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Rare birds dead on Queen's estate (BBC News) (1 Viewer)

Peewit said:
Hi Eddie

Your name is not George is it, as in George the Dragon :frog:

;) ;) ;)

Regards
Kathy
Click to expand...

Reminds me of a funny story.... a pal and I were drinking in the George & Dragon pub a good few years back and he was trying (without much success) to get the barmaid to serve him a drink after last orders.

After failing to win her over, he said "Nothing for it, I'd better speak to George then!"

We laughed anyway....
 
I wonder if this wildlife crime will be swept under the carpet?Or whether the hooray henries will carry on with their bloodlust.

Steve.
 
The never ending disgusting situation for the hen harrier in the UK continues never mind the slaughter over the breeding grounds these birds could well have come from the continent thus the keepers hold no prejudice in what they kill and where it comes from. It amazes me that these estates and their keepers keep publicising that they are true lovers of the countryside and conservationists only 'they choose' what lives and does not.
 
Ruby said:
Reminds me of a funny story.... a pal and I were drinking in the George & Dragon pub a good few years back and he was trying (without much success) to get the barmaid to serve him a drink after last orders.

After failing to win her over, he said "Nothing for it, I'd better speak to George then!"

We laughed anyway....
Click to expand...

Hi Ruby

Good to hear from you :t:

So true in what you say, makes you think LOL

harrier olley said:
The never ending disgusting situation for the hen harrier in the UK continues never mind the slaughter over the breeding grounds these birds could well have come from the continent thus the keepers hold no prejudice in what they kill and where it comes from. It amazes me that these estates and their keepers keep publicising that they are true lovers of the countryside and conservationists only 'they choose' what lives and does not.
Click to expand...

Hi Harrier Olley

Why should anyone think that they have the right to hurt a BoP. The Hen harriers are so rare now. Did I hear correctly that they are 15 nests/pairs left, or as ITV news gave a higher number here, just to confuse us.

Background and status does not come into it at all. :C

Regards
Kathy
 
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Hi there

Just heard the news at 2pm on ITV

It stated that the RSPB is looking into matters at the moment. That was it

Regards
Kathy
 
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Peewit said:
Hi Isurus



Maybe the staff members think that they are untouchable, and are well hidden from the world too, because they are part and parcel living with the Royals in the first place.

Yes, it is innocent until proven guilty.

Regards
Kathy
Click to expand...

Hit the nail on the head there! It is bad enough seeing Kate Middleton out shooting - whoever was responsible for the harrier killing will no doubt rest on their laurels knowing they will be given protection and will simply get away with it, like they always do. :C
 
"The incident was spotted by two members of the public and a Natural England warden, who reported the incident to police."

Unusual to have witnesses.
They are usually far more careful.

Let’s hope it makes a difference.
 
rozinante said:
"The incident was spotted by two members of the public and a Natural England warden, who reported the incident to police."

Unusual to have witnesses.
They are usually far more careful.

Let’s hope it makes a difference.
Click to expand...

Hi Rozinante

To have witnesses, I hope it makes a huge difference here :t:

At least it has been witnessed by members of the public, so it does go in the favour of the Harriers in many ways.

I wonder where a Natural England Warden stands in all of this. Is he a type of person who cares about wildlife, or is he part of the Royal support system.

I wonder if the whole thing about gamebirds was a big part of this issue. In turn the gamekeepers are up in arms about the Hen Harriers being so close to the estate. So now they shot the Harriers to protect the gamebirds (which get shot anyway - so ironic)

We will find out soon enough now ;)

Regards
Kathy
 
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Peewit said:
Hi Rozinante

To have witnesses, I hope it makes a huge difference here :t:

At least it has been witnessed by members of the public, so it does go in the favour of the Harriers in many ways.

I wonder where a Natural England Warden stands in all of this. Is he a type of person who cares about wildlife, or is he part of the Royal support system.

We will find out soon enough now ;)

Regards
Kathy
Click to expand...

Here you go Kathy:-

"Statement from Natural England

A member of Natural England's staff, along with two members of the public, saw two hen harriers being shot on Dersingham Bog National Nature Reserve in Norfolk, on the evening of 24 October 2007. Natural England is shocked that two of England's rarest birds have been killed in this way.

Natural England staff are currently supporting the Norfolk Police in every way they can to investigate the incident.

