400 In A Year?? (1 Viewer)

[angusmcoatup]

I used to keep various lists though I wasn't in competition with anyone except I suppose myself. Eventually it sunk in that I was turning my hobby into something of a chore, especially as work and social life became more demanding. I'm mildly curious about how many lists people are keeping, though thats a different thread. A list of lists I suppose must be the ultimate.
400 UK birds in a year I think goes beyond twitching and qualifies the holder to the ultimate accolade of Birdspotter, as it would have to be a case of point and tick for most of the list.

 

[MKinHK]

.Are we saying that only records of species seen away from a site or habitat that is known for them are countable? in which case how do we deal with, for example, meadow pipit? Do I have to find one in tescos?

Yes, but Golden-winged Warbler (and Waxwing) could not be counted in the carpark!

Cheers
Mike

 

['roy]

This thread has reminded me of an excellent recent program by Derren Brown "The Secret of Luck". Massively relevant to the whole 'self finds = skilled birder' debate.

http://www.channel4.com/programmes/derren-brown-the-experiments/4od#3256877

Pay particular attention to the moment when the self-confessed 'unlucky' bloke unwittingly walks straight past a crisp £50 lying on the pavement...

Luck is all about 'noticing when opportunities present themselves'. Personally, I reckon mental attitude plays a massive part in rarity finding, perhaps more so than anything you might describe as 'birding skill' (i.e. ID skills, knowledge etc).

For example, if you always trudge out to your inland patch thinking "this place is rubbish for rares, I'll never find anything here"... Well, that seems like the kind of attitude that leads to people wandering straight past £50 notes...

 

[dantheman]

And the definitive bf thread on the subject (there's no such thing as luck ) -

Finding rarities

(Apologies if it's already been mentioned.)

 

[AlanMatthews]

This thread has reminded me of an excellent recent program by Derren Brown "The Secret of Luck". Massively relevant to the whole 'self finds = skilled birder' debate.

http://www.channel4.com/programmes/derren-brown-the-experiments/4od#3256877

Pay particular attention to the moment when the self-confessed 'unlucky' bloke unwittingly walks straight past a crisp £50 lying on the pavement...

Luck is all about 'noticing when opportunities present themselves'. Personally, I reckon mental attitude plays a massive part in rarity finding, perhaps more so than anything you might describe as 'birding skill' (i.e. ID skills, knowledge etc).

For example, if you always trudge out to your inland patch thinking "this place is rubbish for rares, I'll never find anything here"... Well, that seems like the kind of attitude that leads to people wandering straight past £50 notes...

Well thanks for the advice. Next time I'm out looking for rarities in South Warwickshire I'll remember it's my attitude that's the problem, and not the fact that there simply aren't any rarities. Every other birder in the area seems to have had the same problem too.

 

[lewis20126]

Well thanks for the advice. Next time I'm out looking for rarities in South Warwickshire I'll remember it's my attitude that's the problem, and not the fact that there simply aren't any rarities.

I shouldn't think there are any £50 notes either. B

cheers, a

 

[AlanMatthews]

I shouldn't think there are any £50 notes either. B

cheers, a

I wouldn't know. I was too busy feeling sorry for myself!

 

[KenM]

Well thanks for the advice. Next time I'm out looking for rarities in South Warwickshire I'll remember it's my attitude that's the problem, and not the fact that there simply aren't any rarities. Every other birder in the area seems to have had the same problem too.

Bet they don't think that in Tunbridge Wells, Maidstone or Bewel Water

 

[draycotebirding]

Well thanks for the advice. Next time I'm out looking for rarities in South Warwickshire I'll remember it's my attitude that's the problem, and not the fact that there simply aren't any rarities. Every other birder in the area seems to have had the same problem too.

Warwickshire is not that bad and when you do find something rare it will be all the sweeter.

Regards

John

 

[KenM]

Didn't Warwickshire have 3 Little Buntings over-wintering a few years back on a farm with set-aside...or have I got the wrong county?

 

[AlanMatthews]

Warwickshire is not that bad and when you do find something rare it will be all the sweeter.

Regards

John

Thanks John I appreciate the sentiment and it was Draycote that made me say South Warwickshire. And the good Warwickshire sites are pretty busy. But that's 45 minutes away and I can be on the Lincolnshire coast in under two hours, Norfolk in two and half. I make a point of doing a Blakeney Point walk every year. On my own in prime rarity habitat if I set out early enough. No competition.

 

[Phil Andrews]

Didn't Warwickshire have 3 Little Buntings over-wintering a few years back on a farm with set-aside...or have I got the wrong county?

Worcestershire i'm afraid with birds also venturing into adjacent Staffs

 

[Johnny Allan]

I would rather not detail my "evidence" for this, as it will only invariably lead to someone, somewhere being insulted and going off on one. Lets just say that my experience has lead me to this conclusion.

I'm not going to get into how much specific time people are spending twitching or birding. Some people have 1 day off a week, some have seven. I reserve the right to stay within the same context that Paul put in place in relation to "Most" people. And most people have 2 days off a week.

It is a pretty moot point in my mind. Birds show up. And people go. Often on the spot, or at the nearest available time off. You don't have a list up in the big leagues if you didn't.

Yes...and no. It is easier to find rare birds on the coast because there are estuaries and headlands and more birds yes. But there are more birders looking, often to the point of saturation. It is not as simple as you make it out to be.

