Join for FREE
It only takes a minute!
ZEISS Summer Savings - Experience unique moments of nature. Save up to £250 on selected ZEISS Binoculars - limited time only!

Welcome to BirdForum.
BirdForum is the net's largest birding community, dedicated to wild birds and birding, and is absolutely FREE! You are most welcome to register for an account, which allows you to take part in lively discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.

Myiobius atricaudus snethlagei

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rating: Thread Rating: 1 votes, 5.00 average.
Old Thursday 22nd August 2019, 07:56   #1
Taphrospilus
Registered User
 
Taphrospilus's Avatar

 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Munich
Posts: 1,307
Myiobius atricaudus snethlagei

Just want to give this for discussion as it might be correct from OD here as mentioned in the key.

Quote:
subsp. Myiobius atricaudus (Beolens et al., 2014, list Dr Emil Heinrich Snethlage (1897-1939) German zoologist, as the person commemorated here;
So we talk about Dr. Emil-Heinrich Snethlage. In here we find

Quote:
Nahezu ohne Mittel wagte er im März 1923 die Fahrt nach Pará, im Vertrauen darauf, dass seine Tante drüben auf ihn warte, um ihn in die Methodik der wissenschaftlichen Forscherarbeit einzuführen und die erforderlichen Verbindungen herzustellen. Es währte auch wirklich nicht lange, bis das glückte. Professor C. E. Hellmayr, damals seit kurzem Leiter der ornithologischen Abteilung des Field-Museums in Chicago, interessierte sich für die Pläne unseres Enthusiasten und ermutigte ihn zur Ausführung einer grossen Sammelreise durch die brasilianischen Staaten Maranhão, Ceará, Piauhy und Goyaz, von der er erst im April 1926, nach fast 3 Jahren, an den Ausgangspunkt zurückkehrte.
All that would support Beolens et al., 2014. He was between 1923 and 1926 collecting in the area and C. E. Hellmayr (describer of holotype) encouraged him to do so. The H. can be Heinrich or Herr (both is possible). And finally -i instead of -ae in snethlagei might indicate a dedication to a man and not to his aunt Henriette Mathilde Maria Elisabeth Emilie Snethlage.

Take it for what's worth.

Last edited by Taphrospilus : Thursday 22nd August 2019 at 08:47.
Taphrospilus is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 22nd August 2019, 10:52   #2
l_raty
laurent raty
 
l_raty's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Brussels, Belgium
Posts: 3,234
Here are the details of the type, as per the museum's database: https://collections-zoology.fieldmus...talogue/780856. (Note collection date here is 28 Jun 1925, not 28 Jun 1924 as in the OD.)

(There are 1618 specimens in this database attributed to "H. Snethlage", vs. 43 attributed to "E. Snethlage". A few of the H. Snethlage's specimens have pics, including of the labels, which look like [this]. Any sample of Emilie Snethlage's handwriting online ? I can only find her signature right now, which doesn't really look similar -- but a mere signature may not be representative of how someone writes regular text.)
l_raty is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 22nd August 2019, 23:17   #3
mb1848
Registered User

 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Santa Maria, California USA
Posts: 2,093
I have not found a writing example of E. Snethlage but does the writing look like that of a person who had her middle finger of her right hand bitten off by a piranha?
http://exhibitions.blogs.lib.lsu.edu/?page_id=1868 .
__________________
Mark Brown, Esq.
mb1848 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Friday 23rd August 2019, 07:04   #4
l_raty
laurent raty
 
l_raty's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Brussels, Belgium
Posts: 3,234
Arguably more so than her signature, I'd say
(It's of course the collector's label that you have to look, the one on the rear which is written in German. "Iris: schwarz" etc.)

