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Message: <blockquote data-quote="brocknroller" data-source="post: 1542732" data-attributes="member: 665">I can think of one optics expert who revels in "pissing contests over differences of a fraction of an arcsec". It's amusing to watch the "Clash of the Minutia Titans" for a bit, but then I get bored as the equations or technical arguments become convoluted and move onto to a more interesting thread. Living in the boonies, it's rare when I've had the opportunity to compare two samples of the same bin at a store, though thanks to friends I've met on forums with similar tastes in bins, I have had such opportunities on several occasions (mostly with Nikon bins). The series that I found to be the most consistent is the Nikon SE series. Almost every sample I've tried (two 8x32s, three 10x42s, three 12x50s) felt like I was looking through the same binoculars. Only the newer sample "Premier 8x32 SE" deviated from the norm with a larger image scale. When it came to the Nikon LX series (six samples), EII series (four samples), Monarchs (two samples), Action Extremes (three samples), Swift Ultralites (original series - three samples) and Audubon 804s (four samples), and Celestron Ultimas (three samples), there were sample variations, sometimes slight, sometimes considerable. I can usually tell if one sample is "sharper" than another (contrast + resolution) just by holding it up to my eyes and observing various targets. And sometimes, even when the samples were close in apparent sharpness, something else was "off" (collimation? turned down edges? pinched optics?) that only revealed itself with star testing. For some reason, my eyes/brain are more sensitive to deviations from the norm than others, particularly with miscollimation. I'm also more sensitive to "distortions" such as "rolling ball," pincushion, astigmatism, spherical aberration, etc. My focus accommodation ain't what it used to be either, so I pick up on field curvature and differences in depth of field and close focus more easily. I also see CA where others don't. Sometimes the variations are mechanical, not optical. Focusers in particular seem to vary in speed and amount of backlash. So all this makes me very picky. I've sent at least a half dozen bins back to their owners or stores because they were in someway below par. It's one thing if the only problem is miscollimation, and I get a really good deal on a premium bin, it's worth sending the bin in to be collimated. I wish I could do this myself and save money, but not all prisms are as easy to access as Obies, then again, not all bins need to be realigned as often as Obies <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" />. And I'm nervous about messing with the prisms of an expensive bin. As you pointed out, "star tests" usually tell the tale. But what I lament is that when you fork over a small fortune for a premium bin, part of that fortune should include the manufacturer paying strict attention to quality control. So when you receive those second tier Japanese-made roofs which retail for $700-$900 and find that one or more of the elements in one barrel were not properly coated at the factory or that one has a focuser that's so loose you can almost spin it, that's very frustrating, even if you bought it for below retail, particularly when the seller doesn't see what you do and gives you a hard time taking the bins back. But such is the plight of the binofan with champagne taste and a Coca Cola wallet. You look for bargains, and cross your fingers. If I had a wallet to match my tastes, I would simply walk into an optics store and take out several samples of the same bin, test them with my resolution chart, booster, and artificial star and buy the best sample at retail price (or below retail, since I didn't get that fat wallet by being a fool <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" />. I hope to do that at least once in my life. That's the "good life". Brock, the Bargain Hunter</blockquote>

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