Binocular Upgrade help please Kowa/Zeiss or Vortex around £1000 (1 Viewer)

Good afternoon,

I know there are a lot of similar threads, but I'm after some real world user advice/experiences on upgrading my binoculars, from the list below.

I've been birding watching for about 2 years now, using a Hawke Endurance ED 8 X42 and i'm looking to upgrade.

I've done a lot of internet searching and read lots of threads on this forum, so i think I've narrowed it down with the following constraints:

-Looking to buy a new rather than second hand set
-Budget of £1000
-8 x preferred magnification
-42mm rather than 32mm, I live in NE Scotland, short days in winter etc. So assuming 42 will give me better light gathering and eye placement? I am wrong to discount 32mm bins?

I will be trying them out but its a 6 hour round trip to Viking Optics in Edinburgh, which is in a town centre, so the more real world info i have the better.


Kowa Genesis 8.5 X44-Especially interested on user experience with these

Questions?
-Old model, is it about to be replaced?
-Weight? How do users find it? I've weighted down my current pair to a similar level and it does give me pause to question what they would be like all day.

Zeiss Conquest 8X42
-User experience?

Vortex Razor 8 X42
-User experience?

I have tried the Meopta Meopros and didn't like the design

Thank you for any help you can give me.

Kindest regards

Pete

Hi Pete, about 3 years ago I was faced with the same dilemma as I wanted to upgrade from my Vanguard Endeavor, original, 8x42ED. I tried a friends Swarovski EL 8.5x42 and, while the view was magnificent I didn't feel I could justify the price tag of nearly £1700.00. After reading lots of reviews, and comments on Bird Forum, I bought a pair of Zeiss Conquest 8x42. I thought they were great binoculars, nearly as good as the Swarovski EL's and far better than the Vanguards. The one problem I had with them was eye placement, inspite of having the original and longer eye cups. The IPD was set perfectly but I had to be so precise with the eye placement when bringing them up to my eyes, I wear glasses by the way. After about 9 months I got the chance to look through a pair of Swarovski SLC 8x42 and immediately they felt so comfortable every time I brought them up to my eyes. To my eyes they provided the same immersive view as the 8.5x42 EL's, but without the field flattener lenses. I decided to sell the Conquests and struck lucky with Uttings January sale and managed to buy a pair of SLC for £1120.00. I have never regretted the purchase and still don't consider them inferior to the EL's. You have the Kowa Genesis 8.5x44 on your list, which I would love to try, but with no binocular stockest near where I live I have to hope I can try someones at a reserve sometime.

Les

Pete,

The Kowa Genesis binoculars (both 33 and 44) probably have the best colour correction of all binoculars on the market, but CA is of course only one aspect of optical performance. The 8.5x44 can be recommended for glasses wearers but for those viewing without glasses the large diameter eyecups might prove uncomfortable.

The Meopta Meopros you mention are in a lower price category but the Meostars are optically and mechanically excellent and also very robust.

It would not surprise me if replacements for the 44 mm Genesis and Meostars were imminent but is that really important? One should judge a product on its merits and not whether it's the latest and newest. Sadly, specifications are often dictated by the marketing people (weight, close focus etc.), often to the detriment of the overall optical qualities, and I fear that complaints about the weight of the Meostars will lead to reduced prism size (and more vignetting) in their successors.

John

I think the Zeiss Conquest HD would probably be the best bang for buck and pretty safe choice. I wouldn't consider the Vortex but I've always been interested in the Kowa.
Weight and so on aside I like the sound/idea of them but have never handled a pair. Where I'm from they cost the same as the Swarovski SLC so that's a pretty tough competitor by reports and on that note I'd like to try both.
Hope you get on well with your search.

