8x42: Zeiss Terra ED, Vortex Viper HD, or ...? (the end of 2021 version of this question ;-) (1 Viewer)

[Jim#4096]

Hi all,

I realize this has been discussed a number of times in the past, but I have a specific question I haven't seen addressed, and (of course) prices and models keep changing.

Right now at a well-known US store both the Zeiss Terra ED 8x42 (in grey, but not black) and the Vortex Viper HD 8x42 are available for US$349. The general concensus (after having read a number of threads here and on other web sites) seems to favour the Vipers, but at the Allbinos web site the "distortion" score is 10/10 for the Terras, and a rather sad 4/10 for the Vipers. I realize this is just one aspect of many, but something that I would have thought would be quite significant.

Q1: Given the general concensus, can anyone who has used both of these binoculars comment on whether they notice much of the distortion? Or is the 10/10 score (apparently) a mistake? Any other words of wisdom on this topic? Thanks very much.

Q2: People like to recommend other binoculars in a similar price range when they answer previous versions of this (and similar) questions. Given that both are on sale right now, and given that I'm not looking to spend a lot of money (yes, I have Swarovski NL Pure tastes, but a much smaller budget), are there any strong recommendations for something in the US$350 price range I should consider? Thanks also for this.

Q3: Not really as important, but is the $100 off for grey Terras a peculiar marketing thing, or are the grey Terras somehow inferior?

Cheers.

 

[MiddleRiver]

I have owned 8x42 terras (gray) and 10x42 (green). I do believe that there were changes to the models and if you dig deep enough I think the earlier ones were made in Japan and later in China. WHether that has any bearing on quality... who knows. They are often discounted a bit, making them very attractive.

They sometimes don't get much love and a LOT of that is the MIC stigma. I actually had a hard time selling mine, and people would often ask about country of origin. That said, I compared them in the store (not ideal of course) to other binos in same price range and thought they were the best (for my eyes). The build quality was excellent and the fact that they carried Zeiss logo suggested the glass would not be junk. Around here of course, there is a very high bar and the arguments devolve into often subjective and esoteric critiques of $2000+ glass. I ended up gifting them to my kids, because I made the mistake of comparing them to Trinovids and even that (trinnies also sometimes don't get love around here) was clearly better (even my 'non-connossieur' wife picked the Leica glass). Perhaps not suprising: $400 vs 950.

Bottom line: I like the Terras and for the price point I thought they were great. If you compare binos purely based on specs (FOV, ER, etc.) they may not come out on top. But I did like them best compared to others in same league as avail at a well-stocked cabellas.

 

[Rob from Texas]

I think the Vortex Viper HD are hard to beat for $350.

 

[[email protected]]

I think the Vortex Viper HD are hard to beat for $350.

Ditto.

 

[qwerty5]

If you can get the Vipers for $350 then there really is no question.

 

[Jim#4096]

I have owned 8x42 terras (gray) and 10x42 (green). I do believe that there were changes to the models and if you dig deep enough I think the earlier ones were made in Japan and later in China. WHether that has any bearing on quality... who knows. They are often discounted a bit, making them very attractive.

They sometimes don't get much love and a LOT of that is the MIC stigma. I actually had a hard time selling mine, and people would often ask about country of origin. That said, I compared them in the store (not ideal of course) to other binos in same price range and thought they were the best (for my eyes). The build quality was excellent and the fact that they carried Zeiss logo suggested the glass would not be junk. Around here of course, there is a very high bar and the arguments devolve into often subjective and esoteric critiques of $2000+ glass. I ended up gifting them to my kids, because I made the mistake of comparing them to Trinovids and even that (trinnies also sometimes don't get love around here) was clearly better (even my 'non-connossieur' wife picked the Leica glass). Perhaps not suprising: $400 vs 950.

Bottom line: I like the Terras and for the price point I thought they were great. If you compare binos purely based on specs (FOV, ER, etc.) they may not come out on top. But I did like them best compared to others in same league as avail at a well-stocked cabellas.

Thanks for your thoughts. I agree that there is a lot of stigma against things made in China, which is not always deserved. If you think about the fact that they have a rover wandering around on the moon, as well as a space station with people in it, you have to conclude that their manufacturing capabilities are very high. On a much more trivial level, I've ordered machine parts from China and been very happy with the quality of machining and the accuracy; I suspect I would have paid four to five times as much for parts sourced from a North American or European supplier.

