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Grist to the Anti-raptor Mill (1 Viewer)

Irish Kite said:
If that is true then it would significantly reduces the main loss factors such as fox and corvid predation along with problems relating to exposure, injury and disease . Sounds to me like the farmers in Norway provide a far better standard of husbandry for their animals then the crofters you mention which I strongly suspect is the main issue here. Of course instead of implementing proper practice its far easier to to bitch and moan over easy scapegoats with a view to getting even more state handouts:(
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Or it could just be far colder and darker at lambing time in Norway. Eagle Golden clearly knows the area and farmers in question,so perhaps he knows what he's talking about.
 
biggsy said:
Or it could just be far colder and darker at lambing time in Norway. Eagle Golden clearly knows the area and farmers in question,so perhaps he knows what he's talking about.
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Thanks for that Biggsy, I think I do know the isle of mull like the back of my hand, and as I have said before, all what I have told you is first hand, I am not apposed to these brilliant birds, only the way they were reared and relesed, by the team on the isle of Rhumm, they were not released on mull as someone has stated, alarm bells rang for me, with the killing of he first female Golden Eagle, which I found the remains, and talked to the R.S.P.B. warden, who at the time tried to cover it up, saying it was the male goldie that had killed her, it took a lot of letters and investigation, to prove it was in fact the femal sea eagle that had killed her, since then other sea eagles have killed other female goldies, as they set up thier own territories, there are now well over 14 pairs of sea eagles established on mull, thats since the seventies from when they first bred on loch ba.
 
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turkish van said:
You keep mentioning this. What exactly are you saying the behavioural differences are between Scottish and Norwegian eagles?
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The difference is a wild bird is just that wild, with all the instincts of being wild, a reared bird or animal in close contact, of humans loses itsfears of certain things, look at young goslings when they first hatch, the latch on to the first thing they see, the first batch of young sea eagles on rhumm were jessed up and on long lines so they could exercise, but were fed by thier keepers in full view, so they lost that fear of man( I have a video of this happening) the authorities said at the time this would breed out of them, but it has not, when you visit the isle of mull you can see the w.t. eagles sat at the side of the road, no way would you see a wild one doing that, go see them in norway.
 
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eagle golden said:
The difference is a wild bird is just that wild, with all the instincts of being wild, a reared bird or animal in close contact, of humans loses itsfears of certain things, look at young goslings when they first hatch, the latch on to the first thing they see, the first batch of young sea eagles on rhumm were jessed up and on long lines so they could exercise, but were fed by thier keepers in full view, so they lost that fear of man( I have a video of this happening) the authorities said at the time this would breed out of them, but it has not, when you visit the isle of mull you can see the w.t. eagles sat at the side of the road, no way would you see a wild one doing that, go see them in norway.
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Now that's a funny post......jeez what a load of bull!!
 
eagle golden said:
The difference is a wild bird is just that wild, with all the instincts of being wild, a reared bird or animal in close contact, of humans loses itsfears of certain things, look at young goslings when they first hatch, the latch on to the first thing they see, the first batch of young sea eagles on rhumm were jessed up and on long lines so they could exercise, but were fed by thier keepers in full view, so they lost that fear of man( I have a video of this happening) the authorities said at the time this would breed out of them, but it has not, when you visit the isle of mull you can see the w.t. eagles sat at the side of the road, no way would you see a wild one doing that, go see them in norway.
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So the only difference is that one will sit by the side of the road and the other won't? If what you say is true - how do you think a lower fear of humans accounts for more lambs killed, as you claim?
 
turkish van said:
So the only difference is that one will sit by the side of the road and the other won't? If what you say is true - how do you think a lower fear of humans accounts for more lambs killed, as you claim?
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I think you are not seeing the problem, so I will not boar you, you need to know about the effects of imprinting, to take this further, thanks for your interest.
 
eagle golden said:
And you would know?? i suppose ther are loads of eagles in east sussex, must pay a visit. LoL
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About the same number as in Yorkshire I suspect. B :)

eagle golden said:
I think you are not seeing the problem, so I will not boar you, you need to know about the effects of imprinting, to take this further, thanks for your interest.
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I hope you're getting that book proof read before it goes to print...:-O
 
eagle golden said:
I think you are not seeing the problem, so I will not boar you, you need to know about the effects of imprinting, to take this further, thanks for your interest.
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I do actually know a bit about imprinting, so feel free to take it further. If I thought I would get bored I wouldn't have asked, plenty other things to be getting on with here!
 
redeyedvideo said:
About the same number as in Yorkshire I suspect. B :)



I hope you're getting that book proof read before it goes to print...:-O
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we have had two in yorkshire, and yes each chapter has been vetted along with all the documented evience. (thanks for advice)
it is appreciated
 
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eagle golden said:
, when you visit the isle of mull you can see the w.t. eagles sat at the side of the road, no way would you see a wild one doing that, go see them in norway.
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The thing I don't get about this is that goldies can be regularly seen from the side of the road in places like Skye. The goldie I saw on Skye was at the Storr, then it flew of and right over the main road. In Galloway Forest Park, hen harriers, one of the most persecuted and elusive birds of prey, can be seen from the side of the road. So why would a WTE be any different?
 
