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What binoculars have the best build quality? (1 Viewer)

BAD example. These Steiners quickly got a reputation as being anything but tough. So the German army ditched them rather quickly and switched back to Hensoldt (=Zeiss), the Fero-D series (8x30, 7x50, 10x50).

Hermann
They look tough! But I will take your word for it. I am not a binocular historian. Steiner claims their binoculars are highly respected in the military. Is it just this model that was not that tough or all Steiners?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfH7vv8Acts
 
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Steiners have to be tough, they are reputed to be difficult, if not impossible to repair. They're glued together and Bill Cook refers to them as "disposable binoculars". There is a video on YouTube showing the manufacture of what appear to Steiner 7x50‘s. Prisms cemented in place and objective covers glued on with what looks like RTV rubber.
 
Hermann is correct regarding the steiners.. even the original Hensoldts DFs (DF-12) issued prior to the Steiners were preferred, until the new Zeiss Group (hensoldt) Fero D-16 8X32s, 7X50s D-18? and 10X50s D-19? replaced them.
You can fix a Hensoldt D-12 but as Bill said the, Steiners were thrown out with any problems.

A.W.
 
BAD example. These Steiners quickly got a reputation as being anything but tough. So the German army ditched them rather quickly and switched back to Hensoldt (=Zeiss), the Fero-D series (8x30, 7x50, 10x50).

Hermann

Hi, Neil and Hermann:

Even though they were incredibly popular with the northwest fishing fleet-Americans were prone to being happy looking through a rusty pipe if it had a GERMAN name on the sides or back-it took 15 years for me to bring them on at Captain's and only then with the understanding I would bring them on only owing to certain merits. There would not be any "shuck and jive." And that auto-focus fraud would be properly dealt with the moment it should pop up!

Years earlier, the Steiner rep told me Steiner sold to "22 of the world's armies and navies." He showed me a photo of Karl Steiner with a tire of his Mercedes parked atop a Steiner binocular. "Is that impressive, or what?" he asked. That was the start of my mantra: "Good advertising need not be accurate or even meaningful. It needs only to be believed." I walked to my collection of good BAD EXAMPLES, grabbed an old TASCO and headed to the parking lot of Fishermen's Terminal with the rep in-tow.

I wrapped the TASCO in one thickness of a towel, laid it on the asphalt, and pulled my maxed-out Chevy pickup on top of it. The Steiner rep wasn't impressed, especially when I showed him not only did the body not fracture but that the collimation was barely altered! I didn't place an order.

Months later, when Sven Harms was in Steiner marketing for Pioneer Research, he told me "Steiner doesn't sell to 22 armies and navies ... just one ... the biggest." I didn't tell him that the previous brag came from the lips of one of his representatives.

From the time Sven learned I wasn't going to swoon at all the over the top showmanship in the Steiner ads, he toned it down and became someone I could trust. He knew I wasn't going to be impressed with all flowery "technical" talk that sucked in the inexperienced and easily impressed by the droves.

In 2008, Steiner became part of Beretta Holding and today most of these great "German" binoculars come from Asia. With me gone and Captain's having sold in 2015, the waves have closed over my head and some of the finest names in binoculars went the way of the world. Today, their main thrust in binoculars is the Asian Steiners-although they do show the Fujinon MTR-SX, one telescope of which I cut in two as a display.

And, I am sure Jim (the new owner) is unaware that 50 years of that "Established 1897," was given him on a silver platter. Longtime own Leonard Shrock only gave its history as dating from 1947, when he bought the company. However, when I was director of advertising and marketing as an adjunct responsibility, I reasoned that since the product lines had essentially remained the same, the services were still the same, and the business philosophies had remained the same, there was no reason to truncate its history from the original date of operation-1897.

I know it is just vanity, but I feel like a man who has watched as his child has been strangled. If maturity ever overtakes me (doubtful) I will know ... it wasn't really MY child to start with. :cat:

Bill
 
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Bill. So are the Steiner's tough or not so tough? Or are they pretty tough but not battle tough?

You will find Steiner's made in Germany; you will find them made in Asian countries. First, let me say they're NOT as tough as Steiner owners like to brag. But, as you have heard me harp, on binocular forums perception is reality ... to some people, at least. As far as the Navy's wimpy "drop test" goes, (performed in the early '90s) the GERMAN Steiners and Swarovskis were at the top. But, in a HOT environment the rubber swelled and bubbled fairly easily. So, what constitutes "tough"?

My concern was deeper. The instrument the rep brought to show me was out of alignment so bad I could see around trees. But, because it was a Steiner, I was supposed to be impressed. As with MOST things, I found the name meant nothing; the PRODUCT meant everything. That's why I was saddened when their Zeiss-style NAVIGATOR was turned into one of those squatty things. That product-before the transformation-was a really a good performer. :cat:

Bill
 
You will find Steiner's made in Germany; you will find them made in Asian countries. First, let me say they're NOT as tough as Steiner owners like to brag. But, as you have heard me harp, on binocular forums perception is reality ... to some people, at least. As far as the Navy's wimpy "drop test" goes, (performed in the early '90s) the GERMAN Steiners and Swarovskis were at the top. But, in a HOT environment the rubber swelled and bubbled fairly easily. So, what constitutes "tough"?

