Captive Breeding of Derbyan Parakeet - your thoughts on this option (1 Viewer)

Thanks to Roland (Jiujiu) the MacK China guides were ordered - from dangdangwang.com - and they came today. They were at a bargain bumper discounted price of 60RMB/book including post - and have exactly the same plates as the mega-expensive English copy. Pretty useful for birders to buy just for the plate section!!!!!
Anyways we're off starting a trip tomorrow, so when out west these guides will be given away to any bird interested locals we happen to meet.

Hi there
I just came back from Danba, but because of some other reasons, I had almost no time to take care of our Parakeet. Thus, I didn't see one. But I checked parts of the habitat. It is mostly of dense mixed forest and logging took place in only a few valleys. In order to get more information (and hopefully to get the bird as well) I will leave for this place again tomorrow.
So far some picures of the habitat:
the main valleys (Dadu He, Xiaojin He and Jinchuan He) are dry and almost without dense vegetation, no good for forest birds... Therefore they make kind of natural borders between habitats.
the villages offer crops and heeps of walnut trees, that is what our Parakeets feed on in summer.
the side valleys are of good vegetation reaching from 2400masl up to the timber line (4000masl). This is probably the range where they live in general.

Finally I am back from my trip to Danba and have some interesting news on the existence and future of our Derbyan Parakeet.

At first, I unfortunately couldn’t meet them “personally” as they were all high upon the mountain ridges hidden in old tree’s holes and concerned about their reproduction. But I had the good luck to make acquaintance with a professional egg collector who explained all the details you have to know in this kind of business.

My efforts generally were focused on following activities:
- Interviews with the villagers in the Maoniu Valley
- Habitat and environment survey
- General bird survey
- Discussion with the Wildlife Bureau of the Danba Forestry Department

Breeding habitat mainly can be found in three big valley systems within Danba County: Donggu Township (with Maoniu Valley and Shachong Valley), Banshanmen Valley between Xiaojin and Danba County and in Bian’er/Dandong Valley. Nests are built in tree holes of old or dead trees between 3400 and 4000masl. Preferably trees along ridges or above cliffs are chosen. They start breeding at around end of May and incubate for ca. 20 days.

The habitat in Maoniu Valley – the place I went to – seemed quite OK, though there were big logging activities going on in the 90’s: In some valleys conifer forest (above 3400masl) was logged to about 90%, but – as Sid already mentioned before in this thread – a line of old trees survived at the upper edge of those logging areas. Also, enough old trees remained untouched in higher and inaccessible locations – mostly mountain ridges. These trees are essential for breeding. New plantations of pine trees apparently offer enough food (pine seeds) for the cold season. Walnut trees near the villages supply for their summer meals. This actually has always been a big competition with walnut tree owners, during the time when the parakeets were still in high numbers, decades ago.


The villagers were all aware of the good reputation of their area for the high “parakeet production output” and that “their” birds learn to talk easiest. However, most of them weren’t and still are not involved in collecting and trading of parakeets. Collectors mostly come from other places nearby or from bigger townships. Well, it doesn’t need very many people to exterminate a bird population, if you just steal all (or most of) the eggs year by year.

They also are aware of the (cultural) value of this bird and are eager to participate in conservation. But, as common as everywhere in China, nobody criticises or stops other people from doing anything bad as far as it does not concern themselves or their family directly. So, protection only takes place verbally but not practically.

Another motivation for protection could be tourism. It sounds reasonable that a big parakeet population would be able to attract tourists in summer/autumn, when they can be seen gathering for their walnut feasts.

A tentative question about their potential participation in captive breeding in their village was responded with acceptance and welcome.

Egg collectors know the places and trees where the birds are nesting. It is easy to find out, if you invest a little bit of time and courage. Latter needed to get above the drop-offs where the breeding trees grow. The collector told me that the male calls the female at 8am, 12:30 and 6pm three times a day during the incubation period. He just sits on the opposite tree and calls her to come out to get food. This is the chance for the collector to identify the right hole in the tree. A few days later (beginning of June) he comes back at night and takes the eggs. Back home he hatches them on an electrical stove. After the chicks hatched he feeds them for about 6 weeks before he sells them directly to the bird market (in Chengdu and other places).

This way it is almost impossible for villagers as well as for forestry workers to stop the collectors from stealing. A rope and some eggs easily fit in a backpack and are almost impossible to discover. Additionally, in case they would identify a collector, they have to admit that he is related to a family of their village, and they don’t want to disturb their village peace.

