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Butorides striata or Butorides striatus? (1 Viewer)

Hi Rasmus,
The first pic is difficult to interpret (at least on my screen), but is this:
http://www.birding-peru.com/upload/picsfiles/Green-Heron-May-17-2005.jpg
really above 4 on Payne's index?
This is certainly the type of bird that fooled Neotropical ornithologists, but note the greyish rear neck and cheek (the chestnut does not come into contact with the black cap).
This is a bird scored as 4 by Floyd Hayes: http://www.geocities.com/secaribbirds/gxsheron1.jpg

The latter could very well be a 4 (perhaps approaching 5), but the specimen (from LSU) looks more like a ~5 or 6:

http://www.birding-peru.com/upload/picsfiles/Butorides.jpg

http://www.geocities.com/secaribbirds/butorid2.jpg
 
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but note the greyish rear neck and cheek (the chestnut does not come into contact with the black cap).

Furthermore, while it is some times since I read the paper Payne (and memory could fool me here), he did not mark the cheeks as being particularly important. He simply used the general hue of the rufous/grey in the neck-region. Additionally, while this may simply be a case of confusion of terms, the cheeks certainly look very rufous to me:

http://www.birding-peru.com/upload/picsfiles/Green-Heron-May-17-2005.jpg

I guess (?) you actually meant the auriculars (ear-coverts).
 
I've been learning a lot reading this thread. This is great stuff. I got lost somewhere though. I know the Green Heron is a North American species and was briefly treated as conspecific with one of the others. Just how many species are there? Two or three?

Green Heron (B virescens)of North America and Striated Heron (B Striata) of the rest of the world were considered conspecific at one time. Papers by Payne and by Hayes were the reason that they were split again. A third sometimes species is the Galapagos Heron/Lava Heron (B sundevalli), which currently is not supported by the newest Clements; the next Howard and Moore will show if they still support this being a species. Some remarks here and there indicate speculations that Striated heron from different continents may be in for a split as well, but that is not supported at the moment.

So 2 + 1/2 species at the moment?

Niels
 
Actually, Paynes' study is what led the AOU to lump striated and green herons in 1976... They re-split them in 1993, after Paynes' conclusions had been questioned in a re-analysis by Monroe & Browning, published the previous year. More recently, Hayes (2002) took a third look at the same data; he largely confirmed Paynes' findings and concluded that most of Monroe & Browning's criticisms were unjustified. He did not recommend re-lumping, though. (Same qualitative conclusions about what is going on, but different species concept.) This split a borderline case at best, IMHO.
If anybody wants a more comprehensive summary, please just ask.

For B. (s.) sundevalli, you can see the SACC proposal: http://www.museum.lsu.edu/~Remsen/SACCprop15.html
As suggested by Niels' message, sundevalli is retained as a separate species in the last edition of Howard & Moore - with a footnote reading "Implicitly recognised by A.O.U. (1998: 45)". But this implicit recognition has since been very explicitly retracted in the 44th Supplement to the AOU Check-list, so this justification could probably not be invoked anymore.


PS - Rasmus: Yes, indeed I meant the ear-coverts - wrong translation on my side, sorry. You are also right that Payne only used the neck color in his index. But this picture is a front view, which is potentially the most misleading angle, and birds showing gray on the face usually also have a rather gray hind-neck; I was merely pointing at something that, to me, seemed unusual for a typical virescens.
I'm not at all comfortable with assessing precise shades from jpegs shown on the web. When I compare pictures of birds scored by Floyd Hayes to his picture of the vouchers, I quite systematically reach a higher score than him, which makes me suspect the way the vouchers show on my screen may not be accurate. Hence my questions...
 
I am sorry that I had misunderstood the conclusion of Payne's paper. What I am very sure of is the conclusion of Hayes 2006: "Because the two taxa may often have opportunity to interbreed on Tobago but tend to mate assortatively, they appear to have achieved essential reproductive isolation, thus supporting their current treatment as distinct species." (J. Carib. Ornithol. 19:12-20). One can of course disagree with this conclusion, but it seems that the SACC has followed this treatment without too many questions in reading their note 10 for B striata. The data in Hayes 2006 says that there were 50% of scored individuals that scored 7-8, 16% scored 1-3, while the rest were 34% scoring 4-6 (6% scored 5 which is the only certain hybrid category).

