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RSPB very rarely check membership cards (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter IAN JAMES THOMPSON
- Start date
IAN JAMES THOMPSON
Well-known member
The RSPB Community Forum is a far more pleasant place to post on. No sarcasm from anyone like on here. They can at least discuss subjects on that forum without sarcasm from anyone.
Ian.
Ian.
Phil Andrews
It's only Rock and Roller but I like it
Well I object to the RSPB wasting it's time and money on creating and monitoring an online community forum ...
IAN JAMES THOMPSON
Well-known member
Well at least it's a far more friendly forum than on here. Just because my spelling is not very good. Someone posts a not very nice post about my spelling.
Ian.
Phil Andrews
It's only Rock and Roller but I like it
For whatever reason in this threads and many others you have started you seem to view being a (life) member of the RSPB as some form of financial transaction - many people would quite happily be members and never visit a reserve, knowing their shilling is going to preserve habitat and species.
So it's okay for you to use the word gobbledygook to describe someone's post (i.e. calling it meaningless or unintelligible), but not nice that someone jokes about your spelling of this word?
IAN JAMES THOMPSON
Well-known member
Why should someone comment about my spelling, they don't know anything about me. I mentioned gobbledygook as someone was just posting a sarcastic post about the thread I started. Not very nice.
Ian.
MTem
Well-known member
I agree with Ian here. There is no need to make any comments directed at him as an individual; it is sufficient to stick to comments and information relating to the original post and its content.
Here Ian, I hope you now have a better understanding of perhaps why the RSPB does not 'police' entry fees quite are forcefully as you seem originally to feel was merited. I do hope you, in the light of this new information, are now reassured that the organisation has thought through their strategy on this topic and come to the right decision. A decision that I hope you can now support.
As has been intimated above, I view my subscription as a 'donation with ancillary benefits', not a 'payment for exclusive entitlements', and suggest you might consider yours in a similar vein.
Happy birding
Mick
Here Ian, I hope you now have a better understanding of perhaps why the RSPB does not 'police' entry fees quite are forcefully as you seem originally to feel was merited. I do hope you, in the light of this new information, are now reassured that the organisation has thought through their strategy on this topic and come to the right decision. A decision that I hope you can now support.
As has been intimated above, I view my subscription as a 'donation with ancillary benefits', not a 'payment for exclusive entitlements', and suggest you might consider yours in a similar vein.
Happy birding
Mick
What is the profile of non-payers? I think most people not interested in birding would just stay away from the reserve (they can have fun in a normal park and pub if they want) unless they want to do something forbidden like make a barbecue in the forest, and then they should be legally dealt with for their recognized crime/felony. Then there would be less wealthy persons who maybe want to have one memorable day. If there is an entrance gate you can just have people selling tickets and checking the member cards. If it is just unfenced wilderness there is probably some local law on trespassing.
As for the group that was not asked to take their membership cards out of their pockets, they were certainly expected as a group: "there will be 20 or so persons who are members of our organization, they will visit our reserve on this particular date, they go everywhere together as one unit, the group includes serious experienced birders. So there turned to be 22 persons instead of 20, ok, the extra two persons are gratis, they are not going to spend more resources than the group of exactly 20."
As for the group that was not asked to take their membership cards out of their pockets, they were certainly expected as a group: "there will be 20 or so persons who are members of our organization, they will visit our reserve on this particular date, they go everywhere together as one unit, the group includes serious experienced birders. So there turned to be 22 persons instead of 20, ok, the extra two persons are gratis, they are not going to spend more resources than the group of exactly 20."
John Cantelo
Well-known member
Beautifully put, Mick.
Paul Chapman
Well-known member
Ian - the comment on your spelling was in respect of your spelling of a word which dismissed an entire post in one sentence - so it does make it rather difficult for you to take the moral high ground in that respect.