Wasn't referring to you in the above Johnny. Have just heard the argument before so many times. Birds are everywhere. Now and again I go on an exploring binge, looking at underwatched (inland) sites like the midland or Cavan lakes, and I have always found rarities and scarcities.

Owen

Hi Owen,

I admire your tenacity. It's a shame you can't present evidence for your assertion and, from your excuse, I can understand why but if that's the case, it's probably not what I was looking for.

Anyway, other than others popping up and confirming that, all things being equal, they have self-found more in more favourable coastal habitat etc than, say, inland sites I can offer this:

A Beddington colleague of mine lived for over thirty years in urban Tooting in Greater London. He is a good birder and amassed 108 garden ticks (including flyovers). He had some good birds in the garden such as Firecrest and Waxwing and some good flyovers such as various large raptors, Kittiwake and Little Gull. He has lived near the coast of East Sussex for the past four years, with a garden no bigger or better than the one he developed in Tooting, and has already amassed 126 garden ticks, with flyovers including Glossy Ibis, Great White Egret, Tawny Pipit and two Common Crane. He doesn't put in any more time (in fact, he can't have done), but is in a better spot to self-find birds.

Could we not at least agree that, all things being equal, a birder will self-find more birds in an area which, for whatever reason, attracts more (and a greater variety of) migrant birds than one which does not ?

Johnny

 

[Johnny Allan]

Without finding!..there would be no twitching!...My hunting (mostly local and further afield) to twitching ratio is circa 80/20...and I find this has served me well.

cheers

Sounds good to me Ken, where do you do your birding ?

Johnny

 

[bernie b]

Hi Owen,

I admire your tenacity. It's a shame you can't present evidence for your assertion and, from your excuse, I can understand why but if that's the case, it's probably not what I was looking for.

Anyway, other than others popping up and confirming that, all things being equal, they have self-found more in more favourable coastal habitat etc than, say, inland sites I can offer this:

A Beddington colleague of mine lived for over thirty years in urban Tooting in Greater London. He is a good birder and amassed 108 garden ticks (including flyovers). He had some good birds in the garden such as Firecrest and Waxwing and some good flyovers such as various large raptors, Kittiwake and Little Gull. He has lived near the coast of East Sussex for the past four years, with a garden no bigger or better than the one he developed in Tooting, and has already amassed 126 garden ticks, with flyovers including Glossy Ibis, Great White Egret, Tawny Pipit and two Common Crane. He doesn't put in any more time (in fact, he can't have done), but is in a better spot to self-find birds.

Could we not at least agree that, all things being equal, a birder will self-find more birds in an area which, for whatever reason, attracts more (and a greater variety of) migrant birds than one which does not ?

Johnny

Hi Johnny,I certainly found more in the Hartlepool area,than I do now in coastal South Wales,but I did put more hours in up there.
all the best Bernie

 

[Helsinki Birder]

Hi Owen,

Could we not at least agree that, all things being equal, a birder will self-find more birds in an area which, for whatever reason, attracts more (and a greater variety of) migrant birds than one which does not ?

Johnny

Not in dispute.

Owen

 

[ZanderII]

You are (far) less likely to find rare passerines on the coast than inland.

This is because of concentration effects of tired birds on the immediate coast.

However, it is still possible to find say Siberian vagrants inland, they don't avoid going inland - why should they, they've just crossed most of the Eurasian Continental landmass and many non-vagrant individuals will never see the coast during their lives. Its absurd that the case against the rubythroat included the fact that it was 1 km from the coast!

I think the point folk are trying to make is that birder behaviour is different inland, fewer people try to look for rare passerines simply because its perceived as being 'too hard' and therefore not worth it...Thus many species may be missed even at well-watched sites as observers are either not actively-searching for passerines or filtering them out completely. The £50 lesson.

I've done most of my birding inland and am certainly guilty of this. (not bothering looking in trees rather than stepping over dosh).

 

[Chris Bell]

I believe the original question to be impossible for a number one reason, rightly or wrongly. The official body is the BOU and that does not include either Eire or the extra 'species' offered by the UK400 Club. No amount of cash could make up the deficit, though a UK400 total would be a remarkable achievement in itself.

 

[KenM]

Sounds good to me Ken, where do you do your birding ?

Johnny

Johnny Hi,

During the '70's Epping Forest (London, Essex) and the KGV reservoirs (Lee Valley).80's and '90's..as before plus many weekends at Beachy Head, Sussx. Then from 2000 onwards Epping Forest, Inner London Parks, and the East Coast.

Between '92 and '98 I owned a dog...and he was a flusher...par excellence. Where do you do yours Johnny?

cheers

 

[Jhanlon]

You are (far) less likely to find rare passerines on the coast than inland.

I think you mean the opposite?!

I don't think it's down to how hard people look or where the birds orginate. If you randomly scatter birds throughout say East Anglia and randomly scatter the same number along the coast, its the second group which will be easier to intercept because of the linear distribution and resulting higher density along the 'study area'. This combines with higher observer density because more birders visit the coast for this very reason and the fact that the birds often use the coastline itself as a migration route. Seemples!

Birds such as waders may be different as habitats such as gravel pits and other inland wetlands act as a magnet, pulling in any passing birds. It's no coincidence that about half of our decent rarities in Cambs are waders.