Ethiopia Feb 2020 independent budget (1 Viewer)

halftwo said:

OK: here we go:

Addis to Debra Libranos (2hrs + stops)
Night Debra Libranos (Ethio-German Hotel)
Debra Libranos to Jemma Valley:
Dawn to escarpment - 1hour +
Night Alem Ketema, Jemma
Jemma to Debra Birhan (100kms)
Night Debra Birhan (Eva Hotel)
Debra Birhan to Ankober, Melka Ghebdu (60kms)
On to Awash South (?2 - 3 hrs)
Night in Awash, Genet Hotel
Awash & onto Bilen Lodge area (50kms)(Aledeghi area)
Night Bilen Lodge area.
To Wondo Genet (5-6 hrs + stops)
Night Wondo Genet
Wondo Genet to Bale, birding Bale up to
Dinsho (Bale) 2 - 3 hrs plus stops
Night Dinsho area
Bale/Gaysay to Goba
Night Goba
Sanetti/Harenna
Night Goba or south.
To Negele via Sof Omar (5hrs + stops)
Night Negele
Liben, Melka Ghuba, onto Yabello (4 or 5 hrs)
Night Yabello*
Mega - Soda area
Night Yabello*
Yabello to Awassa (5hrs)
Night Awassa
Awassa to Langano/Ziway
Night Langano.
Langano to Addis

*From Negele to Yabello there appears to be no accommodation - so two nights in Yabello is probably necessitated in order to back-track to Mega - Soda.

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Hi Richard,
Thank you.
When you come to add more specifics to the itinerary, please could you let me know which of The Lakes you are planning to visit ? I always enjoy a good water -bird spectacle and it can make for some slightly more relaxed birding :t:
Best regards, Carol

Hi, Carol,

Beseka, Awassa, Langano & Ziway.

Richard

Hi All

I understand that we have been focused on the birds, mainly due to Andy's input. However, both myself and Carol are also dead keen on all the mammals and there is a wealth of goodies to see in this respect. I have put together a list with maps where I have found them. There were some particularly good mammal reports from groups who went with the purpose of both birding and mammaling on mammalwatching.com. I don't see why we can't have the same success, as most of the sites are the same as we are planning!

Here is the list:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1z3-8ESyXGlk8Zmc7SieJx2RQq0lR-dL0Drnnm4sNWrw/edit?usp=sharing

I have colour coded the mammals. The red ones are those that are endemic or near endemic that I particularly hope we will get good views of. The purple ones are mammals that I either haven't seen and would like to see or ones where I would like to see them better, but these mostly aren't endems or near endems. The rest are possibilities that are either so common we should see them, or ones that are chance sightings, or small rodenty things that I'm not proposing we go out of our way to look for because I'm not confident enough to identify them myself!

To increase our chances I have also indicated those sites that I think it would be particularly beneficial to organise sunset/night drives though I understand that spotlighting may be difficult/impossible at certain places. Still the trip reports I have used to compile this show what is possible even with those restrictions!

As regards the itinerary, please can we agree to keep the two nights at Goba and one night Dinsho? I would really hate to be pressured to move on after only one night, as there is so much potential for Sanetti and Harenna forest area. Especially since we seem to have some contingency to cover Yabello in any case.

Around Dinsho, as well as Gaysay, I'd like to try to cover the area around Sodota Campsite and the Web Valley. This area seems to deliver some really good sightings. I'm not sure how much of this area can be covered by vehicle- I know that there is a dirt road to the campsite. Richard could you look into this please?

If possible, I would like to include a bit of time in Senkelle for the endems there, it should be feasible to cover this in a couple of hours on the day we go to Awassa.

As a suggestion, could we perhaps compress some of the time at Jemma area to allow for an extra night in the Awash/Alideghe area, as that looks to be a really interesting area for both birds and mammals that could warrant some extra time? Or perhaps if we decide in advance that it's just too risky to cover Yabello we could reassign the time for this area?

