Join for FREE
It only takes a minute!
More discoveries. NEW: Zeiss Victory SF 32

Welcome to BirdForum.
BirdForum is the net's largest birding community, dedicated to wild birds and birding, and is absolutely FREE! You are most welcome to register for an account, which allows you to take part in lively discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.

Glasses and Diopter Adjustment

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread
Old Sunday 5th April 2020, 13:35   #1
nodd
Neil

 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: The Wirral Merseyside
Posts: 76
Glasses and Diopter Adjustment

I apologise if this has been asked and answered before. Do you have to adjust the diopter on binoculars if you wear glasses ?
__________________
"Man can not exist apart from nature,for he,himself is a part of it"
(Rachel Carson Silent Spring 1962)
nodd is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Sunday 5th April 2020, 15:15   #2
ceasar
Registered User

 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: NE Pennsylvania
Posts: 11,980
Hi Neil,

Why are simple explanations the most difficult?

The answer to your question is yes.

If your glasses give you 20/20 Vision you have to make the diopter adjustment that will give you equal vision in both eyes. That follows through if the vision in your eyes is not equal. You have to adjust the diopter to reflect that difference.

This assumes that there are no mechanical problems with your diopter which can happen.

New binoculars come with instructions on how to set the binocular's diopter.

Bob

Last edited by ceasar : Sunday 5th April 2020 at 15:59.
ceasar is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2010 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Sunday 5th April 2020, 15:20   #3
WJC
Registered User
 
WJC's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Twin Falls, Idaho
Posts: 2,447
Quote:
Originally Posted by nodd View Post
I apologise if this has been asked and answered before. Do you have to adjust the diopter on binoculars if you wear glasses ?
WITH OR WITHOUT GLASSES, binoculars must be focused for observing objects at various distances. Some people think because there is only ONE diopter ring on a center-focus binocular that you set it and forget it. Although the diopter adjustment on the other side is done with the focus nob or a flip lever, it’s still a diopter adjustment. In order to really focus, it must be. The AUTO-FOCUS fraud of a few years back was just that ... a highly successful advertising scam aimed at the unwary!

The diopter RING is for setting the dioptric difference between your eyes—in only 2-3% of the population is it the same. The focus wheel or flip lever adjusts the focus on BOTH SIDES. You focus the side with the wheel or lever and then set your diopter. Many people—including me—ignore those numerals and even set THAT side to where it is most precise and comfortable.

About apologizing: DON’T! There is not a question on a binocular forum that has not be asked and answered about a bazillion times.

Cheers,

Bill
__________________
— More often than not, our understanding rests with the magnitude of our humble willingness to understand.
WJC is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Sunday 5th April 2020, 15:54   #4
nodd
Neil

 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: The Wirral Merseyside
Posts: 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by WJC View Post
WITH OR WITHOUT GLASSES, binoculars must be focused for observing objects at various distances. Some people think because there is only ONE diopter ring on a center-focus binocular that you set it and forget it. Although the diopter adjustment on the other side is done with the focus nob or a flip lever, it’s still a diopter adjustment. In order to really focus, it must be. The AUTO-FOCUS fraud of a few years back was just that ... a highly successful advertising scam aimed at the unwary!

The diopter RING is for setting the dioptric difference between your eyes—in only 2-3% of the population is it the same. The focus wheel or flip lever adjusts the focus on BOTH SIDES. You focus the side with the wheel or lever and then set your diopter. Many people—including me—ignore those numerals and even set THAT side to where it is most precise and comfortable.

About apologizing: DON’T! There is not a question on a binocular forum that has not be asked and answered about a bazillion times.

Cheers,

Bill
The apology was just incase as I know on some forums some people get touchy about re asked questions.

