6 January 2022 - New Leica announcement (1 Viewer)

[Conndomat]

Idk about that. I think the Noctivids are right in that game. Certainly somewhere between SF, EL and NL.

Paul,

It's not about the 8/42 Noctivids, with the other Parameters, especially with the 8 /10x32, Leica has dropped out.

You shouldn't forget that the SF, EL and especially the new NL are sold much more often.
For Leica, binoculars are just a small sideline, with Swarovski it's completely different, they are already a step further, also compared to Zeiss.

Andreas

 

[Mac308]

Rangefinder binoculars are made for hunters. That is why the mrfrs. often build optics for that market.
That is where the money is.

Jerry

Yup. That’s what this binocular is for, and that’s where the money is.

 

[b-lilja]

Looks underwhelming from a Birders point of view, heavy at 870g without a battery and only a 7 deg fov on the 8x, nothing to tempt me anyway.

Yup.

 

[b-lilja]

It's too bad, because the 8x42 Geovid I saw was definitely better than my 7x42 HD+ or a Noctovid...just too heavy. It told me they can go further if they want to.

 

[Paultricounty]

Paul,

It's not about the 8/42 Noctivids, with the other Parameters, especially with the 8 /10x32, Leica has dropped out.

You shouldn't forget that the SF, EL and especially the new NL are sold much more often.
For Leica, binoculars are just a small sideline, with Swarovski it's completely different, they are already a step further, also compared to Zeiss.

Andreas

Andreas, I’m not sure I’m following you, Please elaborate..

My thinking is SF 42’s came out when, five or six years ago? And it was years later before the 32’s were added to the line. There are still no 7’s or any 50’s.
Leica still has a larger line with Trinovids, Trinovid classic, Ultravids, and now with Noctivids. Zeiss has SF and conquest, that’s all. Swarovski I get it, there a dedicated optics company and usually are the trend the setters.

Im still on the learning curve with binoculars. My company expertise was more in astronomy equipment, Zeiss , astrophysics, teleVue, Takahashi , TMB for a short time before Tom Back passed Away. As well as a few others.
Thank,you. Paul

 

[NDhunter]

Paul:
You are correct, you are still on a learning curve. The Zeiss SF 42 is brighter than most 50's by many companies.
7X is a slow seller, that is common knowledge, that is why you don't see many choices anywhere.
Jerry

 

[henry link]

Looks underwhelming from a Birders point of view, heavy at 870g without a battery and only a 7 deg fov on the 8x, nothing to tempt me anyway.

Me either. Add to those items a close focus of 5 meters/a little more than 16 feet.

There's also something funny going on with the FOV specs. The 7º angular FOV given for the 8x32 corresponds to a field of 367.5 ft. @ 1000 yards, not the 405 ft. in the spec sheet, and the 5.8º angular FOV of the 10x32 corresponds to 304.5 ft @ 1000 yards., not 345 ft.

And then, apparently as a warning that the eye relief is too short for eyeglass wearers, there is the odd extra set of reduced FOV specs "for spectacle wearers", which are themselves clearly overstated if we accept the angular FOV specs.

No AFOV specs are given, but if the real angular FOV specs are correct then the true measured apparent fields are probably around 52-54º for the 8x and 54-56º for the 10x depending on the distortion profile, and of course even less for spectacle wearers.

This instrument comes across to me as primarily a rangefinder with minimal binocular optics attached more as a view finder than a serious binocular. Imagine the response from birders if Leica came out with an 8x32 Noctivid with such uncompetitive specifications for FOV, eye relief and close focus.

 

[John A Roberts]

The both chunky and heavy nature of the new x32 Geovid Pro, makes clear a technical limitation that explains why there’s not other premium x32 RF binoculars on the market.

While Leica did scale down the optics, mechanicals and body compared to the larger x42 version, there’s clearly not a lot of scope to reduce the size of the technology required for the rangefinder functions (Leica had presumedly already reduced it as much as was feasible with the earlier larger models).