Cheers
Niels
 
Hi Niels,

I was mainly referring to the Panama contact zone. Historically, changes in the interpretation of what was going on in this contact zone played a major role in the treatment of the complex. What happened is about this:
  • To quantify the variation, Payne defined an index, based on 9 voucher specimens (http://www.geocities.com/secaribbirds/butorid2.jpg), that he thought showed a complete smooth gradation from the purest gray-necked (score 1) to the darkest purplish-brown-necked birds (score 9). Monroe & Browning claimed that the specimens representing scores 5 and 6 in this voucher series were young birds, the neck color of which bridged the two taxa artificially. Hayes found that all of the vouchers had attained adult neck coloration.
  • Using his index, Payne found that the population of central Panama showed an increased variability and a high proportion of intermediate birds; he concluded that the two taxa interbred there. Monroe & Browning claimed that this population was merely a bit higher on the index, but not more variable than South American populations, if North American migrants were excluded from Payne's sample; they suggested these birds were pure striata and no hybridization was occurring. Hayes re-analyzed the data, excluding specimens collected in winter to avoid contamination by northern migrants, and found that the increased variability was real; he concluded that the two taxa interbreed there.
So, as far as this contact zone goes, we are basically back to the findings of Payne, that resulted in the lump.

Here is Hayes' (2002) discussion:
(I think the role of species concepts is evident.)
"Extensive hybridization between taxa often has been interpreted as evidence for lack of reproductive isolation, requiring that the taxa be considered conspecific according to the traditional biological species concept (BSC; Mayr 1970). However, the degree of hybridization must be considered, inasmuch as more than 10% of bird species retain the ability to interbreed and produce viable offspring with other closely related species, including non-sisters (Grant and Grant 1992). Johnson et al. (1999) proposed a new comprehensive biologic species concept (CBSC) applicable to birds: “An avian species is a system of populations representing an essentially monophyletic, genetically cohesive, and genealogically concordant lineage of individuals that share a common fertilisation system through time and space, represent an independent evolutionary trajectory, and demonstrate essential but not necessarily complete reproductive isolation from other such systems” (emphasis added). Assuming phenotype is correlated with genotype, the presence of “pure” phenotypes within a hybrid zone, even when hybridization is extensive, provides evidence of assortative mating; in this case, the two taxa demonstrate essential reproductive isolation and should be considered specifically distinct. In contrast, when all individuals within a hybrid zone are intermediate, free interbreeding is inferred and the two taxa should be regarded as conspecific.
In New World Butorides, the seemingly continuous variation in neck color from purplish-brown in the north to gray in the south strongly implies polygenic control of the deposition of gray eumelanin and rufous phaeomelanin pigments in the distal barbules of neck feathers (Schodde et al. 1980). Each currently recognized subspecies appears to differ in the combination of alleles coding for neck coloration, with intermediate combinations occurring where the ranges of B. virescens and B. striatus meet. The presence of apparently pure B. virescens and B. striatus phenotypes within the contact zone suggests that although the two forms frequently hybridize, assortative mating does occur. However, the sample sizes of museum specimens are small, and it remains uncertain whether both forms actually breed within the hybrid zone.
In Tobago, a large body of recently collected data clearly indicates the presence of mostly “pure” phenotypes in an apparent hybrid zone (neck scores range from 1 to 8; Hayes unpubl. data), providing further evidence that assortative mating occurs. Thus, the two forms appear to maintain essential reproductive isolation and should be regarded as specifically distinct. However, further colorimetric, morphological, behavioral, and genetic studies are needed to shed light on the extent of gene flow and the stability of the hybrid zone."

Having re-checked the papers, there are indeed several points with which I do not really feel comfortable in Hayes' interpretations, but explaining in detail would be a bit long.

Best,
Laurent -
 
Yes! This explains a lot of the reasoning and makes perfect sense to me. I can see this now with the gulls I study as well.

Basically it looks as though the Green and Striated Herons will remain split for the foreseeable future.
 
Yes! This explains a lot of the reasoning and makes perfect sense to me. I can see this now with the gulls I study as well.

Basically it looks as though the Green and Striated Herons will remain split for the foreseeable future.