According to this conclusion, the collector unmistakably answered my question which method he would recommend to successfully protect this bird from poaching: A person has to stand underneath the tree 24h a day and 7days a week until the chicks have fledged.

A healthy chick can be sold for 800 – 1000 Yuan. Assuming 4 eggs per nest, this is enough to dare the risk of falling from a cliff or a half-rotten branch.

The present state of the local parakeet population seems to be critical: The guy I was talking to estimated 20-30 birds left in the Maoniu Valley and he thought that this could be its last year. Villagers confirmed this number as they are rarely seen and only in small flocks (10-20 birds) in autumn and winter. Many haven’t seen this bird for years.

The Forestry Department was concerned but confident. Last year they counted about 100 birds in the whole of Danba County and recently assigned eight forestry workers to particularly look after illegal poachers. In their eyes, there is hope. The person in charge also welcomed the idea of captive breeding in order to oust wild birds from the market and thus make poaching unattractive.

However, there are a lot of formalities to be done in order to achieve the certificate that allows captive breeding of protected animals:
- An adequate site with proper land usage certificate
- Guarantee of professional veterinarian assistance
- Purpose and benefits have to be laid out and certificated
- And of course the right amount of funding has to be proven….


Pictures below are:
General habitat: forest slope and main valley
Logged areas
Trees on ridges

Hi Roland - I've just had time to read those last couple of posts - very interesting work.
We've just been visiting around Yajiang - where locals also reported a few Parakeets left - but we couldn't find any birds and suspect the day's of this bird in this area are also numbered. One of the disturbing sights in this area was evidence of big forest fires - our dry winter seems to have led to more habitat destruction.
We have also talked to locals about the possibilities of protecting the Parakeet and other vulnerable species - have given the China Bird Guide to those who were interested - and will now look forward to meeting up with you to find out where we go from here.

My initial brainwave leads me to think that the red tape involved with captive breeding won't allow that kind of project be the kind of quick fix that will help those last Parakeets fend off local extinction - it seems that the situation is so bad that more radical methods need to be used - something like getting the help of Sichuan Mountaineers and get them to set nest-boxes on trees that are totally inaccessible to the egg collectors.

Just wanted to make sure this info from over at the Vacational subforum was cross-referenced... perhaps all old news ?

Hey Gretchen that link takes us to the wildlife art page!!!!!

I think you may have been trying to link with Shi Jin's report of Derbyans in Lhasa. It's great to see the birds are there - but I suspect they're part of a feral population.

As far as the project goes to protect this species - well I've been meaning to write on this subject so might as well write a little now.

It seems that the writings here may have inspired a local conservation organization to take up a Parakeet Project that runs on much the same type of blueprint that we've suggested - a survey to get a better idea of status and a project to organize an educational project that will encourage locals to protect this species. Ideas regarding captive breeding were thought to be too complicated.
It seems that something positive may be happening for this bird in Sichuan - but steps to save it as one of our breeding birds need to be pretty speedy. This year we were in areas were the Parakeet has bred and where we've recorded it in the past. This year we saw none!

Well, Sid, looks like you got the idea though my linking skills don't look to good.

Thanks for the update, glad there is some interest... hopefully in time.

After a long pause on this thread we can now post up how we're now thinking around a project to bring a little more protection to the few isolated breeding groups of Derbyan Parakeet still found in Sichuan.
Since we're now working as a team with Roland we've decided to post together in this thread - under the name China guy and Jiujiu

Last week saw us make a very interesting trip to perhaps the most major Derbyan Parakeet breeding site still left in Sichuan - Shacong Valley - about 2 hours drive west from Danba.
Here the locals were all fully aware of the Parakeet - and we got estimates of numbers from 100 to 1000 birds. Unfortunately the pet-trade egg collectors also know of this site, but were informed that their presence has been less intense over recent years - something we'd like to believe, but, with the high prices that can be made on selling these birds, you can never be sure on the whole story.
What was truly exciting was the presence of some very strict wildlife protectors in the form of the local monks. We were told by villagers that these guys will go out and stop poachers, confiscate traps and and other hunting equipment and have even got visiting poachers into their temple for praying for forgiveness sessions!!!!
When we went up to the monastery - sure enough we found thousands of snare traps and the remains of poached game taken during these actions.
These guys were also fully aware of and willing to stop the Parakeet egg collectors - these birds and all the local wildlife has their full protection.

