Annoying birding conversations in hides (1 Viewer)

[Simon Taylor]

What really annoys me is they way people treat hides.

I look after 3 hides as a volunteer and frequently i find the entrance gates left open, the doors left open, the flaps left open, dirty tissues on the floor, lunch wrappings on the floor etc etc

After 4 years of cleaning up after others your tolerance levels do drop

It's odd that people cant close flaps, doors or pick up their litter etc because they wouldnt treat their homes like it.

 

[bejay1957]

So noisy children, garlic sausage sandwiches, one-upmanship - no problem, but a photographer occupying one person's space on a bench, sitting quietly, concentrating hard on birds, gives you a problem? What are you, a fugitive from the paparazzi? A model trying to get away from the lens?

I'm not saying there aren't "problem photographers" in the same way there are problem children, problem gossips, problem list-gurus etc: but why do you choose to tar all of this particular group with the same brush?

John

If they occupied one space on a bench while using a hide clamp it wouldn't be an issue. Its the big tripods (plural, since DSLR users seem to flock) taking up the floor/bench/window space of several persons. And why can a camera not be used in single-shot mode...

 

[Steve Babbs]

I have no problem whatsoever with a photographer sitting quietly. My problem is when the Canon 600mm lens is poked through the shutter flap and the 6fps fires off at some distant speck for the next 90 minutes. Not that I (and many others) are still there 90 minutes later.

Don't be so damn selfish and just think of those whose day you are ruining.

They have as much right to use the hide for photography as you do for birding. As has already been said, go somewhere else if you want silence. There's still plenty of countryside out there. I do know how you feel; I've felt that way myself (I went about 10 years without visiting Minsmere, because I couldn't face the hides, despite the fact I lived 30 miles away), but when I have, I've realised that it's me being unreasonable and selfish rather than the photographer.

I do take lots of photos, but rarely from a hide, so I feel I'm fairly neutral here.

 

[Farnboro John]

If they occupied one space on a bench while using a hide clamp it wouldn't be an issue. Its the big tripods (plural, since DSLR users seem to flock) taking up the floor/bench/window space of several persons. And why can a camera not be used in single-shot mode...

I'm with you on the first half, its perfectly possible just to rest your camera on the rim of the window slot. If that won't do there are such things as beanbags. Of course, that won't work for the dedicated birder who doesnt have a DSLR but digiscopes instead, of course that needs a tripod. And you couldn't call them photographers of course.

Perhaps DSLR users seem to flock for the same reason queues form outside hides with monster rarities showing from inside? Curiously parallel behaviour with "real birders".

However, there is no getting away from the fact that to record behaviour, sometimes (not always) a sequence works best. Also its not always the first of a burst that is sharpest, no matter how hard you try.

Perhaps more interested conversation between the (more separate than I ever dreamed!) factions within birding would result in greater understanding. And we all know understanding is the key to acceptance.

John

 

[crabplover]

What really annoys me is they way people treat hides.

I look after 3 hides as a volunteer and frequently i find the entrance gates left open, the doors left open, the flaps left open, dirty tissues on the floor, lunch wrappings on the floor etc etc

After 4 years of cleaning up after others your tolerance levels do drop

It's odd that people cant close flaps, doors or pick up their litter etc because they wouldnt treat their homes like it.

You deserve a medal :t: but i disagree with your last sentence, My home is a shithole !

Andy.

 

[MJB]

What really annoys me is they way people treat hides. I look after 3 hides as a volunteer and frequently i find the entrance gates left open, the doors left open, the flaps left open, dirty tissues on the floor, lunch wrappings on the floor etc etc. After 4 years of cleaning up after others your tolerance levels do drop. It's odd that people cant close flaps, doors or pick up their litter etc because they wouldnt treat their homes like it.

Simon,
Re your last point, social welfare workers and pretty well any landlord would disagree with your last conclusion.:-C:-C:-C
MJB

 

[Keith Fackrell]

It's not the conversation or the children. The big concern is the birders with expensive kit banging about. I always thought one should be quiet while watching birds and other wildlife.

 

[Hanno]

I, on the other hand, would really like to meet (almost) non-existant birders in the non-existant hides here in Cambodia once in a while. Some people on this forum seem to have very low tolerance levels it appears to me, but then I have never been in a hide in the UK. From the descriptions, it would appear that every hide has 35 photographers, all with tripods and 600mm lenses, 27 digiscopers (tripods, gear, huge scopes), 2-3 primary school classes on outings, a bunch of football club supporters with Vuvuzuelas (sp.), a couple of nymphomaniacs, and a Tupperware party. This all in a hide knee-deep in trash. Apart from the fact that hides over there must be enormous, I'd have probably given up birding long time ago (though the nymphomaniacs are tempting.....)

 

[Steve Babbs]

Sadly, nymphomaniacs are rare; unless you bring your own

 

[Adam W]

And why can a camera not be used in single-shot mode...

To be fair one of the biggest advantages of digital cameras is the fact you can quickly rattle off several shots giving you a much better chance of getting a decent shot. Many a time i've fired off 50 or 100 shots at a bird only to find that the very last one is the best one or fired off a quick burst only to find you captured exactly the right shot that you'd never have been quick enough to get with a single shot.