I agree with Richard that we should keep a close eye on how the situation around Yabello develops. Is it feasible to go as far as Negelle and then cut across to Awassa?

cheers

Jo

kittykat23uk said:

Hi All

I understand that we have been focused on the birds, mainly due to Andy's input. However, both myself and Carol are also dead keen on all the mammals and there is a wealth of goodies to see in this respect. I have put together a list with maps where I have found them. There were some particularly good mammal reports from groups who went with the purpose of both birding and mammaling on mammalwatching.com. I don't see why we can't have the same success, as most of the sites are the same as we are planning!

Here is the list:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1z3-8ESyXGlk8Zmc7SieJx2RQq0lR-dL0Drnnm4sNWrw/edit?usp=sharing

I have colour coded the mammals. The red ones are those that are endemic or near endemic that I particularly hope we will get good views of. The purple ones are mammals that I either haven't seen and would like to see or ones where I would like to see them better, but these mostly aren't endems or near endems. The rest are possibilities that are either so common we should see them, or ones that are chance sightings, or small rodenty things that I'm not proposing we go out of our way to look for because I'm not confident enough to identify them myself!

To increase our chances I have also indicated those sites that I think it would be particularly beneficial to organise sunset/night drives though I understand that spotlighting may be difficult/impossible at certain places. Still the trip reports I have used to compile this show what is possible even with those restrictions!

As regards the itinerary, please can we agree to keep the two nights at Goba and one night Dinsho? I would really hate to be pressured to move on after only one night, as there is so much potential for Sanetti and Harenna forest area. Especially since we seem to have some contingency to cover Yabello in any case.

Around Dinsho, as well as Gaysay, I'd like to try to cover the area around Sodota Campsite and the Web Valley. This area seems to deliver some really good sightings. I'm not sure how much of this area can be covered by vehicle- I know that there is a dirt road to the campsite. Richard could you look into this please?

If possible, I would like to include a bit of time in Senkelle for the endems there, it should be feasible to cover this in a couple of hours on the day we go to Awassa.

As a suggestion, could we perhaps compress some of the time at Jemma area to allow for an extra night in the Awash/Alideghe area, as that looks to be a really interesting area for both birds and mammals that could warrant some extra time? Or perhaps if we decide in advance that it's just too risky to cover Yabello we could reassign the time for this area?

I agree with Richard that we should keep a close eye on how the situation around Yabello develops. Is it feasible to go as far as Negelle and then cut across to Awassa?

cheers

Jo

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I can already see how this is going to go, there are different priorities and even now, the leveraging has started.

I don't think the emphasis on birds was just down to me Jo, you didn't even declare that mammals were you main interest until post 41 in this thread that I can see!

I thought it would be a bird trip with some good mammals but with at least two people holding mammals as their primary interest, I feel that a compromise is going to be needed somewhere and someone will lose out.

There has to bo absolute agreement from all parties, prior to the trip or this is shaping up to go wrong IMHO.

Depending on numbers, I feel that two vehicles with separate itineraries may have to be the way forward?

So I don't think this trip was ever meant to be just about ticking all the endemic birds...

halftwo said:

Hi Andy,

Basically I'm time-constrained, so want to concentrate on a few sites: Awash, Bale, etc, without adding 3 or 4 times the distance for, say, twice the birds.
I've not gone into detail yet as I'm just putting feelers out. But there's a huge number of birds to see even on a shortened trip.

Cheers,

H

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So Andy this is what attracted me to Richard's trip. I have said from the start, post 10, that if Bale was to feature I would be very interested. I had initially hoped less sites, more time at each as was initially the idea:

kittykat23uk said:

I may be interested as well. I had planned to do Ethiopia a few years ago but plans fell through. If bale mountains features then call me interested! I certainly don't need all the endemics and I am also rather short on time after brazil...

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Also Richard also comments:

halftwo said:

Sure: it all helps.

Lots of mammals to see: noticed Lion is on the Awash list - which surprised me.

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Andy even you said:

andyadcock said:

It would be nice to prioritise both birds and mammals with an itinerary that aims to do just that, after all, most will only ever visit the country once.

I am a little concerned that mixing people with different priorities could cause some problems on the trip?

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see Gelada but wouldn't be keen on a diversion (at cost to the bird list) for e.g a Rat!

