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Minor on cabanisii / cabanidis / cabanisi / Cabanisia

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Old Monday 27th April 2020, 10:05   #1
Taphrospilus
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Minor on cabanisii / cabanidis / cabanisi / Cabanisia

I was wondering where Jean Louis Bennoit Cabanis derived from in German Wikipedia until I read the footnote 2. I haven't seen the full death registration but the claim seems to be correct if I look here p. 15 of 131.
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Old Monday 27th April 2020, 10:34   #2
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Martin, note, that there's no "Bennoit" in the entry for "Cabanis, Jean Louis" in the normally trustworthy (Neue) Deutsche Biographie, here ... which has his Father as "Benoit-Jean (1774–1838)", and no "Louis" on the latter ...

Keep digging!

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Old Monday 27th April 2020, 16:25   #3
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I am wondering if a Sterberegister = death register (second link) of the City of Berlin/Friedrichshagen is less trustworthy than the (Neue) Deutsche Biographie. But I tried to contact the Landesarchiv for the full record. We will see if they answer in times of Covid-19.

Last edited by Taphrospilus : Monday 27th April 2020 at 17:32.
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Old Tuesday 28th April 2020, 07:18   #4
l_raty
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FWIW, the genealogical information of the Deutsche Hugenotten-Gesellschaft seems to agree with (Erwin Stresemann in) the Neue Deutsche Biographie.
https://www.hugenotten.de/genealogie...tter.php#BM425
Quote:
425 Jean Louis CABANIS, Dr. phil., Prof. Geboren am 08.03.1816 in Berlin, 1. Custos am Kgl. zoolog. Museum. Sohn von Benoit Jean CABANIS (siehe 422) und unbekannt FAHLAND (siehe 423).
Kirchliche Trauung mit unbekannt RINALDI (siehe 426).
Aus dieser Ehe stammen:
1. Jean Pierre (siehe 427).
2. Jean Charles (siehe 429).
3. Olympie Charlotte Marie (siehe 431).
4. Agnes Antoinette Sara (siehe 433).
5. Berthe Louise Hélène (siehe 434).
6. Jean Etienne (siehe 436).
7. Jean George (siehe 437).
Note that:
- The given names of Cabanis' mother on the Wikipedia page ("Auguste Marie Charlotte") also differ strikingly from those in the Neue Deutsche Biographie ("Maria Luise").
- "Benoît" (in principle with a circumflex, but this might presumably have been lost in a German context) is a French given name; an alternative, now obsolete spelling is "Benoist"; "Bennoit" (with a double n) is not a spelling I had seen before.

-----------
Side issue -- note also in the above: "3. Olympie Charlotte Marie (siehe 431)." -- https://www.hugenotten.de/genealogie...tter.php#BM431 :
Quote:
431 Olympie Charlotte Marie CABANIS, geboren am 15.07.1856 in Berlin, Tochter von Jean Louis CABANIS (siehe 425) und unbekannt RINALDI (siehe 426).
Kirchliche Trauung mit unbekannt REICHENOW (siehe 432).
She is the dedicatee of Paradisea maria Reichenow 1894. Currently in the Key as:
Quote:
Maria Reichenow née Cabanis (fl. 1890) wife of German ornithologist Prof. Anton Reichenow (Paradisaea apoda x Paradisaea guilelmi).

Last edited by l_raty : Tuesday 28th April 2020 at 08:47. Reason: deleted confusing word inherited from an initially differently worded sensence -- thanks Björn.
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Old Tuesday 28th April 2020, 08:58   #5
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But? Regarding ...

maria as in:
• the hybrid "Paradisea maria" REICHENOW 1894 (here), no explanation, no dedication (at least not from what I can tell) ...

Laurent, how do you/we know it's aimed at "Olympie Charlotte Marie", the Tochter (Daughter, born 1856) of Cabanis (equally the wife of Reichenow), and not for any other possible Marie/Maria candidate?

Just curious ...

Björn
---

Last edited by Calalp : Tuesday 28th April 2020 at 09:21. Reason: typo
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Old Tuesday 28th April 2020, 08:59   #6
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Just FYI as well Herman Schalow (also in the key) here wrote an obituary and/or hold a speech in honor for Jean Cabanis.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calalp View Post
Laurent, how do you know it's aimed at "Olympie Charlotte Marie", the Tochter (Daughter, born 1856) of Cabanis, and not for any other possible Marie/Maria candidates?
Seems a little bit picky. Why should Reichenow in the year 1894 not honor his wife which he married in 1878?