As can be seen from the image of the x32, x42 and x56 versions, the arms on all three which contain much of the technology are essentially the same size (and consequently the x32 has a very small space between the front and rear arms in terms of flexibility of finger placement).

Also compare the listed weights of the x32 and x42 models: 870 g/ 30.7 oz (excluding the battery) verses 975 g/ 34.3 oz with the battery!
So the advantage of the x32 would seem to be mainly the smaller size package.

- - - -
Interestingly, the cutaway image provided by zzzzzz in post #123, shows that the 8x32 Geovid uses a 4 element eyepiece of the same pattern as that of the 7x42 Ultravid, and its 7x42 BN/ BA predecessor (n.b. in the image in post #123, the focusing lens in the objective has been left out).


John


p.s. Henry succinctly addressed the same point in the last sentence of his post, just as I was about to add my post!

 

[henry link]

Hi John,

The focusing lens is small and close to the prism. To see it clearly you have to pause the cutaway animation in this video at about 0.22.

I think the use of a 4 element Konig is another indication that the optical design of this binocular is not very ambitious. The 4 element variant usually shows up in older binocular designs with AFOVs in the mid 50 degree range combined with 6-7mm exit pupils (like the Ultravid 7x42), where the higher effective focal ratio of the objective in daylight allows such a simple eyepiece design to perform acceptably. You would expect the 5 element variant to be used in an 8/10x32 if the best performance from a Konig in a low focal ratio telescope was wanted.

Henry

 

[John A Roberts]

Googling around, more info is being added as the day progresses . . .

See an official specification sheet. It indicates a weight of 820 g/ 28.9 oz without the battery. So perhaps more likely?

And a better image of the cutaway from post #123, the marking indicates that it’s the 10x32 version. So not the 8x32 as I assumed.


John


And a crop of an image from Leica demonstrating the available finger space (?)

 

[Renze de Vries]

The only interesting aspect for me, as a birder, is the application of the Perger prism. I'm convinced Leica is able to do nice things with it in future binocular designs. So what does the Perger do here, in this instrument for hunters? How about the view? I see figures for light transmission that are excellent: 91%. Yes, the FoV is nothing special, but is this necessarily so?
I'd like to see reports, impressions, tests here about optical performance. I've seen a few favorable comments on the 42mm Geovid from b-lilja and (repeatedly) Gijs van Ginkel. Unfortunately they were not very specific. Reports please.

Renze

 

[Canip]

I did a brief review of the 8x42 Perger optics here:

Geovid Dritte Generation: "Zweite Eindrücke" vom HD-R (Typ 402)

www.juelich-bonn.com

(sorry, in German)

I was positively impressed.

Canip

 

[Conndomat]

Andreas, I’m not sure I’m following you, Please elaborate..

My thinking is SF 42’s came out when, five or six years ago? And it was years later before the 32’s were added to the line. There are still no 7’s or any 50’s.
Leica still has a larger line with Trinovids, Trinovid classic, Ultravids, and now with Noctivids. Zeiss has SF and conquest, that’s all.

Paul,

Zeiss first had problems with the introduction of the gray SF, this was replaced by the improved black model.
7x binoculars are unfortunately a discontinued model, as beautiful as they are, they are very rarely sold and Zeiss will probably not bring any more onto the market.
As a 50s there is the HT 54, which you forgot, a separate series that Zeiss replaced for the FL.
After all, Zeiss has now brought the 32 series models after years, and there is still nothing to be seen at Leica.

I'm more concerned that Leica will fare like Nikon, that EDG are excellent binoculars, but Nikon did not deliver, in the meantime Nikon has departed from the high-end market.
Leica just seems unwilling to keep up with Zeiss and Swarovski, with the Geovids Leica is still ahead, with the conventional binoculars they unfortunately missed the connection.
So there is no Leicabashing on my part, more the worry that a traditional manufacturer of excellent binoculars will disappear from the high-level market, so I would like to see more activities from Leica.

