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birders start paying for birding. (1 Viewer)

I'd say if you want to introduce a birder stamp, make it optional. That way, those who have the means to make an extra contribution can do so, while those who don't can still enjoy nature reserves.

I think that's a good idea. A birding stamp could easily be collectible like the Duck Stamp; lots of artists to draw from and more bird species to choose to depict on the stamps. Even making it an optional purchase I assume could bring in a good amount of funds for conservation each year.
 
I am a land manager/biologist for a state agency. 85% of my salary is funded via Pittman Robertson/Wildlife & Sport Fish Restoration money. Due to obligations involved with PR money, any land management I do under the grant must benefit huntable game or hunters. While nongame species will also benefit, it would be nice if birders and other nonconsumptive wildlife users would pay some kind of fee/license or tax (some of the ones I've heard mentioned are small fees on binos and birdseed/feeders) that way there would be a pot of money available to biologists/land managers such as myself to fund activities not directly related to wild game or hunters.
 
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I am a land manager/biologist for a state agency. 85% of my salary is funded via Pittman Robertson/Wildlife & Sport Fish Restoration money. Due to obligations involved with PR money, any land management I do under the grant must benefit huntable game or hunters. While nongame species will also benefit, it would be nice if birders and other nonconsumptive wildlife users would pay some kind of fee/license or tax (some of the ones I've heard mentioned are small fees on binos and birdseed/feeders) that way there would be a pot of money available to biologists/land managers such as myself to fund activities not directly related to wild game or hunters.

To be honest, everyone should be contributing financially to conserve nature and wildlife whether they enjoy it or not - it's part of the legacy of the planet that humans seem so bent on destroying.

If only those who realise wildlife has a value are to be made to pay for it (eg via taxes) then there would be little hope for saving any of it if taken to it's ultimate conclusion.

I think I'm trying to say that appreciating nature is not a spectator sport. It's more akin to being a right and a necessity.
 
I agree that everyone should be required to pay some form of a tax, but good luck with that... People don't even want to be taxed to help out other people, much less birds and other fuana/Flora they know nothing about (nor care to learn). I am tasked with restoring/managing 9,000 acres with 2 full time staff and $40K, so I'd take any money someone could throw at me...
 
Actually, you'll find that in Southern European countries bird hunting is practiced by people from all income classes (particularly if commercial or "for the lulz"). Which correlates with their disastrous record regarding migrant birds.

That said, maybe duck stamps should be optional (I thought they used to be, anyway?).
But levying a tax on birding would be disastrous and cement its image as a rich people's sport, giving credit to the identity politics crowd who're already bemoaning the lack of "diversity" in the field. IOW, good luck getting any of this past the Dems.

I did say “much of Europe” not “all of Europe”. Birding in the US is better described as an “educated” person’s sport rather than a “rich” man’s. As far as the diversity cranks are concerned, surely no sensible person pays them any attention at all? Dto for birding’s “image”

Why would you want to make duck (etc) stamps (which bring in substantial funds for habitat protection and other good causes) optional? Hunting is a straight-forward activity comparatively easy to police and tax. Birding, in contrast, is an impossibly diffuse activity from a regulatory standpoint and that, not the things you mention, is the principal argument against a mandatory bird stamp. Optional bird stamps, on the other hand, why not?.
 
How much does a duck stamp cost?
If I am a birdwatcher and want to save on some money birding in the US, would it be a good idea to buy a duck stamp and a shotgun and save on food while birding? I heard food in the US is not very decent.
And I remember, from my childhood, I liked the duck in orange sauce. Or in red wine sauce.

ps: I am not a Russian troll.
pps: I don't mind paying for birding while on holiday, e.g. trails, reserves. I really don't like paying for birding at home though. There just isn't enough nature around here worth paying for.
 
It’s not a refuge if you’re allowed to hunt there though is it? I’m fed up of hunters claiming they’re conserving the natural world when they’re doing no such thing. Here in Britain they claim the same whilst having the nerve to shoot over nature reserves where the wildlife is supposed to be protected. Wildfowlers buy pockets of land bordering important refuges then kill stuff unchecked. 40 million pheasants and partridges released annually, non native species with more biomass than the entire native breeding bird population. Illegal of course or would be were it not for the legal loophole used that these are ‘livestock’. They’re not. And all for a grossly distorted ecosystem favouring hunters’ quarry and with anything predatory systematically removed, eg on thousands of square miles of intensively managed grouse moorland.

It’s about time it’s realised hunting and conservation are flip sides of a coin. You don’t conserve wildlife by killing it. Conservation for hunting is not true conservation. Never has been and never will be. Don’t know about the US but in the U.K. the hunting industry gets away with anything. Fox hunting is illegal but police turn a blind eye as the government sponsors are keen hunters and claim it’s a legal version of hunting.

Don’t try to bridge the divide between birding and hunting. You’re either one of them and turned on by the killing or one of us, and one who cares about birds. I’m not saying we shouldn’t kill animals for food but the shooting industry here at least is out of control and lacking in any morality whatsoever. That’s why hunting is offensive to most birders. Birds need REAL conservation not to be treated as just another commodity.

:clap::clap:
 
I agree that everyone should be required to pay some form of a tax, but good luck with that... People don't even want to be taxed to help out other people, much less birds and other fuana/Flora they know nothing about (nor care to learn). I am tasked with restoring/managing 9,000 acres with 2 full time staff and $40K, so I'd take any money someone could throw at me...

Restoring to and from what?
 
