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Snakebite UK (1 Viewer)

Farnboro John

Well-known member
Recently two people I know have managed to get themselves bitten by Adders: one was Mark Hows, who has put details on his blog reachable from a picture of the culprit (which he was trying to help - how's that song go again "you knew I was a snake before you took me in"?)

The other shall be nameless but I shall relate the circumstances.

They were approaching a tin sheet to check for Adders underneath it. A widespread practice, but what apparently they didn't know is that in warm weather Adders frequently lie out near enough to the tin to get back under it in case of threat.

This one didn't get back in time to avoid the clumping great foot that came down next to it - which it promptly bit. Luckily it was a warning bite and the victim insists the snake did not inject. Not something you can depend on!

So - if you must go looking for Adders - remember they may not be where you want them to be.

Incidentally if Mark reads this, I would like to know how much it hurt, for how long, and what treatment he was offered at hospital. I seem to recall hearing that with modern knowledge of anaphylaxis, the preferred treatment is just pain relief?

John
 
Could you give me a link to the picture?

About the second guy:
did he insist that the snake didn't inject any venom (known as a "dry bite") immediately, or did he wait a while (up to 30 min)? If he did the first, then he isn't very smart... although Adders aren't that dangerous, the normal procedure is to go to hospital, JUST IN CASE. You'll get a tetanus shot, if nothing else...

1st:
well, you say that the Adder needed help. Was it tangled in something? If so, then I'm not surprised it wanted to bite. Any snake that is in a situation like that will bite first, ask questions later, but as you start to free it, it calms down, making it a lot easier to free it. Anyway, please put the link to the pic and the story, I want to read it.
 
As to the first, I'm not sure as the incident was reported to me (cos I know the guy) rather than first-hand. Given that he probably wasn't in an urban situation he may well have had little choice about finding out from the passage of time, his best option may have been walking towards his car despite advice being to remain still and calm. If I hear more I'll post it here.

The second one - well, the Adder was found on a road. Our traffic is heavy everywhere these days and I guess he believed if it stayed in the road it would get run over. He might well be right. I think if I had been feeling benevolent towards it I might have used a long stick to move it, he chose thick gloves.

I'm sorry, I'm thick when it comes to links and stuff, you'll find it in the Mammals gallery on the Surfbirds website.

Must admit I hadn't thought of tetanus but its obvious now you mention it.

Cheers

John
 
He had plenty of time. Your average adult human can survive an Adder bite with no medical treatment whatsoever. I'm dealing with Nose-horned Vipers, which are Europe's most venomous snake, and if I ever get bitten by one, I'd definitely wait 30min (the only exception: I get bit in a vein or head or torso- then I'd call the medics and tell them of my situation).
Your best and safest course of action concerning a snakebite is to sit still (definitely DON'T walk/run- it speeds up the spreading of the venom! Talking should also be kept to a minimum), lie down if possible, keep calm and call the paramedics and inform them of your situation. More details here: http://www.zh.zadweb.biz.hr/opce/Prva pomoc.htm

He was certainly right what the Adder would get run over. He did the best possible thing he could've done, given the situation. Too bad he got bit, though...
Using a stick to remove a snake from a road where you've got cars coming every few seconds (or even a higher density) would only ensure that you also get run over, unless you know exactly how to utilize the stick to your advantage (then you only need the snake's cooperation...). Thick leather welding gloves (the thicker the better) would work best in this situation, but they don't make you invulnerable. They can protect you from glancing hits & scrapes, but if the bite is "head on" right above something solid, the glove will probably be pierced, but it will probably absorb a lot of the kinetic energy and the fangs won't pierce your skin (or won't go in deep). That's for Adders, which have 4mm long fangs (large adults). The situation is different for Nose-horned Vipers, which have 1cm long fangs...

Tetanus is also just as a precautionary measure.

P.S.- how to include a link in a post on BirdForum (since I can't find the link on my own...):
*open the website which's link you want to include in your post.
*select the link text with your mouse, right click on it, click on "copy" in the pop-up menu that opens.
*go to the post you're writing on BF, right click on the location in the text where you want to include the link, select "paste" from the pop-up menu (make sure that you have at least one space before and after the link).
*finish writing your text and post it.
(Note: on some other forums you need to use a url tag, but on BF you don't have to do this. You also have the "insert link" button above the text box, but I don't use it.)
 
Reminds me of the time that I was wandering around Studland looking for Adders to photograph. After about an hour of fruitless searching under every piece of scrap I could find. I turned to my girlfriend to say it was a b###dy useless day and she told me to look down. It turned out that I was standing on the tail of a rather large female who was busy striking at my foot.
 
Hi there

I am sorry to hear the story about the unfortunate set set of circumstances attached to being bitten by adders with two people involved, Mark Hows, and the other person. Not much fun.

A few years ago a young friend (my age) was bitten by an Adder, while a group of us where walking about the Scottish Highlands.
While walking through dense heather, she stopped, sat on a rock, and bent down to tie her lace of her boot. She felt a jab in the top of her wrist, and thought nothing more of it.