Last edited by l_raty : Friday 23rd August 2019 at 09:31.
l_raty is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Friday 23rd August 2019, 10:21   #5
l_raty
laurent raty
 
l_raty's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Brussels, Belgium
Posts: 3,234
Some clearer images, including "H. Snethlage" on the collector's labels, here:
https://collections-zoology.fieldmus...talogue/781353
https://collections-zoology.fieldmus...talogue/781354
Surely she would not have marked her own labels "H. Snethlage" ?
Note also in comparison to Emilie's signature, i.a.: the 'S' is obviously not the same, but also the 't' is completely different -- Emilie writes the main vertical line upwards (with a loop at the top to form the horizontal bar), in "H."'s name it is written downwards.
l_raty is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Friday 23rd August 2019, 13:45   #6
l_raty
laurent raty
 
l_raty's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Brussels, Belgium
Posts: 3,234
I also note that Emil-Heinrich signed the obituary of his aunt, in J. Ornithol. in 1930 ([pdf] -- signature at the end of the main text, p. 132) "Heinrich Snethlage". Thus "H. Snethlage" was certainly to be expected for him.

Some more info about him in: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/262762385

Last edited by l_raty : Friday 23rd August 2019 at 16:40. Reason: "of of her" (thks Björn - as usual)
l_raty is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Saturday 24th August 2019, 10:05   #7
l_raty
laurent raty
 
l_raty's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Brussels, Belgium
Posts: 3,234
Quote:
Originally Posted by l_raty View Post
I also note that Emil-Heinrich signed the obituary of his aunt, in J. Ornithol. in 1930 ([pdf] -- signature at the end of the main text, p. 132) "Heinrich Snethlage". Thus "H. Snethlage" was certainly to be expected for him.
He also published a series of 3 papers in J. Ornithol. about his travels in Brazil (which don't seem to be available freely online, unfortunately), also under the same name of Heinrich Snethlage:
Towards the end of the first paper, p. 481, we can read:
Quote:
Die gewonnenen Ergebnisse wird Herr C. E. HELLMAYR wohl in den Berichten des Field-Museums, Chicago, veröffentlichen.
(This was in the July 1927 issue of J. Ornithol.; the Tyrannidae part of the Catalogue where Hellmayr described the bird was published in April 1927; Heinrich may not have been aware of it yet when he wrote the above.)

In both other papers (1928), he mentioned Myiobius atricaudus snethlagei Hellmayr:
- in the second paper, p. 531, in a table summarizing his observations, where the bird is indicated as occurring in 7 out of 13 listed forest habitat types.
- in the third paper, p. 718, where he noted about it:
Quote:
Ich habe diesen Tyrannen niemals auf die von REISER beschriebenen Weise tanzen sehen, obwohl ich ihn häufig genug beobachten konnte.
This in any case indicates he had met with the bird many times.

Last edited by l_raty : Sunday 25th August 2019 at 08:58. Reason: no, not 19th C... (Thanks Martin)
l_raty is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Saturday 24th August 2019, 20:24   #8
l_raty
laurent raty
 
l_raty's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Brussels, Belgium
Posts: 3,234
Hellmayr's own account of Heinrich's expedition (published 1929): https://biodiversitylibrary.org/page/6732195
(Calling him "Heinrich E.", instead of the correct E. Heinrich.)

Last edited by l_raty : Sunday 25th August 2019 at 08:30.
l_raty is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Sunday 25th August 2019, 10:55   #9
Taphrospilus
Registered User
 
Taphrospilus's Avatar

 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Munich
Posts: 1,307
It might be worth to check...

Quote:
Pinto, O. M. de O. (1938). Nova contribuciao a ornithologia Amazonica. Revista do Museu Paulista, 23, 493-604
. p. 542

.. as here the name is written as Odontophorus gujanensis snethlagei and not snethlageae.

The rest of the key are defintely for his aunt (I checked them all with one exception Hemitriccus minor snethlageae (Snethlage, EH, 1937)). I doubt that it is Orn.Monatsb. 45 p.193 as mentioned in Avibase.

We can find the OD p. 174-175 Ein neuer Tyrannide aus Amazonien.

Last edited by Taphrospilus : Sunday 25th August 2019 at 13:33.
Taphrospilus is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Sunday 25th August 2019, 15:36   #10
Calalp
Björn Bergenholtz
 
Calalp's Avatar

 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Posts: 3,108
I will post this without any major revisions (simply as I was typing away, in a separate document, off-line, at the same time as Laurent and Martin posted their latest additions to this thread) ... pretty hard to keep up the pace. Thereby, take if for what it is worth (even if a bit messy). Hopefully you will understand my drift.