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I believe the current itinerary strikes a good balance for birds and mammals, there are no sites I am propsing to add for just rats, even though there are sites that have been added that do add miles just for a few extra birds that I wouldn't have chosen to include in a 2 week trip. I am okay with that to keep the birders amongst us happy.

My only red line is to keep those 3 nights in Bale. Everything else is open. I don't feel that is much to ask in all honesty.

If we do have 2 cars then of course that does add to our flexibility . My belief is that some of my suggestions e.g. adding in senkelle (endemic mammals, big ones) are easy to accommodate but even that point is not die in the ditch for me. I can live without seeing a swayne's Hartebeest.

If we do need all that time at Yabello and Jemma that's fine, I was only asking as Awash and alideghe have a lot of potential for seeing something really special!

Chere's

Jo

You quote me there Jo as saying,

'It would be nice to prioritise both birds and mammals with an itinerary that aims to do just that, after all, most will only ever visit the country once.'

Surely it's implicit that this is the ideal with no compromise to either mammals or birds and would need a longer trip. On a shorter trip, with different priorities among participants, something will be left out for something else, is three nights at Bale typical of any non, mammal focused tours?

I'd have no problem seeing every endemic Rat, Vole or Shrew if time allowed but it doesn't,

As well as the idea of two cars / two itineraries, some could stay on longer to pursue their own targets? Those who want longer at e'g Bale, could go out earlier and the rest could meet them there say a week later? Not everyone is time constrained. I could easily do 3-4 weeks but I know and respect that others can't.

Can I just be clear that I have never stated that mammals are my primary interest.

I am a very keen bird watcher. I have previously said that I will do all that I can to pre-prepare for the trip and am very much looking forward to it. I have never tried to exercise any leverage. I have said that, in the field, my identification skills may fall short, but I will do the best that I can.

I am considerate of other people and respectful of other people's interests. I do not try and push forward my views, that is not in my nature. The only thing that I have said is that , for me personally, more than three people in a vehicle, plus the driver, would be too much, if that means a person having to travel in the middle of the back seat in a vehicle with two rows of seats. That is because I am aware that we will be traveling very long distances, sometimes, in heat, where perhaps the air-con may not work in the vehicle and some of the roads may be difficult to pass.

I believe that in a group everyone has valuable things to bring to a group trip.

I am very much hoping that you will be able to feel able to join the trip Andy. I feel that your keen interest and wealth of experience would be great for the group/ trip.

I also enjoy watching mammals, seeing butterflies, looking at wild flowers etc. I have a broad interest in natural history .

Best regards, Carol

Hi All,

OK, I've had a long day, & haven't got time today to read all the extra stuff.

However: a few points:

The itinerary as is at the moment has a (little) flexibility. One of the problems could be that some accommodation that we really should/must stay at, might require a firm booking - meaning certain constraints on timings. Again, I'll enquire with the land agents regarding this, along with the Yabello/southern loop.

As already said, two nights at least are planned for the Bale area, with a possible third.

We might get lucky early for mammals, particularly the wolves.

We have 2 vehicles. Two of you make the case for flexibility there - so that's a possibility.

We don't know for sure yet about the far south and the feasibility of doing the southern loop. We could opt to go the other way - anti-clockwise & finish up at Bale, having already done Langano/Ziway. That way one vehicle could extend if necessary while the other returns.

A further extension for any other reason is a possibility - as long as I can get back to Addis!

Jo: I see Sentelle is very close to Awassa - another reason you might want to extend. But, we could go on forever trying to fit more & more in.

I've tried to make the itinerary as balanced as I can, but there are many unknowns and possibilities to dip on any given "must see".

I'll get back to this further in a day or two, once I've had time to read all the other stuff.

Kelvin & Yvonne: what are your thoughts?

Richard

Thanks, yep as mentioned Richard, I am not at all fussed if we can't fit Senkelle in, I only mentioned it because of the proximity of the park to Awassa and that most tours cover it on the same day.

If there is any way we can finish at Bale, that would definitely assist with possibilities for extending as far as I'm concerned. Even if the car needs to go back, ending there could allow me to join a trek for a few days, subject to cost. The pick up point for treks is either Bale/goba airport or Addis.

