Join for FREE
It only takes a minute!
Zeiss - Always on the lookout for something special – Shop now

Welcome to BirdForum.
BirdForum is the net's largest birding community, dedicated to wild birds and birding, and is absolutely FREE! You are most welcome to register for an account, which allows you to take part in lively discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.

Warblers Öland, Sweden, middle May 2019

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread
Old Wednesday 12th June 2019, 05:46   #1
Aladdin
Registered User
BF Supporter 2019

 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 365
Warblers Öland, Sweden, middle May 2019

Dear members and bird watchers

Warblers can make me crazy and I spotted several in Sweden, the ciffchaff is pretty easy if you see the leg. Only warbler in Sweden with black legs, at least this is what I have learned

Öland Sweden in the middle of May

Picture #1 - Cant really see the legs, but I have identified this as a Willow Warbler even though it looks like a chiffchaff with the black streak through the eye.
But I look at the eye ring, more yellowish when I have compared pic between the birds. Also more yellow gape, or there is something yellow between the bill and the eye´. Should I stay with Willow Warbler for this one?

Picture #2 – Due to the bright colour I have identified this to be a Wood Warbler. Should I stay with this identity?

Picture #3 – A very dull bird, but looks to a Willow Warbler with some problem with the plumage, look at eye rings, not a full ring. Moulting in to breeding plummage?

Picture #4 and #5 – The same bird. A Chiffchaff? Very dark leg, but not totally black. But less yellowish than the Willow Warbler and thus I have identified it as a Chiffchaff. Correct?

Kind regards and happy birding
Aladdin
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	14-May-2019---Willow-Warbler.jpg
Views:	64
Size:	105.0 KB
ID:	697526  Click image for larger version

Name:	16-May-2019--Wood-Warbler.jpg
Views:	75
Size:	77.7 KB
ID:	697527  Click image for larger version

Name:	15-May-2019-Willow-Warbler.jpg
Views:	67
Size:	82.4 KB
ID:	697528  Click image for larger version

Name:	16-May-2019---Chiffchaff.jpg
Views:	83
Size:	109.4 KB
ID:	697529  Click image for larger version

Name:	16-May-2019---Chiffchaff2.jpg
Views:	57
Size:	118.8 KB
ID:	697530  

Aladdin is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2018 2019 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Wednesday 12th June 2019, 07:03   #2
KenM
Registered User
 
KenM's Avatar

 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: London
Posts: 10,995
Image 2. is a Wood Warbler, and the rest look like Willow Warblers apart from the last bird which is either Willow or Chiff Chaff.

Cheers
KenM is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 12th June 2019, 07:43   #3
Fat Paul Scholes
My real name is Mark Lewis

 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Aberdeen
Posts: 2,606
Number 4 is chiffchaff - emargination on p6
__________________
My website: https://lewissparky.wixsite.com/website
Fat Paul Scholes is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 12th June 2019, 09:42   #4
KenM
Registered User
 
KenM's Avatar

 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: London
Posts: 10,995
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat Paul Scholes View Post
Number 4 is chiffchaff - emargination on p6
Quite right!
KenM is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 12th June 2019, 13:43   #5
Aladdin
Registered User
BF Supporter 2019

 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 365
Quote:
Originally Posted by KenM View Post
Image 2. is a Wood Warbler, and the rest look like Willow Warblers apart from the last bird which is either Willow or Chiff Chaff.

Cheers
Thank you very much!!

If you don´t mind, do you have an idea why the willow pic #3 have the dull plumage comparing to willow pic #1 and broken eye ring?

Kind regards and happy birding
Aladdin
Aladdin is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2018 2019 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Wednesday 12th June 2019, 13:46   #6
Aladdin
Registered User
BF Supporter 2019

 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 365
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat Paul Scholes View Post
Number 4 is chiffchaff - emargination on p6
Thank you very much Fat Paul Scholes

As I thought, but I identified the bird with the dark legs. If you have time and have short description, what you mean by emargination on p6?

Thank you again and happy birding
Aladdin
Aladdin is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2018 2019 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Wednesday 12th June 2019, 14:01   #7
KenM
Registered User
 
KenM's Avatar

 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: London
Posts: 10,995
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aladdin View Post
Thank you very much!!

If you don´t mind, do you have an idea why the willow pic #3 have the dull plumage comparing to willow pic #1 and broken eye ring?

Kind regards and happy birding
Aladdin
Willow Warbler and Chiff Chaff overlap cosmetically however their respective wings are different...with CC having shorter wings, ie the exposed primaries being c1/2 the length of the overlying (3) tertials, with WW the primaries should equal the length of the overlying tertials.

Cheers
KenM is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 12th June 2019, 14:33   #8
BobbitWorm45
Registered User

 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: England
Posts: 223
In Sweden there is a north/south split with ssp acredula more prevalent in the north. This ssp is much duller, greyer in appearance than trochilus. There may be some overlap where you where or where you took these pics.
BobbitWorm45 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 12th June 2019, 15:44   #9
Fat Paul Scholes
My real name is Mark Lewis

 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Aberdeen
Posts: 2,606
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aladdin View Post
Thank you very much Fat Paul Scholes

As I thought, but I identified the bird with the dark legs. If you have time and have short description, what you mean by emargination on p6?