First, back to the original Topic; ... if the ssp. Myiobius atricaudus snethlagei (OD in post #1), a k a Snethlage's Myobius, is "Heinrich's" or "Emilie's" ditto, I simply do not know (this bird is not "one of mine"), but I tend to believe it was aimed at (Emil) Heinrich* Snethlage (1897–1939), nephew of the well-known Emilie ... and onwards.

Richmond card here: "Named for H. Snethlage."

Even if this bird apparently was (as also/equally claimed in the OD) collected by "H. Snethlage" (which talks strongly in favour of Mr. Snethlage), I would add (simply to complicate things); see the comment by Hellmayr himself, in A Contribution to the Ornithology of Norteastern Brazil, 1929, only two years after the OD, (here, same book as in Laurent's post #8), in the very entry for: "136. Myiobius atricaudus snethlagei Hellmayr" (on p.316), where we, in the footnote (on the subsequent page) find the following phrase:
Quote:
"M. [Myiobius] barbatus xanthopygius" and "M. barbatus," lately recorded by Madame Snethlage ... probably refer to this form".
Also note that several Papers by the latter lady, Emile Snethlage, was/is referred to in Hellmayr's Original Catalogue (of 1927, first link, post #1), which would talk in favour of her ... (see/use the "Search Inside" function). As well note that Emilie Snethlage 's full name was: Henriette Mathilde Maria Elisabeth Emilie Snethlage (though I strongly doubt, or even refuse to believe, that she would have used "H." as a sole Initial).

If relevant?

Either way, to me, this far, it looks like snethlagei could have been intended for (Emil) Heinrich Snethlage [this also as Mr Hellmayr seems to have been a guy who normally knew his Latin genitive endings], versus all the birds by the name snethlageae, which doubtless commemorate Emilie Snethlage.

If snethlagei truly does commemorate Heinrich ... well, that's beyond me.

Either way, I concur/agree in Martin's suggestion/reguest, that it would be interesting to see the OD of the "Odontophorus gujanensis snethlagei" PINTO 1938, in Revista do Museo Paulista 23 (p.542).

Anyone who have seen it?

Björn

PS. Possibly equally noteworthy, is that (Emil) Henrich Snethlage described the ssp. of Snethlage's Tody Tyrant Hemitriccus minor snethlageae, as "Snethlagea minor snethlageae" in 1937 (here, pp.174-175), commemorating [twice (!), if we include the Generic name] his well-known Aunt (collector of the Type, in 1911, additional specimens collected by himself, in 1934).

The today invalid generic name "Snethlagea" VON BERLEPSCH 1909 (Syn. Hemitriccus) does, without a doubt, commemorate Emilie:
Quote:
"... zu Ehren der ausgezeichneten und sehr verdienten Ornithologin Fräulein Dr. E. Snethlage ...".
_______________________________________
*I would say that Mr. Snethlage's name (most likely) ought to be written without the hyphen (not with, as it have been done in quite a few Papers) . If he truly had a double, hyphenated given name, he would have signed his labels E.-H. Snethlage, wouldn't he? Also compare how the name was written in his Obituary (here), by Stresemann, who uses both versions (!): "Emil-Heinrich Snethlage" and "E. H. Snethlage". Also compare how his name was written (here), in Zeitschrift für Ethnologie, by "E. Heinrich Snethlage" himself. Alt. here (by his Son Dr Roger Michael Snethlage), who also uses both version (either with hyphen, and/or not!) ... and elsewhere.

Maybe it's time (for anyone keen) to check his Birth cerificate/record? If so; from "Bremerhaven" (alt. Bremerhafen).

--

Last edited by Calalp : Sunday 25th August 2019 at 19:05. Reason: typo
Calalp is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Sunday 25th August 2019, 15:55   #11
l_raty
laurent raty
 
l_raty's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Brussels, Belgium
Posts: 3,234
Odontophorus gujanensis snethlagei

I tried to find this one as well earlier, but no joy. (I have seen at least half a dozen of different spellings for the title; I think the correct one is "Nova contribuição à ornitologia amazônica.")