Last edited by Taphrospilus : Tuesday 28th April 2020 at 09:12.
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Old Tuesday 28th April 2020, 09:34   #7
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German Wiki for Anton Reichenow gives us another piece (if relevant?) about his wife: "1878 heiratete er Marie Cabanis, die älteste Tochter von Jean Cabanis. Sie starb 1940. ..." (here, bottom part of text Leben und Wirken).

Useful? I don't know.

/B
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Old Tuesday 28th April 2020, 09:44   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Taphrospilus View Post
...
Seems a little bit picky. Why should Reichenow in the year 1894 not honor his wife which he married in 1878?
"Picky" could be my middle name!

Though, why should he? Hundreds, thousands of wifes has passed through ornithology without being noticed. With no dedication I simply found/find it hard to say that she "... is the dedicatee of Paradisea maria", this far I'd say she most likely is. It's a minor difference, yes, but still a difference.

However, the main reason for my "picky" comment, was that Laurent might, could show us an additional reference (clearly pointing at her). Nothing else.

/B
--

Last edited by Calalp : Tuesday 28th April 2020 at 09:49.
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Old Tuesday 28th April 2020, 10:19   #9
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If I look here it might be worth to look into...

Quote:
Die französische Colonie (Jahrg. 1891; No. 6 S. 99-100 and No. 1 S.9)
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Old Tuesday 28th April 2020, 10:52   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calalp View Post
However, the main reason for my "picky" comment, was that Laurent might, could show us an additional reference (clearly pointing at her). Nothing else.
No, I'm afraid I have no additional evidence. I'd probably better have written "assumed" or "accepted" dedicatee.
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Old Tuesday 28th April 2020, 11:04   #11
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At least she was interested in birds as here and here she translated parts of Yarrell's History of British Birds.
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Old Tuesday 28th April 2020, 12:15   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Taphrospilus View Post
If I look here it might be worth to look into...
Quote:
Die französische Colonie (Jahrg. 1891; No. 6 S. 99-100 and No. 1 S.9)
Google Books has this journal [here], in US-only access.
Pp. 99-100 give a short bio of Cabanis, published on the occasion that: "Am 4. April feierte Herr Professor Jean Cabanis, geboren 8. März 1816 (vergl. Stammbaum, Seite 9), sein 50jähriges Dienstjubiläum." But this is mainly an account of his career with few personal details. The only given name cited there is 'Jean'.

Contrary to Schalow's indication in his Gedächtnisrede, the Stammbaum doesn't appear to have been published in this journal, but as part of a separate volume:
Béringuier R [ed]. 1887. Die Stammbäume der Mitglieder der französischen Colonie in Berlin. Verlag des Vereins für die Geschichte Berlins, Berlin.
You can see this [here]. Or [here]. At first sight, the info here and on the Deutsche Hugenotten-Gesellschaft website (which I quoted above) seems identical.
(Die französische Colonie, also edited by R Béringuier, was the "Organ des Deutschen Hugenotten-Vereins"; and "Deutscher Hugenotten-Verein" appears to have been an earlier name for what is now the Deutsche Hugenotten-Gesellschaft. I.e., it seems that these two sources are actually only one.)

Last edited by l_raty : Tuesday 28th April 2020 at 14:26.
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Old Friday 22nd May 2020, 16:05   #13
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See attached his official death record.

Jean Louis Bennoit??? Cabanis might be correct. But if I compare the word Berlin I doubt the B in Bennoit is really a B (presumably a G) or the name was Gernoit?
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Cabanis.pdf (1.84 MB, 16 views)

Last edited by Taphrospilus : Saturday 23rd May 2020 at 13:40.
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Old Saturday 23rd May 2020, 09:29   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Taphrospilus View Post
But if I compare the word Berlin I doubt the B in Bennoit is a really B.
It seems rather frequent, in this type of older hand-written German documents, that two types of writings -- Deutsche Schrift and a more "usual Latin" writing style -- are used simultaneously in a single text.