Would be good to know if anyone else wants to extend and what they have planned.

Thanks also for trying to keep everyone happy Richard, I appreciate it and have been though the pain of this process once already which didn't result in a viable trip, so I'm really keen for this to work out this time. :t:

All the best

Jo

C'mon guys, you have enough time and a good itinerary to give most if not all of the birds and mammals a shot.
It's a very comprehensive itinerary, and while there is still a lot of driving, Ethiopia is not the country to stick in one site for days and days, almost all birding is roadside and mammals are best found by driving around as well, either along roads or inside the parks on dirt tracks.

I did this almost exactly 10 years ago (October 2009). We had to do without any cell phone cover, internet and hardly any trip reports. The best report we had was from 1996 (and actually, it's still valid!). We had to rely on visuals ("this looks a good area for Prince Ruspoli's Turaco - hey, what's that green bird flying across the road!?" or: "this river looks big enough, maybe there should be Juba Weavers here"). I only got some of my GPS right because I recognized the areas on google maps, back at home. Some areas I only got right when google had higher resolution maps, that weren't available back in the days for some parts of the country!

We didn't book any hotel as we didn't know where we would end for the evening, and even if we would have known, we wouldn't have any means to contact them beforehand! We camped 1/3 of the time and I remember those nights as the most comfortable / best in terms of sleeping, temperature, noise and the occasional bed bug: hotels were often in noisy places, too hot rooms, dirty sanitary,... The Wabe Shabele hotels are upmarket and more fancy, but we didn't take those as we felt really out of place in those hotels with Western prices for food and drinks, but it turned out you could get e.g. the same coffee or fruit juice across the street for a 10th of the price! Those places were always full of western tourists with 10-20 big 4x4s all parked in the inner square. We only took that hotel once (at Awassa) because it was supposed to be in the best place for birding and some birds should be in the hotel grounds. Nights at Dinsho were very cold and damp. I was happy to leave that place for somewhere warmer!

The political situation has changed quite a bit. It seems 2009 was better than 2018, for example. And 2009 was better than 2005. Things change but with the site guides, all the reports on cloud birders and the rise of e.g. Ebird, it seems very, very hard to go wrong with good preparation, sharp eyes, a good ground agent (we had one that was totally inexperienced with birders, and he still did an excellent job!) and above all: flexibility in the itinerary, and flexibility in the minds of the participants. Good luck and if any question, I can still talk about my trip for hours !

Thanks again, Temmie, excellent points made.

Where did you stay in Dinsho? And did you stay at the Ethio-German hotel in Debra Libranos?

My only concern about not booking anywhere in advance is that in certain places - such as those I mention above - might mean not being able to stay at any given place. (I know there is other accommodation in Debra Libranos, but trip reports mention Owls in/around the grounds, eg.)

I'm tempted by the camping thing, but would require the ground agents to supply all that extra stuff & for it to be carried everywhere.

R

All: see Temmie's & my post above.

See my concerns regarding not booking versus some certain bookings.

We could be more flexible if nothing is booked. However I have major reservations if we allow ourselves too much leeway; namely that there will be arguments about staying or leaving a particular site because someone wants more time for a specific species - bird or mammal, then the entire timetable goes out of the window.

As Temmie has pointed out: the itinerary allows a good mix for everyone, and while some might be concentrating on birds and another on mammals at any given place, as a lot of the sites have both, it just comes down to timing, which is the most difficult thing to get right.

I feel we could go on trying to tweak the trip forever!

But, let me have your thoughts on greater flexibility.

There is still plenty of time for fine tuning - so inputs always welcome.

Richard

I couldn't agree more with Temmie's comments. We did the same trip in 2012, and I think there is some over-analysing going on here. The standard birding circuit is very well-worn in Ethiopia, so there's really not much need to re-invent the wheel. There's also a great bird finding guide.

We didn't pre-book a single night's accommodation, and the only place we had an issue finding a hotel was in Yabello, which was quickly sorted. There isn't really much point in stressing about potential tribal conflicts affecting your itinerary, when these things can flare-up and disappear literally overnight. You have a plan, and if something happens, you discuss your options and change your plan. The world isn't going to end!