The Richmond Index card for this name indicates as types two specimens, 16436 and 16435, from Rio Manacapuru. Geographically, this is the state of Amazonas, which might seem to be more "within the scope" of Emilie. But she didn't collect the types (the birds were collected in Sep 1936 by someone named Camargo according to Pinto 1938 [here]).

This may just be a subjective view, but somehow I would also not expect Hellmayr to have used -i for a female dedicatee. No clear idea about Pinto.

Last edited by l_raty : Sunday 25th August 2019 at 16:13.
l_raty is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Monday 26th August 2019, 09:01   #12
Taphrospilus
Registered User
 
Taphrospilus's Avatar

 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Munich
Posts: 1,307
Quote:
Originally Posted by l_raty View Post
collected in Sep 1936 by someone named Camargo according to Pinto 1938 [here]).
Probably not him him as he seems to young in 1936. But might be a relative to Pintos wife Alice Alves de Camargo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calalp View Post
I
PS. Possibly equally noteworthy, is that (Emil) Henrich Snethlage described the ssp. of Snethlage's Tody Tyrant Hemitriccus minor snethlageae, as "Snethlagea minor snethlageae" in 1937 (here, pp.174-175), commemorating [twice (!), if we include the Generic name] his well-known Aunt (collector of the Type, in 1911, additional specimens collected by himself, in 1934).

The today invalid generic name "Snethlagea" VON BERLEPSCH 1909 (Syn. Hemitriccus) does, without a doubt, commemorate Emilie:

To make it a little bit more complete:

Quote:
This interesting bird is not entirely unrecorded. In 1913 (Jour.furOrn.,LXI,p.527), Dr. Emilia Snethlage gave some critical notes on a form of Campyloramphus, different from procurvoides and apparently of the trochilirostris group which she found at Faro and Monte Alegre in the "varzea" or inundated forest where procurvoides was not found.

Quote:
Etymology. The scientific name P. snethlageae honors Dra Emilia Snethlage who first recognized the distinctiveness of these populations (Snethlage 1914) and who pioneered modern studies of the Amazonian avifauna. The vernacular name refers to the occurrence of this bird strictly within the drainage of the Rio Madeira.

Quote:
Fräulein Dr. E. Snethlage, die durch ihre ornithologischen Expeditionenen und Publikationen rühmlichst bekannte Vorsteherin des Zoologischen Instituts in Pará, hat auf ihren letztjährigen Reisen im Gebiet des Rio Tapajoz und des Rio Xingú eine große Sammlung von Vogelbälgen fur das Museum Goeldi zusammengebracht, worunter sich viele für dieses Gebiet noch nicht nachgewiesene Arten und auch einige neue Formen befanden.

Last edited by Taphrospilus : Monday 26th August 2019 at 10:35.
Taphrospilus is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Tuesday 27th August 2019, 06:14   #13
Calalp
Björn Bergenholtz
 
Calalp's Avatar

 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Posts: 3,108
Quote:
Originally Posted by l_raty View Post
Odontophorus gujanensis snethlagei

I tried to find this one as well earlier, but no joy. (I have seen at least half a dozen of different spellings for the title; I think the correct one is "Nova contribuição à ornitologia amazônica.")

The Richmond Index card for this name indicates as types two specimens, 16436 and 16435, from Rio Manacapuru. Geographically, this is the state of Amazonas, which might seem to be more "within the scope" of Emilie. But she didn't collect the types (the birds were collected in Sep 1936 by someone named Camargo according to Pinto 1938 [here]).

This may just be a subjective view, but somehow I would also not expect Hellmayr to have used -i for a female dedicatee. No clear idea about Pinto.
Maybe we're just led astray by that Richmond card (and its "Revista do Museo Paulista, Tomo XXIII") ... !?

According to Pinto's Bibliography (here) the Paper "Nova Contribuição à Ornithologia Amazonica" (Estudio crítico de ...), is found in Revista do Museo Paulista 22, pp. 493-604 ... !? ... which leads us; here (p.542 is the Indice/Index, of the same volume as in Laurent's latter link, in Post #11, or in the quote above)!