I understand how a hide full of big lenses can be annoying to someone who has no interest in photography and i'm sure there some selfish photographers out there who show no consideration for others but it seems to be becoming increasingly popular to just slag off all photographers all the time for no good reason.

 

[Robin Edwards]

So much intolerance considering we are hopefully all having a common interest in the Birds. Why if an individual's behaviour in a hide is deemed offensive, don't you challenge that individual at the time ? Or perhaps you do and it hasn't worked ? I don't expect it to always work, but at least give it a try.

As a birder and bird-photographer I would certainly challenge any type of
offender if I found their presence so offensive as some of you seem to find photographers (Tossers?) in the bird hides you frequent ?

There will always be those in any walk of life who don't give a monkey's about respecting their environment or other people. I get the feeling though that some who have posted on this thread probably "hide behind the curtains" when you're out and then get back to BF and have a whinge about some guy with a camera, a pager, a child, a wife or something that in some way breaks the silence which we don't have a right to expect in a public space.

 

[Simon Wates]

This is such a British thread!

 

[angusmcoatup]

I, on the other hand, would really like to meet (almost) non-existant birders in the non-existant hides here in Cambodia once in a while. Some people on this forum seem to have very low tolerance levels it appears to me, but then I have never been in a hide in the UK. From the descriptions, it would appear that every hide has 35 photographers, all with tripods and 600mm lenses, 27 digiscopers (tripods, gear, huge scopes), 2-3 primary school classes on outings, a bunch of football club supporters with Vuvuzuelas (sp.), a couple of nymphomaniacs, and a Tupperware party. This all in a hide knee-deep in trash. Apart from the fact that hides over there must be enormous, I'd have probably given up birding long time ago (though the nymphomaniacs are tempting.....)

Hanno, you've just described an average day in a London Wetland centre hide, apart from the nymphomaniacs and the trash.
Not that I'm knocking the place, pretty amazing what they've achieved so close to the centre of London.
I think the problem is some of us aren't cut out for sharing public hides on popular reserves, so should either grit our teeth and bear it or continue to explore the wild blue yonder where a bit of fieldcraft comes in handy as it was in ye olden times.

 

[stevo]

If they occupied one space on a bench while using a hide clamp it wouldn't be an issue. Its the big tripods (plural, since DSLR users seem to flock) taking up the floor/bench/window space of several persons. And why can a camera not be used in single-shot mode...

It`s not the photographers fault if people can`t be bothered to get up early enough to get in a hide before it fills up.

Steve.

 

[Simon Taylor]

Whilst the photographers are peeing off others in the hides they are are not encroaching the nest sites of White tailed Sea Eagles on Mull.... :t:

 

[Farnboro John]

To be fair one of the biggest advantages of digital cameras is the fact you can quickly rattle off several shots giving you a much better chance of getting a decent shot. Many a time i've fired off 50 or 100 shots at a bird only to find that the very last one is the best one or fired off a quick burst only to find you captured exactly the right shot that you'd never have been quick enough to get with a single shot.

I understand how a hide full of big lenses can be annoying to someone who has no interest in photography and i'm sure there some selfish photographers out there who show no consideration for others but it seems to be becoming increasingly popular to just slag off all photographers all the time for no good reason.

That's what I think I dragged out of Bubbs by eliciting not just one but a series of diatribes, Adam: he couldn't explain his dislike of photographers, he wouldn't concede that not all photographers are alike, and it clearly never crossed his mind that some photographers might be birders first and photographers second. He just sees a big lens and automatically goes raving mad. By implication he also assumes a superiority over photographers because his way of birding is the right one!

Incidentally this must be the first time I've ever agreed with you!

John

 

[beakgeek]

I dislike people in blinds with flatulence that scares birds, and those that breath in air which deprives the birds of needed oxygen. Also, people in blinds assuming that camera equates bad, binoculars equates good. Never mind that Avian Conservation was my area of specialization in college, since I have a camera I am obviously more concerned with pictures than the birds welfare.

 

[Bowland Birders]

So much intolerance considering we are hopefully all having a common interest in the Birds. Why if an individual's behaviour in a hide is deemed offensive, don't you challenge that individual at the time ? Or perhaps you do and it hasn't worked ? I don't expect it to always work, but at least give it a try.

As a birder and bird-photographer I would certainly challenge any type of
offender if I found their presence so offensive as some of you seem to find photographers (Tossers?) in the bird hides you frequent ?

There will always be those in any walk of life who don't give a monkey's about respecting their environment or other people. I get the feeling though that some who have posted on this thread probably "hide behind the curtains" when you're out and then get back to BF and have a whinge about some guy with a camera, a pager, a child, a wife or something that in some way breaks the silence which we don't have a right to expect in a public space.

:clap:

 

[AlphaCentauri]

and those that breath in air which deprives the birds of needed oxygen.

:t:

 

[Simon Taylor]

I dislike people in blinds with flatulence that scares birds, and those that breath in air which deprives the birds of needed oxygen. Also, people in blinds assuming that camera equates bad, binoculars equates good. Never mind that Avian Conservation was my area of specialization in college, since I have a camera I am obviously more concerned with pictures than the birds welfare.

Blinds???