I am aware that binoculars have to be focused for different distances. It was I was wondering if your eye sight has been corrected by your glasses do you still need to set the diopter for each eye? This may be the wrong term to use in that you still need to calibrate the binoculars for the person using them?
__________________
"Man can not exist apart from nature,for he,himself is a part of it"
(Rachel Carson Silent Spring 1962)
nodd is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Sunday 5th April 2020, 16:17   #5
Troubador
Moderator
 
Troubador's Avatar

 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Sheffield
Posts: 10,216
There are several reasons why a spectacle wearer should adjust the dioptre to reflect differences between the eyes and here are some of them.

The dioptre markings on binos are not meant to be used as if they are on an opticians instrument, they are there to help you note your personal setting and return to it if the setting gets moved. So the bino is not necessarily set perfectly to Zero when the dioptre adjuster says so although bino manufacturers do try to achieve this.

Also your spectacle lenses are made to tolerances like all other manufactured products so they will be very close to what the optician ordered but not necessarily perfect.

And don't forget the prescription for your lenses was based on your answers to the opticians questions asking you 'which is sharpest? This one or this other one? and if you are like me you will have found those questions not so easy to answer as the optician approached the final choices. So your own answers on which your spectacle lenses were based my not have been perfect either.

Doing the dioptre adjustement check is the best way to ensure you are getting the best performance from your binos and remember, whatever dioptre setting you arrive at, whether it is Zero or plus something or minus something, you cannot guarantee this same setting will be as suitable for you on a different pair of binos.

Good luck.

Lee
__________________
"You are never alone, with a sheep"

Last edited by Troubador : Sunday 5th April 2020 at 16:19.
Troubador is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Sunday 5th April 2020, 16:27   #6
nodd
Neil

 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: The Wirral Merseyside
Posts: 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by Troubador View Post
There are several reasons why a spectacle wearer should adjust the dioptre to reflect differences between the eyes and here are some of them.

The dioptre markings on binos are not meant to be used as if they are on an opticians instrument, they are there to help you note your personal setting and return to it if the setting gets moved. So the bino is not necessarily set perfectly to Zero when the dioptre adjuster says so although bino manufacturers do try to achieve this.

Also your spectacle lenses are made to tolerances like all other manufactured products so they will be very close to what the optician ordered but not necessarily perfect.

And don't forget the prescription for your lenses was based on your answers to the opticians questions asking you 'which is sharpest? This one or this other one? and if you are like me you will have found those questions not so easy to answer as the optician approached the final choices. So your own answers on which your spectacle lenses were based my not have been perfect either.

Doing the dioptre adjustement check is the best way to ensure you are getting the best performance from your binos and remember, whatever dioptre setting you arrive at, whether it is Zero or plus something or minus something, you cannot guarantee this same setting will be as suitable for you on a different pair of binos.

Good luck.

Lee
Hi Lee

Thank you your answer has helped a lot. I just want to make sure I am getting the best from my new Swarovski 8.5 x42 EL

Cheers
Neil
__________________
"Man can not exist apart from nature,for he,himself is a part of it"
(Rachel Carson Silent Spring 1962)
nodd is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Sunday 5th April 2020, 21:15   #7
mpeace
Registered User

 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Reading
Posts: 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by nodd View Post
Hi Lee

Thank you your answer has helped a lot. I just want to make sure I am getting the best from my new Swarovski 8.5 x42 EL

Cheers
Neil
I wear glasses and have the same bins and adjust the diopter quite often as my eyes can shift a little at different times of day or if I've been on the computer a lot etc. Also experiment with the inter-pupil distance (ipd). For me it ergonomically feels comfy and natural to set it quite wide, but I find I get a better view (snappier focus, more immerse and 3D) if I set the ipd narrower.
mpeace is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Sunday 5th April 2020, 21:48   #8
nodd
Neil

 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: The Wirral Merseyside
Posts: 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by mpeace View Post
I wear glasses and have the same bins and adjust the diopter quite often as my eyes can shift a little at different times of day or if I've been on the computer a lot etc. Also experiment with the inter-pupil distance (ipd). For me it ergonomically feels comfy and natural to set it quite wide, but I find I get a better view (snappier focus, more immerse and 3D) if I set the ipd narrower.
Hi thank you I’ll give that a try.
__________________
"Man can not exist apart from nature,for he,himself is a part of it"
(Rachel Carson Silent Spring 1962)
nodd is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Monday 6th April 2020, 00:25   #9
WJC
Registered User
 