"Jean Louis Bennoit" is written in typical Deutsche Schrift. The first letter of "Bennoit" looks like an upper-case B to me, e.g.: https://i.pinimg.com/originals/ff/5b...467759e837.jpg.
"Berlin" is in the more "usual Latin" writing (see how the 'e' is written), so a comparison to "Bennoit" may not be really meaningful. This writing style seems consistently used here for city names (Friedrichshagen, Berlin), but not street names; last names (Cabanis, Frenzel, Fahland), but not given names; and was also used for the name of the month (Februar); all the rest is in Deutsche Schrift.

The duality is particularly striking in the address -- "Friedrichshagen Friedrichstraße 103" : the two words start identically, but they are written completely differently. (I have little doubt that most people over here would read the first word without any problem, but would be completely puzzled by the second one.)

Last edited by l_raty : Saturday 23rd May 2020 at 10:12.
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Old Saturday 23rd May 2020, 10:33   #15
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Herr Professor Jean Cabanis

Does the (official) Death record tell us anything regarding the exact date, of when Jean Louis Bennoit Cabanis died?

Is it still: "† 20.2.1906 Friedrichshagen bei Berlin", ... ?

And does it say anything about the cause of Death?

/B
-

Last edited by Calalp : Saturday 23rd May 2020 at 10:38. Reason: bolds
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Old Saturday 23rd May 2020, 11:29   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calalp View Post
Is it still: "† 20.2.1906 Friedrichshagen bei Berlin", ... ?
"zu Friedrichshagen Friedrichstraße 103 am zwanzigsten Februar des Jarhes tausend neunhundert sechs Nachsmittags um zwölf ein halb Uhr".
= at Friedrichshagen, Friedrichstraße 103, on the twentieth of February of the year thousand nine hundred and six in the afternoon at half past twelve.

I see nothing that I would interpret as stating the cause of the death, but there are admittedly a few words that I don't find easy to read.
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Old Saturday 23rd May 2020, 13:45   #17
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I wouldn't write Friedrichshagen bei Berlin. I think it is a part of Berlin like Köpenick etc. You can see it here.

Last edited by Taphrospilus : Saturday 23rd May 2020 at 20:07.
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Old Saturday 23rd May 2020, 13:50   #18
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Thanks, Laurent!

That'll do, that will be enough. I've got all that I need (and far more) on the Great Cabanis (for my MS, that is, I certainly don't need to know exactly what caused his Death).

One again thanks (also to Martin, for the proof/Death record itself)!



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Old Saturday 23rd May 2020, 13:54   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Taphrospilus View Post
I wouldn't wirite Friedrichshagen bei Berlin. I think it is a part of Berlin like Köpenick etc. You can see it here.
Martin, you can "wirite" it however you feel (in German), what do I know?

I just quoted (Neue) Deutsche Biographie (link in #2).

/B
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Old Saturday 23rd May 2020, 14:24   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Taphrospilus View Post
I wouldn't wirite Friedrichshagen bei Berlin. I think it is a part of Berlin like Köpenick etc. You can see it here.
It became part of Berlin in 1920 -- if I understand things at https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berlin-Friedrichshagen correctly...?

Googling for "Friedrichshagen bei Berlin" produces a lot of hits in (older) German texts, but I'm not sure that "bei Berlin", in any of these, is really a part of the name of the place -- it could as easily be a mere indication that the place known as "Friedrichshagen" is/was near ("bei" in German) Berlin. There is no "bei Berlin" on the death certificate.

Last edited by l_raty : Saturday 23rd May 2020 at 14:39.
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Old Saturday 23rd May 2020, 20:19   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calalp View Post
That'll do, that will be enough. I've got all that I need (and far more) on the Great Cabanis (for my MS, that is, I certainly don't need to know exactly what caused his Death).
Here:

Quote:
Er übersiedelte nach Friedrichshagen bei Berlin, wo er wenige Tage vor Vollendung seines neunzigsten Lebensjahres am 21. Februar nach kurzem Krankenlager verschied.
Means he died after a short illness. And 89 years is indeed a handsome age. RIP.
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Old Sunday 24th May 2020, 06:51   #22
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"... am 21. Februar" ?!?



Did he die "um zwölf ein halb Uhr", half on hour passed midnight?