Supporting their efforts - seems to be a logical step in a Parakeet conservation project.

We have now come to the conclusion that the original idea about captive breeding is far too complicated - but at a site like Shachong the following steps could be made

Supporting the monks – since the monks were giving active protection some sort of support could be given to them.
They would discuss what kind of support they could need.
We envisaged that support could come in the form of equipment –
Binoculars for observing wildlife and potential poachers/egg collectors
A camera for recording wildlife and their conservation work.
Educational material related to wildlife – books on Chinese animals and birds
Educational materials for their teaching work – pencils, paper and other basic materials they needed in their schools

Notices and signs that advertise that egg collecting is illegal and encourage protection– these could be made in three forms
Permanent
Short-term cloth banners – cheap to make and very visible – could be erected during the egg collecting season.
Flyers – cheap paper notices that could be handed out to the homesteads
If notice and signs were to be used – we have to gain the permission of the local authorities.

Educational work within the local community highlighting the need to protect habitat – the sustainability of timber collection
Nest Box project – it seems likely that one of the constraints on the size of Parakeet population could arise from the lack of suitable nesting cavities. Although there are still big stands of primary forest at lot mature timber has been cut in recent times – and the younger growth provides fewer nesting sites. A project using nest boxes seems a logical approach to developing an effective proactive conservation measure. With the monks we would have willing body of volunteers who could monitor and protect the nestbox sites.

Further field work – we need to back up our evidence with further field work that focuses on trying to --map out the size of the suitable habitat
Estimates of Parakeet population numbers - bird surveys in the focus areas
Investigate the seasonal habits of the Parakeet
Try and map the breeding areas
Review the impact the local population has on the Parakeet
Review the current impact of egg collection
Review the effectiveness of local conservation and protection

Unfortunately we were too early for the Parakeets - they are about to return from their wintering grounds (we don't know where these are) - but a villager told us - a day before he'd seen his first spring birds with a flock of 8 flying overhead.

Another interesting bird in this valley was Long-tailed Rosefinch - we saw three of these

From three visits now made to this area we've written a short report - that we hope may stir up some interest - and provide a foundation for further work. I've attached the report to this post. Since these site are already well known by egg collectors we have not concealed their whereabouts in the report - and having birdwatchers using our information to travel into these areas could have the affect of increasing local conservation awareness and pride over still having this bird. However if anybody does venture out here - expect very rough tracks if you're driving and a not much luxury with any of the accommodation you can find.

Pictures - the village and its Monastery, the forest habitat, the monks and hopefully a new generation of Parakeet protectors and evidence of active wildlife protection - a heap of confiscated snares.

This looks like a nice beginning! Great to find some cooperative people on the ground. As your report mentions, any time you're dealing with an illegal activity, it could be difficult to ascertain who is really involved, and a commodity which is worth so much money will not be one which those involved will give up easily. However, even so, local collectors would be more interested in sustainable harvest than outsiders who simply look for new locations. A community based approach sounds really promising.

Looking forward to hearing more...

Most interesting Sid and Roland, thanks for the in-depth report you have taken the time to make.

A couple of additional comments - For such a project to get developed I think a look into similar projects for equally rare (or rarer) species that have declined due to similar circumstances (egg-collecting and small scale habitat destruction) within the region or beyond is worth perusing. Ie, Philippine Cockatoo, Giant Ibis etc.

Making flyers, banners, raising awareness all sounds very good and nice but unfortunately will do little to curb the problem judging from past experience - perhaps the kids will not collect the birds when they are older, but that is of little relevance as no birds would be left by the time they are older. The main problem is how to actually stop the poaching - poachers are incredibly persistent, hardy and (as most people are) money-orientated.
The best local-schemes I have always come across have involved turning the poachers into nest-protectors and guides, and very easy to do, if finances allow. Generally poaching is hard work, so if the poachers (I'm guessing it would be 3-5 main senior poachers) were turned into protectors, which is very easy, just offer them slightly more than they earn from collecting and also supplement their income with guiding (see below) then that is problem solved!

