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Old Saturday 7th December 2013, 09:41   #21951
john miller
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Originally Posted by RobLucking View Post
The shingle ridge is a natural feature also. What was unnatural was the annual bulldozing of the ridge by the Environment Agency that took place until 2007.

Since 2007 the shingle ridge has been allowed to find its own natural profile and will gradually migrate inland, as Blakeney Point has been doing for years. This will inevitably mean more frequent overtopping of the bank onto the marshes but the improvements the Environment Agency made to the outfall sluices along beach road and the re-routing of the River Glaven was designed to allow more rapid evacuation of flood waters than was possible in 1996. A lot of the ecological damage in 1996 was caused by saltwater sitting on the marshes for weeks. If the saltwater can be evacuated quickly and the water management system purged with freshwater, hopefully the damage to the habitats will be lessened.

Over time, the marshes at Cley and Salthouse will become more saline but will still be fantastic places for wildlife. The freshwater reedbed interest is being re-created by NWT and EA in the Fens at Hilgay.

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Sorry Rob. I meant it was unnatural in its present state ie height, due to bulldozing. It is gradually finding its own level and will be stronger than the loose shingle is,but this will mean salt water gets into the marsh more frequently. The lowering of the Northern end of the East bank should get the water out of Popes marsh and the Kelling/ Salthouse area as fast as the new sluice on the West bank can manage.

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Old Saturday 7th December 2013, 10:14   #21952
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I have had a look at the Titchwell Reserve and this is what it has said about the condition of the boardwalk

Important notice

We are open again but there is limited access to the beach due to the collapse of the beach boardwalk.

Titchwell is our favourite place of all and I hope that that our up and coming week at Norfolk has not been ruined because of the storm!

Any suggestions of inland Reserves area to visit at all?

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Kathy
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Old Saturday 7th December 2013, 11:03   #21953
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Brancaster 0830-1025

Beach Road defences breached in 5 spots. Sure this will be closed by EA on H&S grounds. Gypsy Lane sea defence also breached same applies. Golf driving range produced Jack Snipe, Grey Plover. Stonechat along Beach Rd.

Staircase access to beach, non existent, climb over rocks. Very little left of the dunes towards Titchwell.
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Old Saturday 7th December 2013, 14:50   #21954
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Blakeney Point is natural unlike the shingle ridge, it will survive almost anything that is thrown at it, any breach is soon replaced. What has not survived is the majority of the 100`s of Atlantic Grey Seal pups recently born at the point, along with about 400 lost in the Horsey area.

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Updating this statement, this morning over 1200 seal pups were counted on the point. The previous news I think was based on the Horsey pups lost and the fact nobody could believe the point ones would have survived. Am told the counters were amazed at the survival of virtually all the colony.

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Old Saturday 7th December 2013, 16:13   #21955
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Sheringham seawatching shelter survives!
Despite the promenade in front of the shelter being hammered, the shelter itself seems remarkably intact. Hopefully the council will have it all sorted by August!

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Old Saturday 7th December 2013, 16:37   #21956
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Devastating photos & news on here, so very sad. We have visited your coastline a few years now & have grown to be very fond of it. Thoughts are with you all at this difficult time.
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Old Saturday 7th December 2013, 16:48   #21957
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Peewit, you should be OK visiting Titchwell. I was there yesterday and the beach is accessible, just not via the boardwalk. The staff on site will be able to advise further.

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Old Saturday 7th December 2013, 16:55   #21958
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Sorry Rob. I meant it was unnatural in its present state ie height, due to bulldozing. It is gradually finding its own level and will be stronger than the loose shingle is,but this will mean salt water gets into the marsh more frequently. The lowering of the Northern end of the East bank should get the water out of Popes marsh and the Kelling/ Salthouse area as fast as the new sluice on the West bank can manage.

John
Had a look at Cley today and was encouraged by the rate at which the floodwater seems to be dropping. The new sluices seem to be doing their job!

Not quite as fortunate at Burnham Deepdale where the sea defences have been breached. Not sure how the water will be evacuated from there. Gypsy Lane at Titchwell has also been breached and the fresh marshes at Brancaster are now inundated.

Snettisham has also been badly damaged with one hide destroyed and another lifted off its footings, turned 180 degrees and dropped back at a 45 degree angle.
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Old Saturday 7th December 2013, 17:31   #21959
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Salthouse & Kelling saltmarshes?