Lmc3598 said:
The thing I don't get about this is that goldies can be regularly seen from the side of the road in places like Skye. The goldie I saw on Skye was at the Storr, then it flew of and right over the main road. In Galloway Forest Park, hen harriers, one of the most persecuted and elusive birds of prey, can be seen from the side of the road. So why would a WTE be any different?
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I mean literally at the side of the rd, not seen from the side of the rd, with the bird a mile away, I also mean that the white tailes have no fear of man, which is the reason for problems, but no matter what evidence is put before the general birding public, they will only see it from the (tick) in thier books, and stuff the truth.
 
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Eagles and other birds become imprinted on humans within the first 24-36 hours of hatching after which imprinting does not take effect. Sea eagle fledglings are not taken from from wild nests until they are 3-4 weeks old , well after the imprinting stage. Before release great pains are taken to minimise contact between humans and the birds to the extent that the young birds hardly see their keepers who are screened when feeding them.
 
Tideliner said:
Eagles and other birds become imprinted on humans within the first 24-36 hours of hatching after which imprinting does not take effect. Sea eagle fledglings are not taken from from wild nests until they are 3-4 weeks old , well after the imprinting stage. Before release great pains are taken to minimise contact between humans and the birds to the extent that the young birds hardly see their keepers who are screened when feeding them.
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Thank you for injecting some sanity to this thread:t:
 
:t:
Irish Kite said:
Do you beleive everything you read on the net??
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What its not all real:t:
But let me see. Do I listen to a person who clearly has proven that they've been to the area and know the local farmers or a person that lives in well away from said area and clearly therefore has no idea of whats happening in said area.
I read both sides and chose to believe based on that.
A balanced opinion may seem strange to a zelot but hey ho i'll deal with it
 
Tideliner said:
Eagles and other birds become imprinted on humans within the first 24-36 hours of hatching after which imprinting does not take effect. Sea eagle fledglings are not taken from from wild nests until they are 3-4 weeks old , well after the imprinting stage. Before release great pains are taken to minimise contact between humans and the birds to the extent that the young birds hardly see their keepers who are screened when feeding them.
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Hi tideliner and good morning, lovely place norfolk, you are quite right the sea eagles that are brought over from norway for the realese on the east side of Scotland are kept in isolation of humans, but surely if you read this thread properly we are all talking about the ones released on the west coast, which is where the problem is, as for imprinting this does happen mainly as you say from a few hours old, but it also happens at any stage, up to maturity, thanks for your imput, but i afraid you have missed the real point.
As a point of interest the releases on the east coast side of Scotland, now use properly constructed hacking sheds, which have very little contact with the keepers, so the birds do not imprint, but all this was learned from all the mistakes made onthe isle of rhumm, if anyoe is interested I have got a recording of the way they were reared on rhumm, which was shown on the B.B.C. the return of the eagle.
 
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Dmacaskill said:
HI EG,

i am curious to know more about WTE killing a full grown healthy sheep! did you witness it?
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If you would like to know the full story get in touch with the farmer from Salen Isle of Mull, I am sure he would be delighted to tell you the full story. I only have this story from what has been told to me, and seeing the court papers, but I have the other details re The killing of golden eagles.Its sad but nevertheless true. My only thoughts are not malicious, but I feel I own it to one of my favorite golden eagles, that was killed, she cannot talk for herself, only the warden And the vets who eventually put her to sleep,(could if they were not so involved) after she was badly injured by a w.t. eagle. I would let you know farmers details privatly
 
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HI EG,
It is sad that you lost a Golden Eagle that you obviously new very well, I too have lost Golden Eagles that i watched for years, only to be poisoned and the nest burnt by local keepers which is far more likely than attacks from Sea eagles. I don't know the circumstances about the attack on your GE but it could have been over a nest site? as i have seen GE nesting in old SE sites on Mull.

yes PM the crofters details if you think he will be happy to tell his story.
 
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