Eco-tourism - How far is the site from Chengdu or one of the main Sichuan birding sites? Currently, the only way birders get to see Lord Derby's Parakeet is by visiting eastern Tibet, an expensive, time-consuming extension to a Qinghai and Tibet trip (we shall ignore the free-flying escapes in Lhasa!). As you know Sid, many birders visit Sichuan, and it will become increasingly popular again after the recent events, so if, say c20 groups a year visit the parakeet site, with the local guide and monks earning an income from this, it instantly raises awareness, not just to the locals but also to the local government and a real sense of pride would be had within the village that people from around the world visit them to see their birds.
I'm sure other birds must be possible there too - Szécheny's Monal Partridge, possibly even Biet's Laughingthrush for example? Yunnan Nuthatch?? then it could become even more popular.

Also worth looking into the Lord Derby's Parakeet site in Simao, Yunnan, where the locals leave the birds alone as they nest in sacred trees. There is a local birder/student in Chengdu, his name currently escapes me, who studied the Simao birds, worth getting in touch with him for his findings.

Best of luck,

James

Dear James,
Thanks for your suggestions and support.
You are right. Poachers are persistent and money-orientated.
We have had this consideration, too. And of course the best way would be to keep them away from the birds, regardless of the method. Most sustainable way of course is to make them quit voluntarily. But, and here’s the main problem,
A) I think they are too many to convince them all
B) How much could they getting out of being a guide, and what keeps them from guiding and collecting at the same time? That’d be double income. I have tried this a few years ago in the context of a forestry project in a remote village. “Stop tree cutting by promoting eco-tours through primary forest”. The guides – one or two villagers – were the only persons who actually took benefit from this concept. The others kept on cutting trees. And tourists coming were not enough to keep the stones rolling. A big failure – at least for the following years!
C) Working as a guide in Danba probably is not very promising. Birds are not so many (well there are, but not easy to watch since stretched over a huge territory) and the few birders who potentially show up actually won’t need a local guide.

So we abandoned the idea of converting people. Even the idea of captive breeding seems to be unrealistic at the moment. Only a few villagers would be engaged while the empty-handed poachers still might find a way to get onto their prey. Besides, the bureaucratic part of this scenario is quite difficult to manage – at least for a small bunch of volunteers.

Anyway, we are aware that the time is running against us (and the Parakeets), but we still will do it step by step, as far as circumstances allow.
Future perspectives surely include development of eco-tourism/ bird-watching in this area and maybe aren’t so far away.

sichuan jiujiu said:

Dear James,
Thanks for your suggestions and support.
You are right. Poachers are persistent and money-orientated.
We have had this consideration, too. And of course the best way would be to keep them away from the birds, regardless of the method. Most sustainable way of course is to make them quit voluntarily. But, and here’s the main problem,
A) I think they are too many to convince them all
B) How much could they getting out of being a guide, and what keeps them from guiding and collecting at the same time? That’d be double income. I have tried this a few years ago in the context of a forestry project in a remote village. “Stop tree cutting by promoting eco-tours through primary forest”. The guides – one or two villagers – were the only persons who actually took benefit from this concept. The others kept on cutting trees. And tourists coming were not enough to keep the stones rolling. A big failure – at least for the following years!
C) Working as a guide in Danba probably is not very promising. Birds are not so many (well there are, but not easy to watch since stretched over a huge territory) and the few birders who potentially show up actually won’t need a local guide.

So we abandoned the idea of converting people. Even the idea of captive breeding seems to be unrealistic at the moment. Only a few villagers would be engaged while the empty-handed poachers still might find a way to get onto their prey. Besides, the bureaucratic part of this scenario is quite difficult to manage – at least for a small bunch of volunteers.

Anyway, we are aware that the time is running against us (and the Parakeets), but we still will do it step by step, as far as circumstances allow.
Future perspectives surely include development of eco-tourism/ bird-watching in this area and maybe aren’t so far away.

Click to expand...

Hmm, looking at the habitat there, I would be surprised if birds scarce, I'm sure a visit in the spring, when the parakeets are present would reveal plenty of interest, just takes a bit of searching when in new areas.

I terms of why wouldn't the guides do both jobs - this is when a good look and chat with successful nesting protection schemes is invaluable and find out why they worked and the poachers only protect the nests now. The best nest protection scheme I know of is the waterbird colony at Prek Toal, Cambodia.
A nest protection scheme for Bengal Florican in Cambodia involving the locals (that works!) is giving the local c$10 for finding a nest, then c$20 if the nest is successful. This scheme has also worked for White-shouldered and Giant Ibis in the same country.
White-eared Night Heron in northern Vietnam - a local guy in a remote park (Ba Be), guides people to show them the heron nests, supplementing his income, from being unknown just 3 years ago, he now has 4 nests monitored this year, and a couple more nearby with another person doing a similar scheme.
Philippine Cockatoo has a nest protection scheme and the results have been quite amazing.