Thank you again and happy birding
Aladdin
No problem Aladdin,

Some of the primaries (longest flight feathers) of many birds have ‘indentations’ on the inside edge (notches - only really visible in the hand) or on the outside edge (emarginations). In good photos you can sometimes see these emarginations, and in some very similar species these are really useful ID features.

One way in which chiffchaff and willow warbler differ is that the chiffchaff has one more emargination. Willow warblers have them on the primaries numbered 3, 4 and 5, with chiffchaff having the additional one on primary number 6 (p6).

In passerines, the primaries are numbered from 1 to 10, starting at the outermost feather. However, most of the time you can’t see the outermost primary as it is very short. So, when counting the primaries we start with p2.

There’s a nice illustration here: https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/north...ylloscopy/amp/
__________________
My website: https://lewissparky.wixsite.com/website
Fat Paul Scholes is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 12th June 2019, 16:02   #10
Fat Paul Scholes
My real name is Mark Lewis

 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Aberdeen
Posts: 2,606
I’ve added a red arrow pointing at the emargination on p6 on your pic
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	51C7762C-88A8-48EF-910E-610BC241B907.jpeg
Views:	54
Size:	250.7 KB
ID:	697550  
__________________
My website: https://lewissparky.wixsite.com/website
Fat Paul Scholes is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 13th June 2019, 00:26   #11
Aladdin
Registered User
BF Supporter 2019

 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 365
Quote:
Originally Posted by KenM View Post
Willow Warbler and Chiff Chaff overlap cosmetically however their respective wings are different...with CC having shorter wings, ie the exposed primaries being c1/2 the length of the overlying (3) tertials, with WW the primaries should equal the length of the overlying tertials.

Cheers
Thank you very much!

I will compare a few birds to see if I can train to see the difference in this way as you are mostly seen the wings.

The black leg ID is good, but most of the time it is very hard to see the colours of the legs.

Thank you again

Kind regards and happy birding
Aladdin
Aladdin is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2018 2019 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Thursday 13th June 2019, 00:34   #12
Aladdin
Registered User
BF Supporter 2019

 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 365
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbitWorm45 View Post
In Sweden there is a north/south split with ssp acredula more prevalent in the north. This ssp is much duller, greyer in appearance than trochilus. There may be some overlap where you where or where you took these pics.
Hello BobbitWorms45

Thank you, this was interesting. Öland is actually a world famous island. In the Baltic sea and there is a lot of birds stopping there on their way to breeding in the very north of Europe

I was lucky to see a Bluethroat that only nest in the very north stopping on Öland coming from Africa.

Thank you again

Kind regards and happy birding
Aladdin
Aladdin is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2018 2019 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Thursday 13th June 2019, 00:57   #13
Aladdin
Registered User
BF Supporter 2019

 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 365
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat Paul Scholes View Post
No problem Aladdin,

Some of the primaries (longest flight feathers) of many birds have ‘indentations’ on the inside edge (notches - only really visible in the hand) or on the outside edge (emarginations). In good photos you can sometimes see these emarginations, and in some very similar species these are really useful ID features.

One way in which chiffchaff and willow warbler differ is that the chiffchaff has one more emargination. Willow warblers have them on the primaries numbered 3, 4 and 5, with chiffchaff having the additional one on primary number 6 (p6).

In passerines, the primaries are numbered from 1 to 10, starting at the outermost feather. However, most of the time you can’t see the outermost primary as it is very short. So, when counting the primaries we start with p2.

There’s a nice illustration here: https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/north...ylloscopy/amp/
Thank you very much!!

Great web page and I have added it to my favourites and next time I will use it trying to see the difference.

I study your post looking at the pictures, and I can see the difference. But to do this in the field? I will practice with pictures, but they are not so easy to get on pictures, moving about all the time.

Thank you again

Kind regards and happy birding
Aladdin
Aladdin is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2018 2019 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Thursday 13th June 2019, 01:10   #14
Aladdin
Registered User
BF Supporter 2019

 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 365
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat Paul Scholes View Post
I’ve added a red arrow pointing at the emargination on p6 on your pic
Cheers Mark

Visited you web page and you are taking great pictures. I also took the opportunity to down load the Audacity manual for birders, THANKS!

I have started to record birds as well and and this manual will come in handy as I use Audacity

Thanks
Aladdin
Aladdin is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2018 2019 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Advertisement
Reply


Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Öland, Sweden 12 May 2019 Aladdin Bird Identification Q&A 25 Sunday 2nd June 2019 08:38
Arctic Tern - Öland, Sweden May 2019 Aladdin Bird Identification Q&A 10 Thursday 30th May 2019 14:36
Lark Sweden Öland Id if possible :) fredwille Bird Identification Q&A 6 Wednesday 3rd October 2012 20:43
Harrier ID, Öland, Sweden anders Bird Identification Q&A 12 Saturday 1st May 2010 08:37
Beautiful Öland, Sweden Enji Vacational Trip Reports 6 Friday 12th June 2009 09:55



Fatbirder's Top 1000 Birding Websites

Help support BirdForum

Page generated in 0.19246197 seconds with 29 queries
All times are GMT. The time now is 06:09.