/B
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Old Sunday 24th May 2020, 08:46   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calalp View Post
"... am 21. Februar" ?!?
The death certificate itself is dated "21. Februar 1906", which is the date on which his death was declared to the authorities. (By "die Frau Professor Sara Frenzel geborene Cabanis", residing at the same address as "der Königliche Professor außer Dienst Jean Louis Bennoit Cabanis" himself -- presumably his daughter "4. Agnes Antoinette Sara" in the Deutsche Hugenotten-Gesellschaft data, in post #4 above?)

We have seen events associated to the date of their declaration a number of times in the past. (Children born "hier" = yesterday, in French birth records, etc.)

Last edited by l_raty : Sunday 24th May 2020 at 10:16.
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Old Sunday 24th May 2020, 14:47   #24
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As it took me some time to figure out a couple of words, here is a complete transcription of the death certificate, as to avoid that someone else might have to repeat the work. I think it's more or less correct -- but maybe Martin can check it to be sure ?
The printed part of the text is in bold; the handwritten part is in regular fonts.
----------

Nr. 19.
Friedrichshagen am 21. Februar 1906.

Vor dem unterzeichneten Standesbeamten erschien heute, der Persönlichkeit nach bekannt, die Frau Professor Sara Frenzel geborene Cabanis wohnhaft in Friedrichshagen Friedrichstraße 103 und zeigte an, daß der Königliche Professor außer Dienst Jean Louis Bennoit Cabanis, 89 Jahr alt, evangelischer Religion, wohnhaft in Friedrichshagen Friedrichstraße 103 geboren zu Berlin, Witwer, Sohn des Tapetenfabrikanten Jean Louis Bennoit Cabanis und seiner Ehefrau Auguste Marie Charlotte geborenen Fahland, beide verstorben und beide zuletzt wohnhaft in Berlin, zu Friedrichshagen Friedrichstraße 103 am zwanzigsten Februar des Jarhes tausend neunhundert sechs Nachsmittags um zwölf ein halb Uhr verstorben sei. Die Anzeigende erklärte, von diesem Sterbefalle aus eigener Wissenschaft unterrichtet zu sein.

Vorgelesen, genehmigt und unterschrieben
Sara Frenzel geboren Cabanis.

Der Standesbeamte.
Zu Vertretung
Lange.
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Old Monday 25th May 2020, 09:52   #25
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Thanks Laurent, ... it was as I assumed (just wanted to be sure/safe).

Also (maybe) noteworthy (if nothing else, simply to put things right); is the (UK) Obituary in The Ibis XXXII (July, 1806, here), in which we're told:
Quote:
JEAN LOUIS CABANIS, an Honorary Member of the Union, ... [ending with the phrase:] ... . Cabanis died after a short illness at his own residence, on the 20th of February last, at the age of ninety years and eleven months.
This Obituary (where his third Given name, "Bennoit", wasn't mentioned at all) was apparently based on information "sent to us by Herr Herman Schalow" [i.e. the one who wrote the Obituary/Memorial speech/Gedächtnisrede of Jean Cabanis in Journal für Ornithologie, where he was mentioned as "Jean Louis Cabanis" (only) in text, with the claim that he'd died: "... am 21. Februar"]?!? Something, clearly must have made Philip Lutley Sclater to change Schalow's "am 21 Februar" into "the 20th of February". But note that Sclater (for some unknown reason!?) wrote the Birth year of Cabanis as "1815"(!) contrary to Schalow's "1816" [the latter all in line with what's told in (Neue) Deutsche Biographie, German Wiki, etc., etc.]... !? Which, of course, caused Sclater's (apparently erroneous) conclusion above, regarding the final age of Cabanis.

Also see the (US) Obituary notice, in The Auk, vol. XXIII (No.2, April 1906), in "Notes and News", probably written be either the Editor J. A. Allen, or F. A. Chapman. (here). Cabanis was/is also listed on p. xxxi, in the List of "Deceased Members" (here), as:
Quote:
CABANIS, JEAN .................................... Feb. 20, 1906.
This far, I will use the latter Death date (either; ... at the age of 89, alt. in his 90th year, or; just about two weeks short of his 90th Birthday).

Serenity rules! Or?

Björn
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