On the topic itself, I have been an adult member of the RSPB for 34 years. I joined as a 13 year old but was unaware of the YOC or similar so joined as an adult and was happy to pay the full membership. My interest and love of nature was unique in my family but I have educated them all (as well as myself) over the last three decades. There would have been years within that period when I suspect that I did not visit an RSPB reserve during the course of an entire year as I tend to have longstanding patches when not twitching or travelling abroad. I have absolutely no objection to the RSPB not checking membership cards. Indeed, when I have not had a card with me, I have always felt better towards the organisation when they have taken my membership on trust (Dungeness) and been quite miffed when they did not (Loch Garten).
All the best
On the topic itself, I have been an adult member of the RSPB for 34 years. I joined as a 13 year old but was unaware of the YOC or similar so joined as an adult and was happy to pay the full membership. My interest and love of nature was unique in my family but I have educated them all (as well as myself) over the last three decades. There would have been years within that period when I suspect that I did not visit an RSPB reserve during the course of an entire year as I tend to have longstanding patches when not twitching or travelling abroad. I have absolutely no objection to the RSPB not checking membership cards. Indeed, when I have not had a card with me, I have always felt better towards the organisation when they have taken my membership on trust (Dungeness) and been quite miffed when they did not (Loch Garten).
All the best
Paul Chapman
Well-known member
kb57
Well-known member
I (re) joined RSPB with my wife a few years back on the strength of saving money on visits to Leighton Moss, where they do police entry. So I think my initial motivations were not entirely altruistic, but were more financial in nature. Being a member did motivate me to visit other reserves, and I must also admit - like Ian - being a little put out initially that they weren't like LM, and I could've either visited for free, or just paid for parking- with the latter not always policed that strictly. However, after further thought I concluded that the benefits of encouraging people to visit places like Saltholme required a more open and welcoming approach...and the nice staff at Burton Mere Wetlands were going to let me in without my card anyway when I was struggling to find it. I also think it is a good policy that if people can walk or cycle to many reserves they get in free. Better than having to get a permit in advance and go in an organised group, which I recall was the deal with Leighton Moss in the 1970s.
I've kept my membership up, and will do so irrespective of whether I derive any financial benefits, because although RSPB as an organisation are not always above criticism, I believe they are a force for good which birders should support. I'm still maybe more likely to visit an RSPB reserve because I'm a member, but I don't think we should fret about the monetary value or exclusivity or otherwise of our privileges.
I've kept my membership up, and will do so irrespective of whether I derive any financial benefits, because although RSPB as an organisation are not always above criticism, I believe they are a force for good which birders should support. I'm still maybe more likely to visit an RSPB reserve because I'm a member, but I don't think we should fret about the monetary value or exclusivity or otherwise of our privileges.
Simon Wates
Well-known member
Love this post, Lets not make BF into Bird Faceache but a "like button" should be installed for posts like this - what gallantry! :t:
The trouble is, Ian, that any proposal phrased in an authoritarian way, any demand made in an authoritarian way, and any plea to make things more reasonable phrased in an authoritarian way just make me more determined to make things difficult for the would-be authoritarian.
Of course, my resistance to such would-be authoritarians is non-confrontational, because usually they will otherwise respond passive-aggressively, claiming their view is of course 'reasonable' and mine insignificant. By being non-confrontational, one can expose linear and literal thinking as inadequate, thus frustrating and annoying the would-be authoritarian in ways that remain mysterious to such people.
32 years in the Forces provided me with the perfect training-ground for developing successful non-confrontational strategies to combat would-be authoritarians, and now I've been retired for almost a quarter-century, I am sure that Official Secrets Act no longer applies in this matter and so I've decided to reveal all!
MJB
MJB
Well-known member
I must return to the Algarve in the not too distant future, should the residents and expats deem me not unwelcome!:eek!:
MJB
Simon Wates
Well-known member
Well said.
It would be a good idea if anyone interested in birds joined at least one organisation which supports birds or nature.
We can all find fault with any charity run by human beings who aren't perfect and do make mistakes.