Look at the Tmatboey project in Cambodia - 7 years ago when that project started in the remote Northern Plains of Cambodia it was not known how it would fair, but with small very dedicated people it is now an amazing eco-tourism project that involves the whole community benefiting (with the use a 'community-pot' - every birder pays $30 on top of the guiding/accommodation fees that goes into the pot then at the end of the season that gets given to the community to spend - they get 150 visitors per annum now).

These projects can work, and will work, if understood correctly and the right approach is taken - I have been involved in the latter project and the way it has worked is quite incredible and heart-warming.

Why would birders visiting not need a local guide?? If the local guide can show them a parakeet at the nest for a sum, then it would work. If it was a locally-run project, whereby the village had a/some homestays (rotional basis so everyone gets an income), then a local guide can be compulsory.

I think 'abandoning' the idea of converting local people is a big shame and I can't see how a project centered near a local community can work without their support - I have seen too many failures that have ignored this fact.

Have you approached NGO's working in China? NGO's with proven track records in this field are worth contacting for support, guidance and even financing. I can offer many contacts if required (PM is best).

Definitely work looking into, as I do not believe any/all poachers would quit voluntarily, why would though, it makes no economic sense...

Best of luck,

James

Take contact to some or other Birdlife subsidiary to see if any is willing to help. I know that the Danish one (DOF.dk) have been involved in similar projects in Africa and I think Indonesia. I think they are more likely to get involved if there is more than one species at risk, but a flagship species is always a good start.

Niels

We received new and interesting information from Wu Jiawei, a bird watcher based in Chengdu.

Yajiang County (in Ganze Prefecture) has a nature reserve called ‘Gexi Gou’ which is established mainly for our parakeets, Chinese Grouse and Buff-throated Partridge. We mentioned Yajiang County in our report before but didn’t know that there is a nature reserve on provincial level which – according to recent surveys – is habitat of a parakeet population of ca. 300 birds. This population seems to be quite stabile, since it lies in Tibetan area, and Tibetans – at least the Buddhists amongst them – wholeheartedly respect local wildlife and life in general.

Here is a link related to some work in this NR, written in English:
http://www.china.org.cn/english/environment/134996.htm

James Eaton said:

Hmm, looking at the habitat there, I would be surprised if birds scarce, I'm sure a visit in the spring, when the parakeets are present would reveal plenty of interest, just takes a bit of searching when in new areas.

I terms of why wouldn't the guides do both jobs - this is when a good look and chat with successful nesting protection schemes is invaluable and find out why they worked and the poachers only protect the nests now. The best nest protection scheme I know of is the waterbird colony at Prek Toal, Cambodia.
A nest protection scheme for Bengal Florican in Cambodia involving the locals (that works!) is giving the local c$10 for finding a nest, then c$20 if the nest is successful. This scheme has also worked for White-shouldered and Giant Ibis in the same country.
White-eared Night Heron in northern Vietnam - a local guy in a remote park (Ba Be), guides people to show them the heron nests, supplementing his income, from being unknown just 3 years ago, he now has 4 nests monitored this year, and a couple more nearby with another person doing a similar scheme.
Philippine Cockatoo has a nest protection scheme and the results have been quite amazing.

...

I think 'abandoning' the idea of converting local people is a big shame and I can't see how a project centered near a local community can work without their support - I have seen too many failures that have ignored this fact.

...

Click to expand...

Sure there are lots of good birds. I’ve seen Chinese Grouse, white-tailed Rubythroat, Golden Eagle and several Rosefinches in these valleys so far. Unfortunately, I haven’t found a slightly more convenient location for birders to go to see as many good birds as possible with a reasonable amount of effort. Probably still requires much more exploring! It really is a huge area!

Bthw, it is also said (a local was 100% sure) that there is Tibetan Eared Pheasant up in the forests!! Again a reason to spend much more time in these beautiful mountains!

Hiring locals (and even better potential poachers) to implement nest protection is a wonderful idea, much better and more effective than ‘converting’ them into volunteers. We surely will consider this option and investigate step by step. We always like to go ‘the whole hog’.

Cheers