If you book your vehicles through one of the usual agencies used by birders, it's highly likely that your driver will know all the birding sites, even if he doesn't know much about birds. He will also almost certainly have contacts for local guides and hotels in the towns. Our driver just phoned ahead as we were driving and made arrangements for the night, and this worked perfectly.

Having complete flexibility allowed us to change our itinerary on the fly. For example, we missed Harwood's Francolin because we followed the advice from some crappy Belgian trip report , but were able to re-arrange the last few days of our trip and visit the site recommended in the birdfinder, where it was easy. In fact, we made quite a few changes on the fly - we spent an extra day at Dinsho because Spot-breasted Lapwing was nowhere to be found at the usual sites, and we had to go exploring to find some; we spent a day less at one of the traditional woodland sites (forget which, maybe Wondo Genet?) as it was badly trashed and the locals were horrendous, and a day less at Harenna Forest as it was utterly dead.

Thanks, for that, DMW (David?), very useful comments.

Yes, perhaps we're getting a bit bogged down in tweaking etc.! It seems flexibility within a framework is the way to go.

R

I'm open to the idea of camping if that helps.

David or better: Duncan (dmw), I sometimes include a fake site for a good bird, to get an advantage when comparing world lists ��
@ Halftwo: we stayed at the forest rest house in Dinsho. I don’t know if that is still possible. The guy tracking the roost of abyssinian owl works there (abdullah was his name I thought).

temmie said:

David or better: Duncan (dmw), I sometimes include a fake site for a good bird, to get an advantage when comparing world lists ��
@ Halftwo: we stayed at the forest rest house in Dinsho. I don’t know if that is still possible. The guy tracking the roost of abyssinian owl works there (abdullah was his name I thought).

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Last September the forest rest house in Dinsho was closed, I have no idea whether it might have re-opened since, but it seemed as if the lease of the last owner ended... The guy who did the Owl tracking stopped working at the lodge a few years ago already, but he was still tracking owls, the National Park guides know him .

This would mean there is no proper accomodation anymore in Dinsho, which means staying in Robe or Goba is the only option....

temmie said:

David or better: Duncan (dmw), I sometimes include a fake site for a good bird, to get an advantage when comparing world lists ��
@ Halftwo: we stayed at the forest rest house in Dinsho. I don’t know if that is still possible. The guy tracking the roost of abyssinian owl works there (abdullah was his name I thought).

Click to expand...

:t:

Sorry, Duncan!

Right. Good news folks: I've just had a conversation with Mrs. Halftwo and she is happy for me to extend the trip.

If we had 2 or 3 further days would everyone be happy with that?

Edit: would have to extend at the beginning - gotta be back by 2nd.

R

halftwo said:

Sorry, Duncan!

Right. Good news folks: I've just had a conversation with Mrs. Halftwo and she is happy for me to extend the trip.

If we had 2 or 3 further days would everyone be happy with that?

Edit: would have to extend at the beginning - gotta be back by 2nd.

R

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Hi Richard,
Whilst longer is always better (titter ye not :-O), there will still, undoubtedly be a conversation as to how those extra days are utilised?

No doubt Joe will want more time at Bale whilst others, may, want to go after the Babbler as it's the only, realistic opportunity to get it safely?

I could be talking out of a place where the sun doesn't shine as I haven't looked exactly where the Babbler is, it may be totally impractical anyway, even with the extra days but it would be a pity to lose the single opportunity that most of us will have, to see it?

As Temmie says..........

temmie said:

C'mon guys, you have enough time and a good itinerary to give most if not all of the birds and mammals a shot.
It's a very comprehensive itinerary, and while there is still a lot of driving, Ethiopia is not the country to stick in one site for days and days, almost all birding is roadside and mammals are best found by driving around as well, either along roads or inside the parks on dirt tracks.

Click to expand...

If Temmie says it's a good itinerary as is, would it not be a waste of the extra days if we just sauntered around and didn't utilise them fully?

Has anyone perhaps, Temmie, got any idea how to best use the extra days, is the Babbler (or even the Bustard) a viable option?