Natural England's Hen Harrier Recovery Project, running since 2001, cites illegal persecution as the greatest single factor when accounting for the birds' low population and poor breeding success."


http://www.naturalengland.org.uk/press/news2007/251007.htm
 
rozinante said:
Here you go Kathy:-

"Statement from Natural England

A member of Natural England's staff, along with two members of the public, saw two hen harriers being shot on Dersingham Bog National Nature Reserve in Norfolk, on the evening of 24 October 2007. Natural England is shocked that two of England's rarest birds have been killed in this way.

Natural England staff are currently supporting the Norfolk Police in every way they can to investigate the incident.

Natural England's Hen Harrier Recovery Project, running since 2001, cites illegal persecution as the greatest single factor when accounting for the birds' low population and poor breeding success."


http://www.naturalengland.org.uk/press/news2007/251007.htm
Click to expand...


Well spotted. Seems an extraordinary tactful statement. No mention of Dersingham Bog National Nature Reserve being part of the Sandringham Royal Estate. Although played down its great to know that Natural England haven't been instructed to cover it up .....just yet. Hopefully the employee who reported it won't have to drive through any tunnels tonight.
 
rozinante said:
Here you go Kathy:-

"Statement from Natural England

A member of Natural England's staff, along with two members of the public, saw two hen harriers being shot on Dersingham Bog National Nature Reserve in Norfolk, on the evening of 24 October 2007. Natural England is shocked that two of England's rarest birds have been killed in this way.

Natural England staff are currently supporting the Norfolk Police in every way they can to investigate the incident. Please may the results be agood result.

How far is Dersingham Bog National Nature Reserve in Norfolk from the Sandringham Estate. Love to know the milage.

Natural England's Hen Harrier Recovery Project, running since 2001, cites illegal persecution as the greatest single factor when accounting for the birds' low population and poor breeding success."


http://www.naturalengland.org.uk/press/news2007/251007.htm
Click to expand...

Hi rozinante

Sorry edited my last post a bit so it may not go along with your quote here.

Thanks for your reply here. I think I am getting the gist of who Natural England's Wardens are? I just assume things here sometimes, as we all do ;)

I really hope that all issues between all parties are resolved in relation with the issues of the shootings of the Harriers come to a conclusion no matter what happens. :t:

It just shows that Hen Harriers are bearing the brunt of some brain-dead people who want to go out of their way to hurt BoP'S on purpose is beyond my comprehension here

Can I ask out of the blue here what is the status of the Hen Harriers throughout the UK country top to bottom here.? How many of HH'S exist in all the UK in all now?

Interested here?

Anymore information please let me know here!!

Regards
Kathy
 
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Peewit said:
Can I ask out of the blue here what is the status of the Hen Harriers throughout the UK country top to bottom here.? How many of HH'S exist in all the UK in all now?
Click to expand...


The most recent breeding survey (2004) found:

Scotland: 633 pairs
Northern Ireland: 63 pairs
Wales: 43 pairs
England: 10 pairs

Also 57 pairs in the Isle of Man
 
Hi Everybody,

Please excuse some foreign ignorance, but I’m having a hard time understanding this thread, as I have with other ‘game warden’ threads. I can’t understand why raptors in residence on any estate is an issue.
First, wouldn’t pheasant be a bit big for Hen harriers to view as prey? And if not, wouldn’t it be easy to breed pheasant(s?). I would think that with a few covered aviaries, enough pheasant could be continually bred and released to cover the needs of all UK BOP and hunters alike.
I would think any land owner would be thrilled to have diversity on their ‘patch’, especially when it involves such scare birds. Couldn’t land owners make money during the non-hunting season by charging an entrance fee to birders. It would then behoove them to cultivate diversity.
 
I believe the most recent figure for last year puts the English population at 15 pairs, hence the BBC's use of this figure for the whole of the UK.

It's difficult for the poor souls to understand that the UK and England aren't the same thing. They have a hard enough time realising that London and England aren't the same thing without that added complication.

"Scotland? Where's that? Oh, we've got BBC Scotland to deal with all that, We don't bother ourselves knowing that stuff."

Wales? That's a unit of area measurement used in news reports when trying to convey the size of a geographic area that is larger than their other unit (The Isle of Wight). Wales was used to great effect during the Falklands Conflict to explain the size of the Falklands to the many (including some at the BBC) who thought at the time that Argentina had invaded somewhere off the west coast of Scotland (Where's that? - see above).

Northern Ireland is used in BBC weather forecasts to tell us where the rain is.
 