Walked along the beach from Kelling to Salthouse Little Eye today. Would have gone further but for the new tidal (?) channel through the shingle ridge which blocked our way! We had wondered why the water seemed to have gone down much faster than 2007, so now we know - it was really racing out, gouging its way. No need to wait for the sluices. The bottom of the channel looks so low that it may be below high tide level in future, so the freshmarshes at Salthouse & Kelling may be saltmarshes in future! Is this what we call 'reprofiling' of the shingle?

Salthouse beach car park is completely lost under the shingle and amazing the way the shingle ridge either side has just been completely flattened.

Few new pics attached: the new channel; Salthouse beach car park looking west from Gramborough; the beach car park, if you can believe it; Salthouse beach road.
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Old Saturday 7th December 2013, 18:42   #21960
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I skirted the edge of Surlingham Church Marsh today - I didn't try, but suspect you'd need waders for the paths down to the river. The birding highlight was a (ringtail) Hen Harrier over at 12:30.
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Old Saturday 7th December 2013, 18:45   #21961
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Today at Blakeney Point there were many seal pups in the dunes. Only six were seen east of the start of the dunes on the Point -two of which were in a bad way while the others were well fed.
Surprised that the total for pups at the Point was 1200 as I understood there were about 500 there two weeks ago and pupping had almost finished. There were seals swimming in water in the depression on the south side of the plantation and also a cow and pup swimming in a pool in the lupins.
The new balcony on the lifeboat station is damaged as is the ramp which was where the lifeboat was launched in days of old.
As expected a lot of shingle has been pushed inland and the top of the shingle ridge now has lost all the docks and small suaeda bushes that had taken root there.
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Old Saturday 7th December 2013, 18:54   #21962
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Originally Posted by Locostella View Post
Hey guys,

We, as all of you must be are still in disbelief at the extent of damage to our coastline, wildlife and people's property. I just wanted to extend an offer of mine and my wife's help in any cleaning up or help people need along the coast in any way whatsoever. If anyone needs, or knows of anyone who needs extra help cleaning up then please inbox me.

Cheers,

Kieran
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Originally Posted by john miller View Post
Updating this statement, this morning over 1200 seal pups were counted on the point. The previous news I think was based on the Horsey pups lost and the fact nobody could believe the point ones would have survived. Am told the counters were amazed at the survival of virtually all the colony.

John
Two truly heartwarming posts in this otherwise thoroughly depressing and distressing event.

Nigel
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Old Saturday 7th December 2013, 19:43   #21963
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Terrible scenes of devastation at one of our favourite holiday destinations. Thinking of you all that have been affected. If there are any work parties etc in our holidays we will be happy to muck in and help repair things. Regards from Derbyshire
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Old Saturday 7th December 2013, 20:51   #21964
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Put a few pictures of Cley area on me blog.

This is a hyperlinkything for you to click
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Old Saturday 7th December 2013, 22:13   #21965
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Spent the day along the coast, starting at Holme and ending at Cley. Burnham Norton looked incredible the entire marshes were flooded right up to the carpark with tons of birds, greylags, brents, wigeon, mute swans, curlews etc etc.

East Bank, Cley had huge sections of reedbed plonked on the path!!! Walsey Hills carpark - what carpark!!!

East Hills still exists - photographed this from Wells Lifeboat Station - a few fallen pine trees though and dune ridge eaten into.

Full update on blog shortly.

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Old Sunday 8th December 2013, 07:23   #21966
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Norfolk 6/12/2013 Salthouse

Click on link below to view Salthouse 'freshmarsh' and shingle breaches in progress. Great to witness tidal saltmarsh at the start of the creation process. With the deep (permanent?) breach in the ridge mentioned in earlier posts we should celebrate this 'new' wild natural habitat. Afterall it was expected and planned for.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8E5Q...ature=youtu.be

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Old Sunday 8th December 2013, 08:30   #21967
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Not sure it was planned for this quickly!

As I understood it, the expectation was for the shingle bank to reprofile (wider & flatter), allowing more overtopping during very high tides or storm events, with the resulting saltwater inundation cleared more quickly via the New Cut / sluices at Cley into the Glaven channel. The Shoreline Management Plan only talks about "beginning the process of saltmarsh development", assuming no active intervention, in epoch 2 (2026-2055). The only interesting addition is that the plan for the shingle ridge allows for "intervention is response to events that cause immediate risk to life and to residential and commercial buildings in Cley and Salthouse, or threaten the transport function of the A149" - does this apply in this case?