Readers who are old enough may recall that in the late 1950's and well into the 1960's "Made in Japan" was synonymous with "junk". But, of course, along came Sony, Nikon, Honda, Toyota and a host of other Japanese manufacturers showing that top-quality things are produced there. It's hard not to have a deja vu feeling.

In case anyone reading this thread is wondering...
In the end, because
(a) I found the Vipers at a price considerably less than what seems to be "the usual" good price, and somewhat cheaper than the good price that the grey Terras were going for (now considerably more again), and
(b) the large body of favourable opinions for the Vipers,
I got the Vipers.

(And I wasn't feeling I could justify to myself getting the Trinovids or something in that category, or something a bit higher thaan that, and so on to the very top.)

Best wishes to all for 2022.

 

[Jim#4096]

Rob, Denco and qwerty5: thanks for sharing your thoughts.

 

[KevinL]

In my opinion, the Zeiss Terras are the poorest binocular performance wise I see at their typical price point. I feel they are built more cheaply as well. They are more similar to binoculars costing about $100 less. The Vortex Vipers are superior, but don't take my word for it, look through them your self and buy the one you like best.

 

[[email protected]]

Rob, Denco and qwerty5: thanks for sharing your thoughts.

You're welcome! The quality of MIC stuff is improving every day. One day soon it will be as good quality wise as anything from Europe.

 

[[email protected]]

In my opinion, the Zeiss Terras are the poorest binocular performance wise I see at their typical price point. I feel they are built more cheaply as well. They are more similar to binoculars costing about $100 less. The Vortex Vipers are superior, but don't take my word for it, look through them your self and buy the one you like best.

I agree on the Zeiss Terra's. I thought they were very dim for their price point when I tried them. I think the Vortex Viper HD is a much better binocular for the money.

 

[[email protected]]

If you can get the Vipers for $350 then there really is no question.

The only binoculars that can even come close to the value of the Vipers are E2's, and they are about $500 now.

 

[MiddleRiver]

You're welcome! The quality of MIC stuff is improving every day. One day soon it will be as good quality wise as anything from Europe.

I suppose everyone's eyes are different and w/out a controlled double blind study... who knows.

When the Terra line first came out, I visited big box sporting store that stocked them. I can't honestly say what else I looked at but I assume it included some Vortex and Nikon and something else. I liked the 8x42 Terra best. Whether that would have remained the case had I taken them outside for extensive testing, pushed the limits of CA, etc., I don't know. We also had a Terra 10x42 on boat which worked great for us. I have other noticeably better glass (2-4 times $$) so they have both been passed on to kids.

I've been reading a lot of 'reviews' lately as I contemplate getting an 8x32. What I most notice is very strong feelings, often brand based, and not infrequently entirely subjective. My (obvious) conclusion is there is no substitute for trying diff models/brands yourself. Like partners, cars, homes, or anything else, it's not always a logical process and the subtleties are lost in charts. Some like flat some like pin. Some like natural some like warm/enhanced. Not to mention that we all have different eyes and that's clearly a big part of the equation!

 

[Paultricounty]

Thanks for your thoughts. I agree that there is a lot of stigma against things made in China, which is not always deserved. If you think about the fact that they have a rover wandering around on the moon, as well as a space station with people in it, you have to conclude that their manufacturing capabilities are very high. On a much more trivial level, I've ordered machine parts from China and been very happy with the quality of machining and the accuracy; I suspect I would have paid four to five times as much for parts sourced from a North American or European supplier.

Readers who are old enough may recall that in the late 1950's and well into the 1960's "Made in Japan" was synonymous with "junk". But, of course, along came Sony, Nikon, Honda, Toyota and a host of other Japanese manufacturers showing that top-quality things are produced there. It's hard not to have a deja vu feeling.

In case anyone reading this thread is wondering...
In the end, because
(a) I found the Vipers at a price considerably less than what seems to be "the usual" good price, and somewhat cheaper than the good price that the grey Terras were going for (now considerably more again), and
(b) the large body of favourable opinions for the Vipers,
I got the Vipers.

(And I wasn't feeling I could justify to myself getting the Trinovids or something in that category, or something a bit higher thaan that, and so on to the very top.)

Best wishes to all for 2022.

This might be a little late but here’s my take.
I’d would say if the older Terras were made in Japan , I’d go that way. If not I’d go anywhere not China. It’s not as simple as negative stigma. It’s also not about China’s manufacturing quality. Why would you wanna support a country we may be going to war with soon (God help us if we do).