Locally the National Trust and the Cumbria Wildlife Trust are doing a lot of good work.
The NT have created a marvellous wetland site in hitherto useless grazing land and the transformation in wildlife is something to behold.
The CWT have done a remarkable job creating a raised bog at Foulshaw and monitored the Ospreys which return every year to breed there.
So I've joined both organisations, but let my RSPB membership lapse as funds only stretch so far.
Paul Longland
Well-known member
If the OP is so keen on RSPB checking cards in hides then I would suggest that he tries a stint as a volunteer himself, as see how popular he would be.
I like many others happily pay my membership fees as I wish to support the sterling work done by the organisation in preserving the wildlife of this country for future generations to hopefully enjoy and not simply as a means of gaining cheap entrance to reserves.
The suggestion that volunteers should check membership cards in hides etc is frankly absurd. If they were asked to do this I wonder how many would simply quit. Remember most volunteers give up their time and energy for the love of nature, not to be an unpaid revenue collector. I accept that many of the larger sites have paid wardens etc, but once again these are generally qualified ecologists or land managers who's time is better paid for in undertaking the actual management of the reserves.
If we want to encourage the next generation of nature lovers and conservationists, then the RSPB need to attract people through the gates to be able see these things for themselves rather than focusing on a few entrance fees. (fare dodgers will always find a way to avoid payment regardless and would in most probability be the ones most likely to offer abuse if challenged).
I am sure that reserves like Titchwell (public right of way aside) do pretty well in bringing in plenty of revenue through the café and shop etc. (check out the Pasties they are really good and just what the doctor ordered on a winters day).
If you make people welcome you will benefit in the long term (ancillary sales, Binocular hire, membership fees etc). I regularly spend money in the shops and cafes on these reserves but have never spent a single penny at a WWT reserve after being charged £12 or so to get in and then badgered for gift aid etc.
Everyone is entitled to their opinions but should also be willing to accept that sometimes there is a bigger picture and long term sustainability is far better than short term gain.
I suspect that having paid for a membership there is no little sour grapes here that others might be getting something for free? Access to our natural heritage should be a right not a privilege. Those of us who choose to contribute to its upkeep do so willingly and should support those who give up their time as volunteers rather than criticising when things do not fit their own view of the world..
I like many others happily pay my membership fees as I wish to support the sterling work done by the organisation in preserving the wildlife of this country for future generations to hopefully enjoy and not simply as a means of gaining cheap entrance to reserves.
The suggestion that volunteers should check membership cards in hides etc is frankly absurd. If they were asked to do this I wonder how many would simply quit. Remember most volunteers give up their time and energy for the love of nature, not to be an unpaid revenue collector. I accept that many of the larger sites have paid wardens etc, but once again these are generally qualified ecologists or land managers who's time is better paid for in undertaking the actual management of the reserves.
If we want to encourage the next generation of nature lovers and conservationists, then the RSPB need to attract people through the gates to be able see these things for themselves rather than focusing on a few entrance fees. (fare dodgers will always find a way to avoid payment regardless and would in most probability be the ones most likely to offer abuse if challenged).
I am sure that reserves like Titchwell (public right of way aside) do pretty well in bringing in plenty of revenue through the café and shop etc. (check out the Pasties they are really good and just what the doctor ordered on a winters day).
If you make people welcome you will benefit in the long term (ancillary sales, Binocular hire, membership fees etc). I regularly spend money in the shops and cafes on these reserves but have never spent a single penny at a WWT reserve after being charged £12 or so to get in and then badgered for gift aid etc.
Everyone is entitled to their opinions but should also be willing to accept that sometimes there is a bigger picture and long term sustainability is far better than short term gain.
I suspect that having paid for a membership there is no little sour grapes here that others might be getting something for free? Access to our natural heritage should be a right not a privilege. Those of us who choose to contribute to its upkeep do so willingly and should support those who give up their time as volunteers rather than criticising when things do not fit their own view of the world..
