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The next Alpha technology - electronics will be the next frontier for alpha glass

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Old Friday 15th November 2019, 00:42   #51
SeldomPerched
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Huh? How many boomers are in the workforce? 64-74 years old? 1945-1955.
It's not their world, it's subsequent generation's world. Do what you want.
So at what point does it cease to be a person's world? They tried that argument in politics. It is surely as much an older person's world as anybody else's.
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Old Friday 15th November 2019, 07:37   #52
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A fascinating discussion and one ideally suited to Ruffled Feathers.
In the meantime: back to binoculars..........

Lee
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Old Friday 15th November 2019, 09:01   #53
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So at what point does it cease to be a person's world? They tried that argument in politics. It is surely as much an older person's world as anybody else's.
I deleted my previous response as it's been pointed out they were either too off topic or too provocative, or both. And, that's OK.

I'll just say, Seldom, that I agree with you.
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Old Friday 15th November 2019, 12:54   #54
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Originally Posted by Troubador View Post
A fascinating discussion and one ideally suited to Ruffled Feathers.
In the meantime: back to binoculars..........

Lee
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Aaaww...!!!
Just as this thread was getting fun...

I love it on this forum when a thread gradually goes OT. One learns so much about one's fellow forum members.

For myself, I'm a bit of a Luddite, and have a deep-seated conviction that binoculars ought not to require batteries, nor contain any other technology that can spontaneously leak or significantly degrade to cause them to cease to function or be irreparable in years to come. From this standpoint, my Swarovski ELs are just about acceptable...

I have a pair of Zeiss Jena Deltrintems from the mid 1950s, and as far as I can see, they have never been taken apart for interior cleaning - and they barely need it - their interior is almost as clean as many of my binoculars from the last decade (and a good bit cleaner than some I've had). They are built from materials that have lasted over 60 years without significant deterioration. even the focusing is smooth and easy (good engineering and quality grease, I guess). Aside from the lack of multi-coating and modern fluorite-rich glasses, the optics are pretty darn sharp, and the view is very satisfying.

I have to concur with Bill (WJC) that things haven't come as far in the last 60 years as the advertisers might lead us to believe...

That said, my Swarovski ELs do delight me every time I look through them.
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Old Friday 15th November 2019, 15:22   #55
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We can decry technology all we want. We can say the technology is not there, or that it has already been tried and failed. Technology will advance (likely for as much evil as good) and it matters not one hoot what we think about it. The younger people have grown up with it and will continue to demand it. They are a growing segment of the population, older folks are declining.

I further opine that it won't be what we would readily identify as a recognized brand to do it (with some sort of new fangled optical contrivance or another) either.

I have always had the opinion that the job of a marketer is to make us think that buying their stuff was really our idea. I therefore find myself in agreement with Bill's position.

We can take comfort in the notion that the current glass lensed optics we have are about as good as they are are going to get. Yet another reason to give way to more technology.
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Old Friday 15th November 2019, 18:36   #56
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We can decry technology all we want. We can say the technology is not there, or that it has already been tried and failed. Technology will advance (likely for as much evil as good) and it matters not one hoot what we think about it. The younger people have grown up with it and will continue to demand it. They are a growing segment of the population, older folks are declining.
A portion of younger people are using Film cameras now and even buying vinyl records. When Millennials are older some (or many?) may continue to use non-electronic binos just like the ones we use now. If some of them are using film cameras then it makes sense they make keep 'old fashioned' binoculars around too.

https://www.keh.com/blog/why-millenn...gital-cameras/
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Old Friday 15th November 2019, 22:12   #57
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As a general point, I was not advocating removal of traditional binoculars. I plan on keeping mine. Yes, not everyone will fully embrace the digital trend. What that percentage will be , who can say. Digital optics these days are about the same point of comparative technology as Galileo's telescope.
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Old Friday 15th November 2019, 23:03   #58
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I deleted my previous response as it's been pointed out they were either too off topic or too provocative, or both. And, that's OK.