But on that certain page (542) we find only the nominate "gujanensis, Odontophorus". Sigh! Make sense? Not to me

Either way no trace (at least not that I can find) of a "Odontophorus gujanensis snethlagei", not in that particular volume, neither on p.542, nor on p.104. And; note, this volume ends at p.561.

Also see this piece on Recent Litterature, from The Auk 55 (4), 1938, p.696:
Quote:
PINTO, OLIVERIO: Nova contribuição á ornithologia Amazonica. ... Revista do Museu Paulista, 23: 493-604, Jan. 14, 1938. — ... Of the many species listed, the following are described as new: Odontophorus gujanensis snethlagei, no type mention, lower Amazon; ...
To me it looks like it ought to be found in the next-following Revista do Museu Paulista (from the one we've seen this far) ... or in a possibly missing (this far unseen) Appendix.

Anyone smarter?

Björn
--

Last edited by Calalp : Tuesday 27th August 2019 at 14:41. Reason: missed spacing
Calalp is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Tuesday 27th August 2019, 06:53   #14
Taphrospilus
Registered User
 
Taphrospilus's Avatar

 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Munich
Posts: 1,307
And remember here:

Quote:
Pinto (Rev. Mus. Paul. 23. p.542, 1838) has recently separated birds from Manacapurú (and Rio Tapajóz: Santarém, Aveiro) as O. g. snethlagei (type in Museu Paulista).
So might make sense to check the label if specimen are still availble in Museu Paulista?

Regarding Vol 22 I think Catalogo das Aves do Brasil e Lista Dos Exemplares que as representam no Museu Paulista is not what we are looking for.

Last edited by Taphrospilus : Tuesday 27th August 2019 at 07:01.
Taphrospilus is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Tuesday 27th August 2019, 15:30   #15
Calalp
Björn Bergenholtz
 
Calalp's Avatar

 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Posts: 3,108
See here (p.161):
Quote:
Revista do Museu Paulista

[...]
Tomo XXII*** 1838 ... 566 p.
Tomo XXIII 1838 ... 750 p.
__________________________________________________
*** Este número da Revista apresentouse como Catálogo das Aves do Brasil;
ainda no mesmo ano publicou- se o tomo XXIII da Revista do Museu Paulista.

Translation of foot-note (helped by Google Translate):
This issue of the magazine was presented as Catálogo das Aves do Brasil; in the same year, the XXIII volume of the Revista do Museu Paulista was published.

Thereby, No 23 is the one we ought to find. Somewhere. As in this one, I guess (but with access, of course) ...

/B
Calalp is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Tuesday 27th August 2019, 20:08   #16
mb1848
Registered User

 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Santa Maria, California USA
Posts: 2,093
No. 23.
http://bionames.org/references/694de...a0d90d93eb77c5 .
This is source for snethlagei,
Nova contribuiYao a ornithologia amazonica. Estudo critico de uma collecc?o de Aves do baixo Solimoes e do alto Rio Negro. Revista do Museu Paulista, 23 1938: pp. 493-604. [Zoological Record Volume 75] .
From 1938 Auk v. 4.
PiNTO, OLiVaRIO. Nova contribuiqo t ornithologia Amazonica. Estudo critico
de urea coilecono de aves do baixo Solim6es e do alto Rio Negro. Revista do Museu
Paulista, 23: 493-604, Jan. 14, 1938.--An account of collections recently made on
the lower Amazon and the upper Rio Negro, Brazil. Of the many species listed,
the following are described as new: Odontophorus gujanensis snethlagei, no type
mentioned, lower Amazon; Cranioleuca'solimonensis, from Manacapuru; and
Thryothorus leucotis affinis from Manacapuru
__________________
Mark Brown, Esq.

Last edited by mb1848 : Tuesday 27th August 2019 at 20:22.
mb1848 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 28th August 2019, 02:12   #17
l_raty
laurent raty
 
l_raty's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Brussels, Belgium
Posts: 3,234
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calalp View Post
Thereby, No 23 is the one we ought to find. Somewhere. As in this one, I guess (but with access, of course) ...
There is another copy on Google with snippet view access. There, I can see parts of p. 543 -- e.g. [this] or [this] -- which are indeed about a new race of Odontophorus gujanensis; but I fail to find a way to p. 542, where the name is supposed to be introduced.