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Peregrinator said:
Hi Everybody,

Please excuse some foreign ignorance, but I’m having a hard time understanding this thread, as I have with other ‘game warden’ threads. I can’t understand why raptors in residence on any estate is an issue.
First, wouldn’t pheasant be a bit big for Hen harriers to view as prey? And if not, wouldn’t it be easy to breed pheasant(s?). I would think that with a few covered aviaries, enough pheasant could be continually bred and released to cover the needs of all UK BOP and hunters alike.
I would think any land owner would be thrilled to have diversity on their ‘patch’, especially when it involves such scare birds. Couldn’t land owners make money during the non-hunting season by charging an entrance fee to birders. It would then behoove them to cultivate diversity.
Click to expand...

Pheasants are actually bred, purely for sport on these estates for certain people to shoot, especially if they have plenty of money to pay for the 'privilege'. If anything is likely to threaten this income, then out come the rifles. These royal workers are purely using their status as royal staff to shoot regardless of rarity in my opinion, and consider themselves untouchable. Funny enough, from the people rearing the pheasants to the people who pay big bucks to shoot them actually consider themselves superior individuals because they shoot, the rest of us are tree or bunny huggers.....:C

Sorry if I'm ranting a bit on this thread, just have very strong feelings about these individuals.
 
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Capercaillie71 said:
The most recent breeding survey (2004) found:

Scotland: 633 pairs
Northern Ireland: 63 pairs
Wales: 43 pairs
England: 10 pairs

Also 57 pairs in the Isle of Man
Click to expand...

Hi Capercaillie - Thank you for those figures. Gives the idea what HH'S exist now.

Peregrinator said:
Hi Everybody,

Please excuse some foreign ignorance, but I’m having a hard time understanding this thread, as I have with other ‘game warden’ threads. I can’t understand why raptors in residence on any estate is an issue.
First, wouldn’t pheasant be a bit big for Hen harriers to view as prey? And if not, wouldn’t it be easy to breed pheasant(s?). I would think that with a few covered aviaries, enough pheasant could be continually bred and released to cover the needs of all UK BOP and hunters alike.
I would think any land owner would be thrilled to have diversity on their ‘patch’, especially when it involves such scare birds. Couldn’t land owners make money during the non-hunting season by charging an entrance fee to birders. It would then behoove them to cultivate diversity.
Click to expand...

Hi Peregrinator

I understand what you mean here. It puzzles me too that BoP's seen to be considered a threat to gamekeepers. The same thing was mentioned on the news about Gamekeepers persecuting the Hen Harriers and that is why they where shot.
As you say it is being proud of the wildlife diversity that should be taken first and foremost. You can replace a pheasant, but not a BoP so easily.

I do understand that gamekeeping is big business, and it creates a lot of jobs for people in the local community. Deer hunting is another big business. Another part of the issue that it is all part of the land management so that wildlife thrives. I have heard this being said by the hunting gentry so often I am passed the point of believing it anymore. Well that goes without comment here :eek!:
Funnily, I thought it did not include shooting and snaring other animals. Foxes, Badgers etc....So that is part of the issue too.

A lot of the issues relate to money, and yes it would be a good idea to think of other money making schemes to boost up the economy. Good idea.:t:

Regards
Kathy

Alan Seaton said:
I believe the most recent figure for last year puts the English population at 15 pairs, hence the BBC's use of this figure for the whole of the UK.

It's difficult for the poor souls to understand that the UK and England aren't the same thing. They have a hard enough time realising that London and England aren't the same thing without that added complication.

"Scotland? Where's that? Oh, we've got BBC Scotland to deal with all that, We don't bother ourselves knowing that stuff."

Wales? That's a unit of area measurement used in news reports when trying to convey the size of a geographic area that is larger than their other unit (The Isle of Wight). Wales was used to great effect during the Falklands Conflict to explain the size of the Falklands to the many (including some at the BBC) who thought at the time that Argentina had invaded somewhere off the west coast of Scotland (Where's that? - see above).

Northern Ireland is used in BBC weather forecasts to tell us where the rain is.
Click to expand...

Hi Alan

Just is how how different parts of the UK operate. I could see gamekeeping being a huge revenue in Scotland because of the land mass. A lot of the countryside is open for BoP'S to live out their lives in peace.

Since I moved to England myself this year, I have found to my dismay that BoP's are more heavily persecuted. More people more guns or so it appears.

England has a bigger population so increases the chance of BoP's being shot.

Alan Seaton said:
Those "rifles" are shotguns
Click to expand...

Yes, double barrel ones too :eek!:
 
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