I have the Kowa Genesis 8x33 and have used the Conquest HD 8x32. They are very close to each other in optical performance and once I put the longer eye relief on the Conquest they both fit my eyes well (not a glass wearer). I personally like the larger eye cups of the Genesis. I think the Genesis handles flare a bit better than the Conquest and there's something subjective about them that I just like better. The conquest does focus faster (fewer turns) and it has that sleek precise Zeiss feel to them. I doubt you could go wrong with either, but one or the other might work better for you ergonomically.

Hi,

I would also recommend to have a look at the Nikon MHG 8x42 if you can - it also does quite a lot things right and in a light and compact package - especiall recommended if you like a flat field...
As for Vortex - I think it's not quite in a league with the other ones, I think. The Zeiss is nice, if you wear glasses or can cope with the extra-long ER (Zeiss used to deliver longer eyecups free of charge which fixed the problems for some but not all).
The Kowa is the undisputed king of microcontrast and CA control - but a little bit overweight...

Here's some links...

https://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=271150

http://www.holgermerlitz.de/kowa85x44.html

Joachim

Just curious as to why you would discount second hand binos? Most of my premium binos are second hand. I'm not rich but I like nice things. I got my Leica Ultravid HD 8x32's used for $900, view is stunning. Bought my Swaro SV EL 8.5x42's used for $1250, a top of the line glasses. My Leica UVHD+ 7x42 were a demo glass, significant saving from new. Those first two are top tier right near your price range, maybe look around. Remember, the minute you take it out of the wrap, it's used!

That said, some folks want what they want and that's their business. If you have to have new I wish you the best of luck you've got some good recommendations.

I have the Razor 8x42 (MIC), it's good, not big 3 good but not big 3 money. I'm pleased and like to take it when I want a good view but don't expect I'd be able to put in a level of care that a more expensive glass would warrant. I live in the US and I got it for the warranty. I don't know about prices where you are but I paid around $600usd for a demo pair.

It seems like half the folks on here have either a Kowa Genesis 8x33 or Zeiss Conquest 8x32, but the full sized x44 and x42 aren't as well represented. I think the culprit is the FOV. The mid-sized models of each have very competitive 8 degree FOV while the full size versions have narrow FOV for their class.

I have the Genesis 8x33 and think they are great, but I cant say how they compare to the Conquest.

I think the Zeiss Conquest HD would be a great choice, also in the midrange the Nikon Monarch HG.

You did not try the right Meopta, that would be the Meostar, also one of the best in this range.

I own examples of all of these, they are very good. I would not go with Vortex, all china made, cheaper
made, not as good long term.

Jerry

Thanks for all the comments.

So in the end I went for the Kowa 8x33. Although it’s wasnt on offer as I know they occasionally are.

I tried the 8.5x44 and as expected , I thought they were great optically but too heavy for the type of birding i do, lots of long walks, and trips up the Cairngorms. The conquests were nice but over all I liked the feel of the Kowa the best. I think I will appreciate the weight of the 33 over the 44. Everything in life is a compromise and I think the 33s will offer me good performance in a portable package that won’t be tiring to use in the hand or carry on a long walk.

They are certainly a good step up from my Hawke endurance 8x42, I only wish they had the built in objective covers that they have.

Cheers

Pete

wokka said:

Thanks for all the comments.

So in the end I went for the Kowa 8x33. Although it’s wasnt on offer as I know they occasionally are.

I tried the 8.5x44 and as expected , I thought they were great optically but too heavy for the type of birding i do, lots of long walks, and trips up the Cairngorms. The conquests were nice but over all I liked the feel of the Kowa the best. I think I will appreciate the weight of the 33 over the 44. Everything in life is a compromise and I think the 33s will offer me good performance in a portable package that won’t be tiring to use in the hand or carry on a long walk.

They are certainly a good step up from my Hawke endurance 8x42, I only wish they had the built in objective covers that they have.

Cheers

Pete

Click to expand...

Hi Pete,

Sounds like you've done well.
32's (33 in your case) are a great compromise and the Genesis by all reports are a top notch choice, enjoy.