Birding 9 Friday 25th May 2007 23:17
What All Of You Have Been Waiting For!!! adam_wildluva6 Birds & Birding 43 Sunday 12th March 2006 13:38
Waiting for a bus then along comes two? charlierocky Birds & Birding 6 Friday 10th February 2006 10:04

{googleads}

Fatbirder's Top 1000 Birding Websites

Help support BirdForum

Page generated in 0.26894808 seconds with 38 queries
All times are GMT. The time now is 18:59.