She said she thought she had been pricked by a thorn on her wrist area, said "ouch", and that was that.
Looking back now, it appeared that she had disturbed an adder by a mistake, it must bitten her in fear, and she never saw it at her feet or any sign of it disappearing at all

She said she began to feel very woozy with the affects of the bite, and we knew that she had to go to hospital to be checked. We all thought it was something else serious, as she did not know that she had been bitten in the first place.

Her whole arm just ballooned to three times its normal thickness as well as turning a sickly jaundiced shade of yellow. She has to be given an anti-venom to counteract the poison. It was the most unpleasant experience she said she had to me.
A few days in hospital was part of the course. She was not feeling too great for a while, but recovered fully, and was fine in no time at all.

I remember looking at her wrist and you could see the fang marks - two of them just at the area where her hand and wrist joined each other and they are very apparent, and easy to see.

In her case she was all right, but I think that some people may be very reactive to snake venom, and become affected badly if they have the misfortune of being bitten at all. Of course like all snake bites it depends on your state of health, how fit you are, you have a strong heart too etc... Adders venom rarely kills people thank goodness.

I do not remember her mentioning anything about tetanus injections at all. Painkillers where not mentioned unless it was part of the course.

In her case she was not aware she had been bitten at all, and carried on walking. Luckily it was close to the end of her walk and she suffered her ill effects once back in civilization.

It took a long time for the swelling in her arm to go down, and look normal again.

It was a brush with nature. I have read that Adders, can be anywhere in Scotland. Their favourite places are open roadways and tracks (anywhere they can sun themselves). They just want to disappear fast, and are very likely to do that if they know you are there.

I would take precautions in a big way, if I ever tried to handle one of them at all :eek!:.

I hope this has given the flavour here :eek!:
 
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Painkillers are generally not given, because the doctors want you to tell them if the pain is progressing or not after the first dose of antivenom. Then they decide if you need more or not.

Thanks for the link.

Oh, and one more thing, if you do receive antivenom for a snakebite, and you get bitten again some time later (I hope not, but you never know...) make sure that the doctors know which antivenom you got and how much. Because if you weren't allergic to antivenom the first time, you could be allergic the second time... It's not too serious if you're in the hospital, they just give you adrenalin (or something like that) if you have an allergic reaction... it's more dangerous in the field. That's why it is recommended NOT to have antivenom with you and definitely NOT TO INJECT IT WHEN YOU GET BIT.
 
Painkillers are generally not given, because the doctors want you to tell them if the pain is progressing or not after the first dose of antivenom. Then they decide if you need more or not.

Thanks for the link.

Oh, and one more thing, if you do receive antivenom for a snakebite, and you get bitten again some time later (I hope not, but you never know...) make sure that the doctors know which antivenom you got and how much. Because if you weren't allergic to antivenom the first time, you could be allergic the second time... It's not too serious if you're in the hospital, they just give you adrenalin (or something like that) if you have an allergic reaction... it's more dangerous in the field. That's why it is recommended NOT to have antivenom with you and definitely NOT TO INJECT IT WHEN YOU GET BIT.

hi Miz

Thank you for your information here

I did not know the issue surrounding the administering the anti-venom at all So it is a good point to put across here. The hospital staff are the people who know what they are doing, and for people not to take risks at all. Let the professionals do what is right for you. ;)

Better not to tamper with anything to do with anti-venom at all, if no knowledge at all.

Well pointed out. :t:
 
Jos, where did you find this colour morph??? The colour of the rostral and the belly...and the white upper labials... it's GORGEOUS!!!! I've never seen such a combo of colours on an Adder (the again, I've only seen pics of 'em, not yet had an encounter...)! What's the habitat like?
 
Jos, where did you find this colour morph???

There are two Adders that regularly sun themselves at my local patch, not far from Vilnius (Lithuania). To get the picture of the underside, I ditched the telephoto and edged in close with a standard lens, lying down to get the same level. When close the snake reared up, as in the photograph, to allow me to see the underside ...I like to think the snake was being co-operative ;) though was aware of the possibility of a strike, albeit relatively small in my opinion. I'll post later a picture of the same snake from above.
 
Moral of the story - pretend you don't see the snake in the road, and keep driving....!
That's not the moral of the story! The moral of the story is: DON'T be hasty! Nice and gentle is the key here... and if you don't have the time to be nice and gentle because of traffic, then TAIL the snake, don't get it behind the head.
All European Snakes are protected and all of them are endangered (some at least locally, if not throughout their range), so if you can help, then help, but don't do something stupid. The best thing you can do is educate yourself on the matter- what can you do (as an amateur), who can you call... and, most importantly, DON'T kill them and DON'T LET YOUR FAMILY/FRIENDS/NEIGHBOURS KILL THEM also.
I'm not telling you to become snake experts overnight, nor am I expecting you to, nor do I want you to kiss every snake you see. All I want is for you (by "you" I mean everyone who thinks snakes are yucky, creepy, evil monsters or something like that) to realize that snakes also have a place in this world (even venomous ones!) and that if you find one in your garden and you don't want it there, call someone to come and relocate it. The snake will be happy, you'll be happy and the mice in your garden will be happy.
 
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