My concern was deeper. The instrument the rep brought to show me was out of alignment so bad I could see around trees. But, because it was a Steiner, I was supposed to be impressed. As with MOST things, I found the name meant nothing; the PRODUCT meant everything. That's why I was saddened when their Zeiss-style NAVIGATOR was turned into one of those squatty things. That product-before the transformation-was a really a good performer. :cat:

Bill
It sounds like you don't think too highly of Steiner products. Thanks, for the experienced insight. Not too many members on Bird Forum seem to use them either. A light went off in my head the other day and it was concerning a lot of things you say. And you know what you are right. Perception is reality is so true and your feelings on subjective binocular reviews is right on. I am going to have to read your book if it is not over my head. Is it written in layman terms?
 
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Bill,

Was there any reason why the US dropped the Steiner M22 7X50 and went to the Fuji 7X50. Some of the guys who were in Desert Storm said the 7X50 case armor cracked often.

A.W.
 
It sounds like you don't think too highly of Steiner products. Thanks, for the experienced insight. Not too many members on Bird Forum seem to use them either. A light went off in my head the other day and it was concerning a lot of things you say. And you know what you are right. Perception is reality is so true and your feelings on subjective binocular reviews is right on. I am going to have to read your book if it is not over my head. Is it written in layman terms?

Hey, yer dudeness:

I use contractions, concepts that can be understood, and several anecdotes. At the expense of being showy (What? ... ME? ...never!) have a look at the attached relative to ease of understanding. Thus, I would like your opinion of the book. I CAN write in geekese. However, I usually see no value in it. At least if you're trying to communicate. I was frustrated by many of my professors at UW who spent more time trying to convince me of their brilliance than teach me.

"Too often an education goes to the HEAD and not to the MIND."-Bill Cook :cat:

Bill

PS I can be impressed by PRODUCTS much more than NAMES!
 

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Bill,

Was there any reason why the US dropped the Steiner M22 7X50 and went to the Fuji 7X50. Some of the guys who were in Desert Storm said the 7X50 case armor cracked often.

A.W.

Hi, Andy:

In so many ways REALITY trumps opinion, especially of the inexperienced. Be careful saying "FUJINON" because they come from a number of OEMs with as many quality levels. The Fujinon AR (Kamakura) (M22) was easily repaired. However, some genius in Washington determined we should not repair binoculars, anymore. I think there were a number of reasons for the change, not the least of which being cost and ease of working with the supplier.

When I was picking up gear at the Coast Guard Station in Seattle, I came across half a pallet of MK28, 32, and 45 binos destined for the government landfill south of Bremerton. I told the commandant of the station that still being usable after 50 years of hard service including WWII SHOULD tell somebody something. In addition, I had parts for those binos back in the shop that were hermetically sealed in the early 50s. But, of course, the government knows it all!

Finally, I have sent a number of observers to Captain's to purchase hard-to-find parts out of my binocular "bone yard." No more. I talked to Skip last week and he said at the time of the move the new owner had most of that "junk" thrown into a dumpster and hauled away. :cat:

Bill
 
Your book sounds like it is easy to comprehend. I don't like to read stuff that is very technical but rather something that explains things in an understandable way. It sounds like the Navy was pretty wasteful. Typical for a big bureaucracy. What brand and type of binoculars did the Navy use primarily?
 
Your book sounds like it is easy to comprehend. I don't like to read stuff that is very technical but rather something that explains things in an understandable way. It sounds like the Navy was pretty wasteful. Typical for a big bureaucracy. What brand and type of binoculars did the Navy use primarily?

Those that came to USS Grand Canyon were primarily Mk 28 with Mk 32 close behind. Way in the rear was the Mk 45 which was used primarily in sub service since it could be left topside. :cat:

Bill
 
Hi,

The first edition of my book was only 300 copies which sold out within a couple of weeks.

I am currently working on an updated edition which will cover a lot more rare and accurate information on the Trinovid series. This forum will be the first to know when it is available (and my solicitor has covered the legal jargon !!!!!)

Gary.

Gary

Gary,... if you get around to reading this,... what happened to the update of your book? It's been 2-1/2 years since you mentioned this, so I thought I'd ask as I'm sure others may have wondered also.

Keep in mind those of us old enough to both own, and appreciate the
ergonomics and build quality of the Series 2 Trinovids,... aren't "Spring Chickens" any longer. So your most appreciative market target is dwindling ;) (I just turned 64)

cheers,
Joe T
 
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