Andreas

 

[Mike F]

Hmm, if I understand you AND if I have this right, the driver is the eyepieces. IPD is a thing built into the design of a binocular. With roof prism binos, the main barrels are concentric to the eye pieces, the ocular lens, the exit pupil. If you reduce the outside diameter of the barrels from 42 to 32, but keep eyepieces where they must be to accommodate various human face configurations, then wouldn’t the space between the barrels be larger with a 32? Folks with 42/32 Els or SFs help please

@GrampaTom, thinking about this you must be right. Good point!

 

[Blue72]

Many hunters and shooters are also birders . So this is a very welcoming product. Especially for those who want to keep their optic count down while in in the field

 

[Paultricounty]

Paul:
You are correct, you are still on a learning curve. The Zeiss SF 42 is brighter than most 50's by many companies.
7X is a slow seller, that is common knowledge, that is why you don't see many choices anywhere.
Jerry

I was referring to the SF line specifically. If there was a SF50, it would be brighter (under certain conditions) That’s why Leica and Swarovski still sell 50’s . I do understand 7’s are slow sellers but my point was Leica being as competitive with their large platform choices, not so much how many units they sell. I was relating to the fact of how large and competitive in quality Leica is.

 

[Paultricounty]

Me either. Add to those items a close focus of 5 meters/a little more than 16 feet.

There's also something funny going on with the FOV specs. The 7º angular FOV given for the 8x32 corresponds to a field of 367.5 ft. @ 1000 yards, not the 405 ft. in the spec sheet, and the 5.8º angular FOV of the 10x32 corresponds to 304.5 ft @ 1000 yards., not 345 ft.

And then, apparently as a warning that the eye relief is too short for eyeglass wearers, there is the odd extra set of reduced FOV specs "for spectacle wearers", which are themselves clearly overstated if we accept the angular FOV specs.

No AFOV specs are given, but if the real angular FOV specs are correct then the true measured apparent fields are probably around 52-54º for the 8x and 54-56º for the 10x depending on the distortion profile, and of course even less for spectacle wearers.

This instrument comes across to me as primarily a rangefinder with minimal binocular optics attached more as a view finder than a serious binocular. Imagine the response from birders if Leica came out with an 8x32 Noctivid with such uncompetitive specifications for FOV, eye relief and close focus.

You mean ridiculously small field of view like the UVHD+ 8x42 at 389ft at 1000 yards 😜

 

[Paultricounty]

Paul,

Zeiss first had problems with the introduction of the gray SF, this was replaced by the improved black model.
7x binoculars are unfortunately a discontinued model, as beautiful as they are, they are very rarely sold and Zeiss will probably not bring any more onto the market.
As a 50s there is the HT 54, which you forgot, a separate series that Zeiss replaced for the FL.
After all, Zeiss has now brought the 32 series models after years, and there is still nothing to be seen at Leica.

I'm more concerned that Leica will fare like Nikon, that EDG are excellent binoculars, but Nikon did not deliver, in the meantime Nikon has departed from the high-end market.
Leica just seems unwilling to keep up with Zeiss and Swarovski, with the Geovids Leica is still ahead, with the conventional binoculars they unfortunately missed the connection.
So there is no Leicabashing on my part, more the worry that a traditional manufacturer of excellent binoculars will disappear from the high-level market, so I would like to see more activities from Leica.

Andreas

I understand, all very valid points. I was aware of the HT, I didn’t mention because it’s not the newest design and a step below the SF. Nikon has been getting out of high-end optics for a while now. They also are getting out of anything to do with hunting, so no more hunting or tactical scopes. I hope, same as you Leica doesn’t go down the same path as Nikon. It would be a shame because Leica does have the the build quality thing down to an art.
IMO, the Noctivids are a work of art.

 

[Mac308]

I'm one that prefers a rangefinder in a separate unit... KISS.

 

[eronald]

Idk about that. I think the Noctivids are right in that game. Certainly somewhere between SF, EL and NL.

My impression on this forum is that a lot of people like the x42 ultravid view, the Noctivid hasnt had the expected customer takeup in x42. My feeling is we might see the NV phased out and replaced before the NV, especially in the light of the Swaro NL and Zeiss SF competition.

Edmund