Restoring to and from what?

The property was primarily agriculture but interspersed with residences. It was taken over by the Federal/State government about 50yrs ago and converted back to 'nature'. Unfortunately, 35+ yrs of hands off 'management' has led to the property being invaded by undesirable non-native and pionerring species, early successional habitat being overgrown, and limited structural/species diversity.
We are now actively managing the property to produce high quality wildlife habitat; unfortunately, as I mentioned previously, as most of my (and my crew's) salary is funded via WSFR grant monies, that means game wildlife habitat (there is often overlap with the T/E/R and other nongame species, but not always).

An interesting article regarding funding declines for wildlife management as a direct result of reduced hunter use/interest:
https://theconversation.com/as-hunting-declines-efforts-grow-to-broaden-the-funding-base-for-wildlife-conservation-105792?fbclid=IwAR20nPPn0r8Mk1pFIAQba9mcQAWAzzDiJpZ1aZkmYgPXtnYkIP6WNHs0GHQ

Justin
 
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Yes, I am aware this is the situation for larger commercial enterprises (film making, tours etc, ), but as far as I know this doesn't apply to amateur /casual hobby /incidental photographers Jane Citizen /Joe Bloggs and/or Fred Nerkus ! - nor should it

Any commercial exercise, there is no income trigger! Not in Vic anyway.
 
Here is just an idea of what Texas hunters pay for the use of public lands managed by the state, there is federal hunt fees depending on species. It is not a deal breaker for the US middle class. It is roughly $141.00 per person annually. This is not looking at private lands or club ownership, a totally different discussion .

TEXAS Super Combo Hunting and All-Water Fishing Package

For residents who hunt and fish freshwater and/or salt water, the “Super Combo” package can save purchasers up to $18. It includes the following at a discount price:
•a Resident Hunting License,
•a Resident Fishing License
•and all 5 state endorsements (archery, freshwater fishing, saltwater fishing with a red drum tag, upland game bird and migratory game bird).
•The Federal Duck Stamp is not included.
“Super Combo” License Package (Type 111):$68

Plus

Annual Public Hunting Permit — $48 Full privileges including hunting, fishing, camping, hiking and other recreational uses.


The 2018-19 Federal Duck Stamp: The stamps, which cost $25, are valid from July 1 through June 30, 2018. Duck stamps are a required annual purchase for waterfowl hunters 16 and older, and a current duck stamp grants the bearer free entrance into any national wildlife refuge that charges an entry fee.

BUT there is hope on the way in the Recovering America Wildlife Act (RAWA). It is still in congress for vote.
The Recovering America’s Wildlife Act (H.R. 4647), introduced by Representatives Debbie Dingell (D-Michigan) and Jeff Fortenberry (R-Nebraska) in late 2017, would provide $1.3 billion in dedicated annual funding to state fish and wildlife agencies. The funding would largely go toward conserving and monitoring state-identified at-risk species, known as Species of Greatest Conservation Need (SGCN). The dedicated funds would come from revenue generated by energy and mineral extraction royalties currently collected by the federal government at about $5 billion to $12 billion annually.

Since 2000, state fish and wildlife agencies have pulled from a much smaller funding stream known as the State Wildlife Grants program. This program is vulnerable to the whims of Congressional appropriators each year, though, and it is typically only funded at about $50 million to $60 million annually. Such limited funding only provides state agencies with the ability to address a few of the SGCN-related projects deemed necessary within their conservation action blueprints, known as State Wildlife Action Plans. For example, in fiscal year 2017, wildlife professionals with the New York Department of Environmental Conservation had just $2.3 million to work with in order to conserve more than 350 at-risk species.


I really enjoy the vastly different outlooks on the fees for wildlife use ( hunting/ non-hunting) and different cultural perspective. Please support RAWA
 
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Quote:

Originally Posted by jremmons View Post

. . .An interesting article regarding funding declines for wildlife management as a direct result of reduced hunter use/interest:
https://theconversation.com/as-hunti...nYkIP6WNHs0GHQ

Thanks for the info jremmons: I see that the problem for all parties is lack of communication and understanding in a funding system that dates back to 1934. When America was more rural and hunting more acceptable.
 
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....The 2018-19 Federal Duck Stamp: The stamps, which cost $25, are valid from July 1 through June 30, 2018. Duck stamps are a required annual purchase for waterfowl hunters 16 and older, and a current duck stamp grants the bearer free entrance into any national wildlife refuge that charges an entry fee.....
As has been said multiple times already, if hunting is allowed it's hardly a "refuge" then is it? $25 wouldn't seem to cover the damage done and denial of service (access) to the non-hunting population.

Most of my education on the American situation comes from "Looney Tunes" and whether it is "duck season" or "wabbit season" ! Back on saner ground it seems there is a strong case for "no season" .....

As someone new to the forum, you seem to be providing a lot of regulatory, legislative, and taxation/funding detail for the average casually interested birder (or hunter even) - what's the motive? position? organisation? platform? forum? aim? etc, etc, .......

This seems to be beyond mere curiosity ...... ? :cat:



Chosun :gh:
 
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As someone new to the forum, you seem to be providing a lot of regulatory, legislative, and taxation/funding detail for the average casually interested birder (or hunter even) - what's the motive? position? organisation? platform? forum? aim? etc, etc, .......

This seems to be beyond mere curiosity ...... ? :cat:



Chosun :gh:
Some people just like data, and if they're passionate about a given subject, they'll come prepared.
 
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