There are also three copies on Hathi, that cannot be seen at all, but that can be searched. For example, [this] suggests that the words "Mme", "Snethlage" and "snethlagei" coexist on that particular page.
l_raty is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Wednesday 28th August 2019, 04:48   #18
mb1848
Registered User

 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Santa Maria, California USA
Posts: 2,093
Thryothorus leucotis affinis
https://books.google.com/books?id=-J...ucotis+affinis .
Is this name in the Key? Not a current subspecies in HBW.
__________________
Mark Brown, Esq.
mb1848 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 29th August 2019, 07:32   #19
Calalp
Björn Bergenholtz
 
Calalp's Avatar

 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Posts: 3,108
Post Odonthoporus gujanensis snethlagei

Revista do Museu Paulista XXIII, 1938 (see attached excerpts, from pp.542-543), i.e. Pinto's OD ... with a clear reference to Emilie Snethlage's Paper of 1908 (here, by "E. Snethlage"), and ditto's (here) Catalogo das Aves Amazonicas (by "Emilia" [sic] Snethlage"), from 1914.

... which I assume means that this bird truly was/is "hers".

Björn

PS. In 1908 her Nephew (Emil) Heinrich was only a kid (and still in Germany).
--
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Revista do Museu Paulista XXIII, p.542.jpeg
Views:	6
Size:	98.6 KB
ID:	703313  Click image for larger version

Name:	Revista do Museu Paulista XXIII, p.543.jpeg
Views:	5
Size:	39.6 KB
ID:	703314  
Calalp is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 29th August 2019, 09:06   #20
Calalp
Björn Bergenholtz
 
Calalp's Avatar

 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Posts: 3,108
Post Mr Camargo

Quote:
Originally Posted by l_raty View Post
... the birds were collected ...by someone named Camargo ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taphrospilus View Post
Probably not him him as he seems to young in 1936. But might be a relative to Pintos wife Alice Alves de Camargo.
...
That guy, "someone named Camargo", wasn't Dr Hélio Ferraz de Almeida Camargo (not even as a young teenager), but Snr. [Mr] "Carlos A. de Camargo Andrade, naturalista-colleccionador do Museu Paulista ... "

See attached excerpt from the Intro of Pinto's piece in Revista do Museu Paulista XXIII.

If he (in some whatever-way) was a relative of Pinto's "wife Alice Alves de Camargo", is all unknown to me.

However; enjoy!

Björn
--
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Intro.jpeg
Views:	4
Size:	60.8 KB
ID:	703317  
Calalp is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Thursday 29th August 2019, 09:47   #21
Taphrospilus
Registered User
 
Taphrospilus's Avatar

 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Munich
Posts: 1,307
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calalp View Post
"Carlos A. de Camargo Andrade, naturalista-colleccionador do Museu Paulista ... "

Side note. Dichotomius (Dichotomius) camargoi was named after him. p. 88 here:

Quote:
Dedicado con todo placer al Dr. Carlos Amadeu Camargo Andrade, Director de la División Insecta del Departamento de Zoología, Secretaría da Agricultura, del Estado de San Pablo, Brasil, por todas las atenciones tenidas para con nosotros durante la estación en ese Departamento de Zoología.
But of course not a bird, but a beetle.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calalp View Post
PS. In 1908 her Nephew (Emil) Heinrich was only a kid (and still in Germany).
]
But in 1938 it is still possible that Pinto contacted him (e.g. for advice, manuscripts from him or her aunt etc.). But I agree it is most likely a dedication to Mrs. Snethage.

Last edited by Taphrospilus : Thursday 29th August 2019 at 09:53.
Taphrospilus is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Saturday 31st August 2019, 08:59   #22
Calalp
Björn Bergenholtz
 
Calalp's Avatar

 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Posts: 3,108
"Snethlage's Myobius"

Regarding the original Topic of this thread; the subspecies Myiobius atricaudus snethlagei HELLMAYR 1927 (a k a "Snethlage's Myobius") ...