If you can’t find anything in the $350 range, bite the bullet and go a few hundred dollars more and not support death camps, biological weapons labs and Chinas economy. If you can’t find what you want in your price range look to some nice used options. There’s lots of those out there at fantastic prices. There are Leica Trinovid BNs on eBay occasionally that’s a far superior to what your looking at.

I wouldn’t worry much about albinos reviews, they don’t always equate to what the eye sees for many observers. In the $400-$500 price range they’re all pretty good and not much separates them at all. Ergonomics would be more a deciding factor.

Good luck
Paul

 

[Jim#4096]

I've been reading a lot of 'reviews' lately as I contemplate getting an 8x32. What I most notice is very strong feelings, often brand based, and not infrequently entirely subjective. My (obvious) conclusion is there is no substitute for trying diff models/brands yourself.

I agree that a lot of opinions are based far too much on "favourite brand", and I will add "country of manufacture" to that. Your advice about trying different binocs (or whatever else) before buying is good, but unfortunately not always very easy for people who live in areas where not much is available locally. And Covid concerns aren't helping. In my case I tried to read opinions and reviews from a lot of different sources, in the hope that by hearing from lots of people, these personal biases would be lessened.

Thanks for your thoughts (all of them, not just the bit I quoted here).

 

[Jim#4096]

This might be a little late but here’s my take.
I’d would say if the older Terras were made in Japan , I’d go that way. If not I’d go anywhere not China. It’s not as simple as negative stigma. It’s also not about China’s manufacturing quality. Why would you wanna support a country we may be going to war with soon (God help us if we do).

If you can’t find anything in the $350 range, bite the bullet and go a few hundred dollars more and not support death camps, biological weapons labs and Chinas economy. If you can’t find what you want in your price range look to some nice used options. There’s lots of those out there at fantastic prices. There are Leica Trinovid BNs on eBay occasionally that’s a far superior to what your looking at.

I wouldn’t worry much about albinos reviews, they don’t always equate to what the eye sees for many observers. In the $400-$500 price range they’re all pretty good and not much separates them at all. Ergonomics would be more a deciding factor.

Good luck
Paul

Paul,

for reasons I mentioned above, I don't have a strong dislike of things made in China. Notwithstanding chest-thumping and other posturing for politcal points, I really doubt your country is going to war with China any time soon, and I'm even less worried about my country going to war with China. In any case, given the huge manufacturing base in China, I'm guessing that a lot of the supply chain of things you buy, as well as some end products, are made in China. One pair of binoculars more or less isn't going to change things much. (In any case, my Vipers say they were assembled in the Phillipines.) And you might want to keep in mind the nationality of the owners of Vortex

Thanks for your thoughts on the Albinos reviews, I don't think anyone else had any thoughts about that.

Cheers

 

[Ted Y.]

Your advice about trying different binocs (or whatever else) before buying is good, but unfortunately not always very easy for people who live in areas where not much is available locally.

One can buy from Amazon CA or Amazon US and return it if not good enough. It is a Covid situation.

 

[Paultricounty]

Paul,

for reasons I mentioned above, I don't have a strong dislike of things made in China. Notwithstanding chest-thumping and other posturing for politcal points, I really doubt your country is going to war with China any time soon, and I'm even less worried about my country going to war with China. In any case, given the huge manufacturing base in China, I'm guessing that a lot of the supply chain of things you buy, as well as some end products, are made in China. One pair of binoculars more or less isn't going to change things much. (In any case, my Vipers say they were assembled in the Phillipines.) And you might want to keep in mind the nationality of the owners of Vortex

Thanks for your thoughts on the Albinos reviews, I don't think anyone else had any thoughts about that.

Cheers

Vortex is an American company I believe.

I don’t really care if you dislike made in China or not. And there’s no chest thumping here, I’m just telling the facts as I see them. And you were absolutely right that it’s very difficult not to buy made in China because of so many manufacturing materials come from from China. But I do my best to look at labels and not send my money to communists anymore even if I have to pay double or triple. You choose what you will. If everybody thought just throwing out one piece of garbage doesn’t add up to much, well I’m sure you get that point.

And your more than welcome to my thoughts on Albinos. I sure they were very helpful in your decision on $300 binoculars. Enjoy your vortex.