I'll just say, Seldom, that I agree with you.
I think I missed your previous response as I've only just logged on. Anyway, everything's fine. Thank you, Kevin. :-)
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Old Saturday 16th November 2019, 07:34   #59
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Exclamation

This thread is really funny !
It's giving me a good chuckle to read the highly amusing grumblings of all the horse and buggy drivers and other living 'fossils'

Never mind whether we will have 'analogue' or 'digital' optics, or a choice or both There will be much bigger fish to fry ......

Honestly, baby boomers, and other 'old' people, I think you'll be lucky - very very lucky, if the youngsters don't turn you all into Soylent Green !





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Old Saturday 16th November 2019, 12:38   #60
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Originally Posted by Chosun Juan View Post
This thread is really funny !
It's giving me a good chuckle to read the highly amusing grumblings of all the horse and buggy drivers and other living 'fossils'

Never mind whether we will have 'analogue' or 'digital' optics, or a choice or both There will be much bigger fish to fry ......

Honestly, baby boomers, and other 'old' people, I think you'll be lucky - very very lucky, if the youngsters don't turn you all into Soylent Green !





Chosun
If you know what Soylent Green is ... you might be getting old

Last edited by Gilmore Girl : Saturday 16th November 2019 at 17:31. Reason: Removed part about generations per moderator warning posted earlier
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Old Saturday 16th November 2019, 17:43   #61
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Originally Posted by Gilmore Girl View Post
If you know what Soylent Green is ... you might be getting old
And just when we thought no producer was investing in IS, up pops an ad on my BF for Opticron Imagic IS 10x30!!! With very respectable 5.2 degree FOV. Has anyone seen a unit yet? Good price too. And a respectable and approachable company. I've never seen or owned an Opticron product that I didn't like. Remember the Taiga? A low-cost reverse porro compact that could match the Leica UV 8x20 optically.
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Old Saturday 16th November 2019, 23:06   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilmore Girl View Post
If you know what Soylent Green is ... you might be getting old
Lol My biological age feels like it's about to clock triple digits !

GiGi, you'd be surprised for how many decades American TV shows/films re-ran on tellie here ! I was shattered to find out that the original Star Trek was only made for a few seasons - it seemed like decades !

I loved re-runs of all the Sci-fi stuff growing up - from the Jetsons, to Thunderbirds, UFO, Space 1999, Blake's Seven, Barbarella, Soylent Green, Logan's Run, Blade Runner, Mad Max, The Fifth Element, Total Recall, The Island, Under the Skin, ........ and on and on and on .......
I'm a bit future mad !

Perhaps all because my Uncle was a fantastic artist and drew me Spaceships when I was about six years old, and also because my Dad loved space stuff too - so that was one of our bonds

It doesn't matter if 'old fogey's' just want to sit down quietly in a rocking chair with a nice cup of tea and talk about Porro binoculars ......... kids are always going to race towards the future - and that's a pretty much unstoppable force !

Considering my only real bird watching friend is in his mid 80's lol, and having seen the inner workings of the electronics industry, I'm very happy to remain 'analogue' for now, I'm also happy to cross time and space to live only in the now - it's so liberating not to wear a watch ! ....... but I'm also keeping an eye on what the clever humans can bring to the future ...... maybe one day ..........

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Old Sunday 17th November 2019, 00:05   #63
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Omg you're really bringing me back with Logans Run and Space 1999, etc.
I loved all that stuff too. I really like the original Star Trek and catch episodes here and
there on the oldies channels. I have barebones basic cable tv so it's several
oldies Channels , the local news and that's about it.

That first pic you posted is hilarious! Apparently everyone in the future wears shiny clothing and the same
outfits according to those old movies and tv shows.

Last edited by Gilmore Girl : Sunday 17th November 2019 at 00:06. Reason: Fixed typo
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Old Sunday 17th November 2019, 00:19   #64
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Chosun one, you have a good imagination. How far are you prepared to go in investing in optics in
the vast binocular world ?

The Zenray had an out of this world name, is that what sold you ?

Jerry
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Old Sunday 17th November 2019, 09:40   #65
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Hello Chosen Juan (post 62),

Nice post , I also look to the future and wonder what will happen next , but perversely avidly read the old Sci-Fi and watch the old movies.