Ok - I will try to explain what issues I think have not been (and should be) addressed, and could affect the reasoning. Sorry if it becomes really long... :eek!:

- The variability of the phenotype in pure populations of striata and virescens covers most if not all of the variation in the complex, thus almost any bird could arguably be called a "pure phenotype"; this makes arguments based on the frequency of these phenotypes in contact zones weak. If you look at the frequency distribution of the scores within striata-type birds (1 to 4) on Tobago and Trinidad in Hayes (2006), it's easy to see that they are entirely different, with the score that dominates on Trinidad (1) almost absent on Tobago (statistically also, the difference is very highly significant - χ²=37.67, df=1, p=9E-10). Nothing is known about the inheritance of the phenotypes, hence we have no idea how a F1 hybrid looks. If Hayes' data are representative, it is far from unlikely that most of the "striata" on Tobago are not at all "pure" in the same sense as those on Trinidad.

- There is no evidence in Hayes' (2006) data set that the frequency of striata phenotypes has changed on Tobago. The frequencies of birds with scores 1-3 (pooled) in historical and modern samples do not differ significantly (χ²=0.29, df=1, p=0.59); neither do the frequencies of birds with scores 1-4 (pooled) (χ²=0.72, df=1, p=0.40). The main change visible in the data seems to be that, in the modern sample, birds with scores 6 and 7 appear at frequencies almost identical to those of the birds with scores 5 and 6, respectively, in the historical sample. This could imply that the brown-necked part of the population is shifting towards a browner-necked phenotype, but I see no clear implications for the gray birds. Hence, in any case, that "the frequency of pure phenotypes has increased on Tobago" sounds like an overstatement to me.
(More disturbingly, this could also simply result from phaeomelanin-based brown coloration fading out paler in old specimens... If this possibility is addressed somewhere, I missed it.)

- Assortative mating could be real, but remains a hypothesis, and is not the only possible explanation to the persistence of a local polymorphism; regular immigration of individuals differing from the dominant local phenotype could produce the same result. The local population on Tobago is dominated by brown-necked birds, and there is a potential source of gray-necked immigrants close by. If there is some level of assortative mating, it is certainly far from perfect, anyway, given the distribution of the scores on the island.

- Competitive exlusion is a hypothesis explaining the fact that the frequency of striata phenotypes remains low on Tobago, that is built on the hypothesis of assortative mating; if the birds breed together, the frequency of striata phenotypes on Tobago could remain low simply because they get systematically diluted in the local population, in which case competitive exclusion would not be necessary to explain what we see.

- "Essential reproductive isolation" is a rather vague term, which may be a problem in itself. But considering that imperfect assortative mating, as such, is evidence for essential reproductive isolation seems extreme to me. Assortative mating occurs at a lot of levels within species, including between morphs (in snow geese, for example, as a result of imprinting on the phenotype of the parents).

- Last, I actually have a different reading of the CBSC. My reading is that the CBSC allows to accept interbreeding taxa as full species at the condition that they each appear to be "a system of populations representing an essentially monophyletic, genetically cohesive, and genealogically concordant lineage of individuals that share a common fertilisation system through time and space, [and] represent an independent evolutionary trajectory" (emphasis mine). IOW, essential (but not complete) reproductive isolation is a necessary but not sufficient condition for species status. In the case of Butorides spp., the other criteria are untested, and untestable with available data. Any evidence pointing to a significant disconnection between the phenotype and the phylogenetic/genealogical history of the populations would be quite problematic for species status under this concept, even in the presence of strong assortative mating.

Cheers,
L -
 
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Hayes et al 2013

Hayes, Weidemann, Baumbach, Thachuck & Tkachuck 2013. Variation and hybridization in Green Heron (Butorides virescens) and Striated Heron (B. striata) in central Panama, with comments on species limits. NAB 67(1): 4–8.

B (s) virescens is treated as a distinct species by, eg, Kushlan & Hancock 2005, AOU, H&M4, IOC and eBird/Clements; but is lumped by BirdLife/IUCN and Martínez-Vilalta et al 2014 (HBW/BirdLife).
 
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While you’re at it Laurent, what do you think of the current phylogeny of Butorides: 2 species (sometimes 3 with sundevalli) only?

Are we sure that some Asian or Australasian taxa are closer to striata than striata is to virescens ?

There are no published data.
The COI tree in attachment suggests at least that South American birds "could well be" closer to Asian birds than to North American birds. But the sequences on which this tree is based are not publicly accessible, the support associated to the node is not assessable, and whether we can be "sure" of anything is another problem.
Note also the two B. virescens from St Lucia and Trinidad & Tobago, with what seem to be typical South American haplotypes. T&T are in the contact/hybridisation zone, so this one is no real surprise, but St Lucia is well within the range of phenotypically "pure" B. virescens...
12 years on - has there been any progress on this question?
 
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