Maybe worth considering is the Plant/Scrub "Torrubia Snethlagei"* (here), described in 1936, by Paul C. Standley, based on specimen collected in Maranhão ..., 31 July, 1923 by "H. Snethlage", published in a publication from The Field Museum (in Chicago, USA), which is the same Museum where Hellmayr worked as Curator for many years (1922–1931).

Possibly (?!) indicating that the bird in question was aimed at Heinrich ...

If it truly was? Who knows?

Björn

_______________________________________
*Today's Guapira snethlagei LUNDELL 1968, here (ex Standley)
Calalp is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Saturday 31st August 2019, 15:02   #23
Calalp
Björn Bergenholtz
 
Calalp's Avatar

 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Posts: 3,108
Also compare with other Plants, with the (generally, expected masculine) name snethlagei, like (for example/s):

• the flowering plant "Monstera snethlagei" K. KRAUSE 1925 (here, requires log-in to read Online, OD on pp.272-273): "Nordbrasilien: Maranhao, Igapowald (E. H. SNETHLAGE n. 327 — blühend am 14. November 1923)". [blühend = blooming]. Same thing said here (for the Type itself): "Collector: E. H. Snethlage, #327", "Collection Date: 1923/11/14" [a synomym of Monstera obliqua MIQUEL 1844 (in Araceae)]

• the tree/plant "Aspidosperma Snethlagei" (Fr.) MARKGRAF 1927 (here, same login required, OD on pp.118-119): "Nordbrasilien: Plauhy, S. Filomeno, auf der Chapada, 350 — 600 m. ü. M. (blühend 12. Juli 1925 — HEINRICH SNETHLAGE n.676)." [m. ü. M./ Meter über Meer = Meters above Sea (Level)] [a Synonym ofAspidosperma macrocarpon VON MARTIUS 1824 ... ?]

... or (simply to make things a bit more hesitant, less obvious) with the:
• the Shell/Mollusc "Happia snethlagei" BAKER 1913 (here): ... "sent from the Goeldi Museum, by the Director, Dr. Emilia [sic] Snethlage, to whom the species is dedicated."

As we know by now the Director of that Museum was Madame Emilie Snethlage [a k a "Emilia", in some (South American) texts, or (in the Family/among friends) as "Mila"]. Evidently those snethlagei Plants were aimed at Henrich, contrary the Shell/Mollusc which was meant to remember his well-known Aunt.

I guess it all boils down to if Hellmayr himself would have coined a scientific name ending with an -i, for a female dedicatee? Which, like I said, I hesitate (or, at least, feel a bit reluctant) to believe. Normally, in most cases, Hellmayr seems to have kept the genitive endings in order.

Compare with (for examples); Chapman's Swift Chaetura chapmani HELLMAYR 1907, or Berlepsch's Canastero (Thripophaga) Asthenes berlepschi HELLMAYR 1917, commemorating Frank Michler Chapman respectively Hans (Hermann Carl Ludwig) Graf (similar to Count) von Berlepsch versus the two subspecies "Calospiza gyroloides catharinae" HELLMAYR 1911 and "Dysithamnus mentalis emiliae" HELLMAYR 1912, commemorating his wife Catharine, respectively Emilie Snethlage!

On the other hand, one might also consider the fact that Emilie Snethlage herself coined the name "Myiobius erythrurus hellmayri" (here) in 1907!? Maybe the "Myiobius atricaudus snethlagei" HELLMAYR 1927 simply were a favour (a thank you) in return? Either to Emilie herself, or to Heinrich alt. to the Snethlage Family (as a whole)? Thereby, if the latter, also including the (among Ornithologists) fairly unknown Nephew ("H. Snethlage")? [A, if so, expected, more appropriate, plural form (like snethlageorum, or similar) not taken in consideration].

Thus, the question remain; would Hellmayr choose to call this bird/ssp. snethlagei if he intended it for Emilie herself? When he'd already (15 years earlier) had coined/used the name emiliae, in her honour!? To me it does look like the latter bird was aimed for (Emil) Heinrich Snethlage. But if it truly does I cannot say. Not with a/any certainty. Not without a clear dedication, This far I wouldn't dare to claim either way.