Don't write us "old fogies" off yet.

.

Cheers.
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Old Sunday 17th November 2019, 11:07   #66
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Originally Posted by WJC View Post
..
Today's world is full of knowledge but is running on empty when it comes to wisdom.
Knowledge teaches us that a tomato is a fruit, not a vegetable. But it is wisdom that teaches us not to put it into a fruit salad.

Bill
Well said!
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Old Sunday 17th November 2019, 20:02   #67
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I found these on a shelf in TKMaxx today. At first glance I thought 'Low cost integrated digi-binos with star gazing app!'. Imagine my utter despair when I realized they're cheap 7x binos with a phone holder on top. You have to download a star app onto your own phone and put it in the holder. Whatever will they think of next, eh?
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Old Monday 18th November 2019, 02:47   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilmore Girl View Post
Omg ..... Apparently everyone in the future wears shiny clothing and the same
outfits according to those old movies and tv shows.
Not to mention the purple wigs !
Unless there's some high tech trickery to them then I imagine there would be a few purple afros on low humidity days !




Chosun

Last edited by Chosun Juan : Monday 18th November 2019 at 03:04. Reason: Spellun n dat
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Old Monday 18th November 2019, 03:03   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NDhunter View Post
Chosun one, you have a good imagination. How far are you prepared to go in investing in optics in
the vast binocular world ?

The Zenray had an out of this world name, is that what sold you ?

Jerry
Jerry, well if it is a business expense then money is no object ....
Do you mean for my personal use or as a business venture? Classical Optics? Electronic? or Hybrid? Other?

Yes, indubitably. It was the "out of this world name"

Of course the best on market ergonomics, 'alpha' class or better CA and astigmatism handling, wide field of view, fast large knurled aloominum clockwise to infinity focuser, relatively light weight (lighter than an SF ) , and neutral colour rendition are just icing on the cake




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Old Monday 18th November 2019, 04:05   #70
Chosun Juan
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Originally Posted by Steve C View Post
We can decry technology all we want. We can say the technology is not there, or that it has already been tried and failed. Technology will advance (likely for as much evil as good) and it matters not one hoot what we think about it. The younger people have grown up with it and will continue to demand it. They are a growing segment of the population, older folks are declining.

I further opine that it won't be what we would readily identify as a recognized brand to do it (with some sort of new fangled optical contrivance or another) either.

I have always had the opinion that the job of a marketer is to make us think that buying their stuff was really our idea. I therefore find myself in agreement with Bill's position.

We can take comfort in the notion that the current glass lensed optics we have are about as good as they are are going to get. Yet another reason to give way to more technology.
Steve, I agree the current optical technology frog is very close to the wall. I would say there is some materials engineering and manufacturing sophistication to come - and putting the best of the best together may deliver a detectably better view - certainly lighter and ultimately in real terms cheaper.

Apart from kids and rocketships, yes, the other big driver for advances in the electronic realm is mil-tac applications ...... unfortunately

I believe we will see Sony back in the game at some stage with a further generational model upgrade to the DEV-50V. They have EVF's that can do 5.76 Million dots resolution or 120p (but not together as of yet) - I think I'd like quite a bit more than that - particularly on the frame scan rate. I'm sure I'm going to want more than 12x too - zooming in to 24x or 48x or 96x or more? I'd like true binocular vision from twin ~1" BSI sensors too. The delays will come in the capture and connectivity demanded and the transfer/sharing apps. I think any workable (comfortably usable) solution is likely to come from an established Electronics/Optics Co collaboration - at an alpha+ price.

Panasonic, Samsung, they'd be great platforms to get in on the caper too ..... of course all the big players have existing markets and niches to protect - so like photographic gear, offers are likely to fall annoyingly short in some areas to keep you buying ......

Also, and perhaps regrettably I agree, we are going to see a lot of junk, rubbish toys, and very average performers as well ......

Perhaps one of the more useful of those gadgets will be an ordinary smartphone with binocular grouped cameras as I outlined before. Ergonomics will be taken care of by a flip up VR headset type mount - not sure I'd want to be wearing that hopping around the edge of any escarpments though ......




Chosun

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