So are we saying here that NWT paid 1.2m for Pope's saltmarsh?
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Old Sunday 8th December 2013, 08:57   #21968
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[QUOTE So are we saying here that NWT paid 1.2m for Pope's saltmarsh?[/quote]

Wasn't it always thought to become a saltmarsh and saline pools? The latter in particular being a rare habitat.

Might take a few years before the quayside by Wiveton chuch could become functional again....but then again....

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Old Sunday 8th December 2013, 09:59   #21969
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Stonechat on Beach Road. 30 Snow Buntings on beach Titchwell side of Golf Club. Red Throated Diver x 3 on sea plus 1m Goldeneye.
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Old Sunday 8th December 2013, 10:41   #21970
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[QUOTE So are we saying here that NWT paid 1.2m for Pope's saltmarsh?
Wasn't it always thought to become a saltmarsh and saline pools? The latter in particular being a rare habitat.

Might take a few years before the quayside by Wiveton chuch could become functional again....but then again....[/quote]

Its all saltmarsh now. Given the timescale for recovery and the likelihood of no new flood defences is significant investment in Cley as a fresh marsh worth doing? The NWT have quiet a bit of thinking to do.
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Old Sunday 8th December 2013, 13:48   #21971
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It was always assumed that the grazing marshes at Salthouse and Kelling would become saltmarsh eventually but not on this timescale. To quote from the NWT land purchase appeal FAQs:

"Overtopping of the shingle occurs regularly. It is predicted that, as a result of climate change and sea level rise, the land will eventually be reclaimed partially or wholly by the sea, but nobody is sure when this might happen. It is a longer term process that evidence suggests has been underway for some time already. In the medium term, there will continue to be floods, and gradual loss of land as the shingle bank is pushed slowly landward and freshwater habitats become increasingly saline."

"A combination of incidence and trends, suggest that the predicted eventual loss will not happen overnight but over at least several decades"
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Old Sunday 8th December 2013, 13:50   #21972
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Cley/Salthouse marshes, fresh or salt?

In 2010, NWT joined the Environment Agency in the 60-hectare Hilgay Wetland Creation Project which is meant to help compensate for the inevitable loss of the reed beds due to increasing saltwater incursion onto Cley/Salthouse marshes following 'managed retreat' of the coastal defences. In taking this action, I have to assume the Trust no longer considered reed beds sustainable at Cley/Salthouse and my curiosity is aroused by reading that the Trust intends to begin the initial restoration of Pope's Marsh by integrating habitats including reed bed for the benefit of Marsh Harrier, Bearded Tit and Bittern.

Admittedly, this statement of intent was announced before the very recent tidal incursion but one that needs to be explained nonetheless, though I won't be holding my breath.

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Old Sunday 8th December 2013, 16:11   #21973
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In 2010, NWT joined the Environment Agency in the 60-hectare Hilgay Wetland Creation Project which is meant to help compensate for the inevitable loss of the reed beds due to increasing saltwater incursion onto Cley/Salthouse marshes following 'managed retreat' of the coastal defences. In taking this action, I have to assume the Trust no longer considered reed beds sustainable at Cley/Salthouse and my curiosity is aroused by reading that the Trust intends to begin the initial restoration of Pope's Marsh by integrating habitats including reed bed for the benefit of Marsh Harrier, Bearded Tit and Bittern.

Admittedly, this statement of intent was announced before the very recent tidal incursion but one that needs to be explained nonetheless, though I won't be holding my breath.
Probably fair to say that freshwater reedbeds are not sustainable in the long term at Cley but reed grows perfectly well in brackish and saline conditions. Marsh harrier will nest in tidal reedbeds (as they do at Titchwell) and as long as there is plenty of dry reed litter bearded tits should be fine. Bitterns really need reedbeds with lots of fish so might struggle. But this is why NWT and EA are creating replacement freshwater reedbed at Hilgay.

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Old Sunday 8th December 2013, 17:27   #21974
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Probably fair to say that freshwater reedbeds are not sustainable in the long term at Cley but reed grows perfectly well in brackish and saline conditions. Marsh harrier will nest in tidal reedbeds (as they do at Titchwell) and as long as there is plenty of dry reed litter bearded tits should be fine. Bitterns really need reedbeds with lots of fish so might struggle. But this is why NWT and EA are creating replacement freshwater reedbed at Hilgay.
Perhaps it's also a reason for accelerating the development of the washes at Stiffkey to create new reedbeds?
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Old Sunday 8th December 2013, 20:29   #21975
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Are you talking about Hilgay as in the place near(ish) to Welney, or is there another one near the north coast?
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