Well, this is as far as I can reach on "Snethlage's Myiobius" (Myiobius atricaudus snethlagei) HELLMAYR 1927 ... take it all for whatever it is worth.

And; good luck in evaluating it.

See you all elsewhere!

Björn

PS. Maybe also equally noteworthy, is that quite a few of Hellmayr's names, ending with -ae, (like aroyae, bahiae, mexicanae, roraimae, etc.) are toponyms. I guess he wasn't all that strict with his Latin endings.

[In those latter cases one would expect the ending/s -ensis (or similar, like; -anus, -icus, etc.). Or wouldn't one?]
--

Last edited by Calalp : Saturday 31st August 2019 at 15:29. Reason: My usual typo/s
Calalp is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old Saturday 31st August 2019, 15:31   #24
Paul Clapham
Registered User
 
Paul Clapham's Avatar

 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Posts: 297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calalp View Post
PS. Maybe also equally noteworthy, is that quite a few of Hellmayr's names, ending with -ae, (like aroyae, bahiae, mexicanae, roraimae, etc.) are toponyms. I guess he wasn't all that strict with his Latin endings. In those latter cases one would expect -ensis (or similar, like; -anus, -icus, etc.). Or wouldn't one?
"-ensis" would have been a choice, but I wouldn't say it's mandatory for toponyms.

Also, Bahia and Roraima (and Aroya, too, if that's a place name) are feminine in Spanish so treating them as feminine in Latin is reasonable, it seems to me. But mexicana is a different situation as it isn't based directly on "Mexico". It's the Spanish adjective "mexicano/a", presumably Latinized and used in the feminine because the genus name is feminine.
__________________
Life list:
2016 (Clements v2019 -- 18.8% of 10721); 2002 (Howard & Moore 4.1 -- 19.7% of 10175)
2038 (IOC 9.2 -- 18.7% of 10916)
2021 (HBW (Dec 2018 snapshot) -- 18.4% of 10967); 2021 (BLI Version 3 -- 18.2% of 11126)
Paul Clapham is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old Monday 2nd September 2019, 05:30   #25
Calalp
Björn Bergenholtz
 
Calalp's Avatar

 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Posts: 3,108
Just some additional bits and pieces, left behind ...

Miriam Junghans. 2016. Among birds and net(work)s: material and social practices in the trajectory of ornithologist Emilie Snethlage (1868–1929). HoST – (Journal of) History of Science and Technology, vol 10 (No.1)pp. 71-101 (here, see foot-note, p.75):
Quote:
Emil-Heinrich Snethlage (1897–1939) studied botany and zoology at the universities of Freiburg, Kiel, and Berlin, where he graduated in 1923 with a work on ornithology. In the same year, he arrived in Brazil and travelled across the state of Maranhão along with his aunt. Between 1924 and 1926, he worked for the Field Museum of Natural History in Chicago as an ornithologist, traveling the states of Maranhão, Piauí and Ceará.
... with reference to:
Mere, Gleice. 2013. Emil-Heinrich Snethlage (1897-1939): nota biográfica, expedições e legado de uma carreira interrompida. [Emil-Heinrich Snethlage (1897-1939): Biographical note, expeditions and legacy of an interrupted career]. Boletim do Museu Paraense Emílio Goeldi. Ciências Humanas, vol. 8 (no.3), pp. 773-804. (here, in Portuguese)

Also see:
Fernando C. Straube. 2017. Ruinas e urubus: Historia da Ornitologia no Parana, vol 7, Período de Chrostowski, 3 (for the years 1910 to 1930), vol. 7 [Hori Cadernos Técnicos 13] ... which does mention the bird in Topic (here, see foot-note, p.253):
Quote:
Myiobius atricaudus snethlagei é alusão ao seu sobrinho Emil Heinrich Snethlage, de relevantes préstimos à Ornitologia do Maranhão, Piauí e Ceará ....
/B
--

Last edited by Calalp : Monday 2nd September 2019 at 05:43. Reason: the the
Calalp is online now  
Reply With Quote
Advertisement
Reply


Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off



Fatbirder's Top 1000 Birding Websites

Help support BirdForum

Page generated in 0.23332000 seconds with 39 queries
All times are GMT. The time now is 15:06.