WJC's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Twin Falls, Idaho
Posts: 2,447
Quote:
Originally Posted by nodd View Post
Hi thank you I’ll give that a try.
The following is from a piece I did for The Nov. 2019 Southern Boating. It may very well answer questions related to nodd’s, “I just want to make sure I am getting the best from my new Swarovski 8.5 x42 EL” and mpeace’s, “... and adjust the diopter quite often.” While learning to stare is critical to maintaining a good view at any distance, optical engineers very rarely consider its importance, observers never know to consider it, and too many feel what they don’t know won’t hurt them. They’re right ... but it can make for a frustrating outing with the birds.


“... FINALLY, THE IMPORTANCE OF LEARNING TO STARE

“Your mother probably taught you it’s not nice to stare. However, for the most pleasing observing experience you had better forget that advice.

“There are two phases to focusing a binocular. The first concerns the focus mechanism—the actuation of the focus knob, diopter ring, or flip lever. That’s the one seen almost exclusively by the observer.

“The second is through the involuntary focusing of the eye through the eyelens being stretched or compressed by the eye’s ciliary muscles. Our brains want to see things in focus quickly and will use those muscles to the detriment of the viewing experience.

“Let’s suppose you want to see a target at a certain distance and start turning the focus knob to achieve the best image. The target may become sharply focused for you at -4 diopters, although your “at rest” diopter setting should be -1 (arbitrary numerals selected). Yes, the image is focused, but only so at a strained setting. Then, when you start adjusting the binocular’s focus mechanism—without considering the importance of staring—you will repeat the mistake and the problem remains.

Learning to stare can prevent the eye’s involuntary input and limits focusing to that achieved through the binocular’s focus mechanism. This leaves the observer in control of whole focusing operation as opposed to having the two aspects of focusing fight each other while you try to attain and accurate focus for an object at a given distance."
__________________
— More often than not, our understanding rests with the magnitude of our humble willingness to understand.

Last edited by WJC : Monday 6th April 2020 at 00:31.
WJC is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Monday 6th April 2020, 02:14   #10
Chosun Juan
Given to Fly
 
Chosun Juan's Avatar

 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Central West NSW, Australia
Posts: 7,445
Quote:
Originally Posted by nodd View Post
I apologise if this has been asked and answered before. Do you have to adjust the diopter on binoculars if you wear glasses ?
An interesting question and everybody has contributed some useful and though provoking answers.

I wear glasses (tested within the last couple of years). I would have said a hard no - why complicate the optical system with further variables? (I seem to have some recently accquired astigmatism in one eye which doesn't provide the elegant solution I would like).

Already with my consumer level bins I am dealing with marginal eye relief, the vagaries of the precision of the exit pupil (tolerances and spherical aberrations and what not) and the limitations imposed by lack of ER degrees of freedom, far from luxurious randpupille (margin of error for alignment contained by the optical design - Swaro's are some of the best in the business !), alignment of the bins with that, and the particular curvature and spacing of my glasses (short-sighted) , and some slight mechanical focusing hysteresis, and focus wheel backlash to boot.

This used to absolutely annoy the heck out of me ! Now however, various injuries put this optical and mechanical imprecision in stark relief, and from this new perspective I'm just glad that I can see stuff better than with my similarly dodgy mark one eyeball !

Also, I realize that my eyes too have much variation in them depending on conditions and how tired etc my eyes are. I've seen everything from various apparitions, the trees shimmying and shaking as they talk to me, I've had Eagles talk to me (they want people to stop photographing around their nests !) , and at certain times of the afternoon my eyes take on individual colour casts (one orangy-goldish, the other blue green - David Bowie-like, which I like to kid myself makes me some sort of genetically superior super predator - lol )

There are times when I get a really clear view (especially when the objective and ocular lenses are clean !) , and yet there are other times when nothing I seem to do helps get a clear view. I will give the Staring technique a go (but that could quite easily take me further out of this world !) - if only I could get those danged geewhizzits to sit still long enough !

I'm going to leave my diopter at zero (otherwise it's a trip back to the optometrist for a refund !) , but by all means, if it helps, play around with it a bit. :)






Chosun
Chosun Juan is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2016 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Old Monday 6th April 2020, 03:12   #11
WJC
Registered User
 
WJC's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Twin Falls, Idaho
Posts: 2,447
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chosun Juan View Post
I'm going to leave my diopter at zero (otherwise it's a trip back to the optometrist for a refund !) , but by all means, if it helps, play around with it a bit. :)

Chosun
Hi, Chosen,

If you leave your diopter adjustment at “0,” as you say, like so many others—and the optometrist has tested you at something else—your observations will be out of focus by that amount.

Please keep in mind that while learning to stare is easy for some people, it is very difficult for the majority. And, of course there are those who claim it doesn’t matter—reference my signature statement.

A test:

Focus your bino clearly on a target at least a mile away. Then, defocus until the image slightly annoying. Now, remove it from your eyes with NO further adjustment. Return to looking at your target with your unaided eyes. When your focus is sharp, quickly return your binocular to your eyes. If your image is still annoying for several seconds, you have learned to stare. If the image is pretty good, you have not. That means your ciliary muscles have involuntarily taken over. And as Aristotle was prone to say: “Bad juju.”

Bill
__________________
— More often than not, our understanding rests with the magnitude of our humble willingness to understand.
WJC is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Monday 6th April 2020, 13:05   #12
Chosun Juan
Given to Fly
 
Chosun Juan's Avatar

 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Central West NSW, Australia
Posts: 7,445
Arrow

Quote:
Originally Posted by WJC View Post
Hi, Chosen,

If you leave your diopter adjustment at “0,” as you say, like so many others—and the optometrist has tested you at something else—your observations will be out of focus by that amount.

Please keep in mind that while learning to stare is easy for some people, it is very difficult for the majority. And, of course there are those who claim it doesn’t matter—reference my signature statement.

A test:

Focus your bino clearly on a target at least a mile away. Then, defocus until the image slightly annoying. Now, remove it from your eyes with NO further adjustment. Return to looking at your target with your unaided eyes. When your focus is sharp, quickly return your binocular to your eyes. If your image is still annoying for several seconds, you have learned to stare. If the image is pretty good, you have not. That means your ciliary muscles have involuntarily taken over. And as Aristotle was prone to say: “Bad juju.”

Bill
Thanks Bill

I did try various diopter settings at the start - but settled back on "0" (who knows - perhaps my optometrist fluked it - these were the previous script before the wretched astigmatism started to creep into one eye ..... still in denial about that one - lol )

I have noted a change in my dominant eye from right to left now - my bowling (lawn) seems to have adapted (even if it confuses me .... I've agreed with myself to not think about it, and just try and get something close ! :)

I will give the Staring thing a try sometime
(my birding buddy has locked himself away until the spring)






Chosun
Chosun Juan is offline  
Reply With Quote

BF Supporter 2016 Support BirdForum With A Donation

Advertisement
Reply


Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Diopter adjustment with and without glasses? J2neuby Binoculars 5 Friday 25th August 2017 13:41
Diopter Adjustment bh46118 Binoculars 31 Tuesday 22nd April 2014 04:52
Diopter adjustment distance Bugtographer Zeiss 3 Tuesday 26th October 2010 09:08
Diopter adjustment Lewie Binoculars 13 Thursday 19th October 2006 15:39
Diopter adjustment of 10x42 LXL? Pyjam Nikon 2 Tuesday 3rd October 2006 15:27

{googleads}

Fatbirder's Top 1000 Birding Websites

Help support BirdForum

Page generated in 0.24016500 seconds with 26 queries
All times are GMT. The time now is 22:35.